Ceramic Hybrid Bearing Questions.

[JacobK]

I just had a few questions regarding ceramic hybrid bearings. I personally have a set of boca orange seals in one of my curado 200e7's and a set of HP bearings abec 7's in another.

Now my questions are do you prefer to run them shielded or unshielded and lubed or dry? and your reasons why please! thanks in advance.

[BassThumb]

I run unshielded HP ceramic hybrid and stainless ABEC 7 bearings in my Shimano reels. I don't think there is enough of a difference in quality to justify the price difference($15 vs. 30). The SS ones are almost as good, IMO. I have never tried running them dry. Now I'm curious if there would be any difference.

[Delaware Valley Tackle]

I suggest running the OSC bearings open. I always flush and spin test eny bearing prior to installation. You can run them dry for optimum free spool. If you find the spool hard to manage a single drop of light oil will tame them a bit. Oil viscosity and amount can be used to fine tune your setup.

[J Francho]

You can get ABEC 7 Ceramic Hybrids with steel shields. That's what I would use, IF I was to upgrade/replace a bearing. Let's also recognize the distinction between bearing shields and seals. They are two different animals. Over lube a sealed bearing, and you will have performance issues. Expose a bearing with no seals to certain conditions, and you will have early failure.

[.ghoti.]

I bought one set of ceramic 7's. Had them in the reel for one day, made about ten casts dry, than about ten casts after oiling, and retired the reel for the remainder of that trip. I removed them and sold them, at a loss, to a friend. I can't stand the noise they make, dry or lubed. I will never buy another set.

I bought 6 sets of SS 7's from big green fish. Good bearings and very fast response from bgf.

I wish I had bought just one set to try first. There's not enough difference to justify the cost as far as I'm concerned. Sure, they spin more freely and you'll see an impressive free spool spin time, but, in actual use, there's little to justify the expense.

My policy now is to buy SS 7's when, and if, I need a replacement spool bearing. There is absolutely no need to pay the extra cost for 7's for any other bearing than spool bearings. None of the other bearings in your reels spins fast enough to justify anything higher than 3's.

Now that I have went off on a tangent, I'll answer your original question.

I remove the shields for cleaning, if I can. I leave one shield off after cleaning to facilitate future cleanings. I have all Daiwa baitcasters. The brake side spool bearing is so small that removing the shields is difficult, so when I get one off, I leave it off. I've also started leaving one shield off the other spool bearing. It just speeds up the servicing process.

When I install the cleaned and lubed bearings I put them in so the shield is toward the spool. This keeps the unshielded side more protected from the elements.

As far as lubing ceramics goes, they are noisy when lubed. They are unbearable when run dry. I know some have reported performance gains when running the bearings dry. If you can stand the noise, you might try it.

I, personally have a hard time believing that anything spinning that fast is OK, long term, running unlubricated. The ceramic ball can only spin at one speed. When rotating the outer race is moving faster than the inner race. The ball is in contact with both surfaces. So what speed is the ball spinning? Not both. It has to slip. Having a very hard surface(ceramic) sliding on a hard surface(stainless) is going to cause wear. It only gets worse if running without some kind of lube.

[JacobK]

I'm running both dry and unshielded/sealed right now. I don't mind the sound it makes because I'm only making short pitches with them. I also like the fact that line peels off a bit easier when free spooled so I don't have to peel line like a mad man to get my lure to do a vertical drop.

I guess it's kind of like the noise that braid makes on recoil guides, some people like it, some hate it and others just don't care.

[J Francho]

When rotating the outer race is moving faster than the inner race. The ball is in contact with both surfaces. So what speed is the ball spinning? Not both. It has to slip.

You might want to check the geometry there. The first statement is correct, but the second is not. But yeah, no lube always bothered me too. The only slipping is the ball in the cages, not the two races.

[BassThumb]

Ceramic bearings are pretty noisy and annoying. They are most useful in reels used for pitching or short roll casts, IMO. Other than the noise, it's not easy to notice any difference between the ceramic and SS ABEC 7 on long casts. It's more obvious when it comes to pitching. The line comes off much easier, so pitches tend to be longer and stay closer to the water.

[.ghoti.]

You might want to check the geometry there. The first statement is correct, but the second is not. But yeah, no lube always bothered me too. The only slipping is the ball in the cages, not the two races.

I do not have to check the geometry. I do have to state the problem correctly. The outer race does not move, the inner race does. The diameter of the balls give two diameter dimensions.

Let's use a 5X10X4 spool bearing for example.

The surface of the outer race the ball rides on will be a bit smaller than 10 and the surface of the inner race the ball rides on will be a bit more than 5, but we can use 5 and 10 for purposes of illustration.

In one revolution the inner surface of the ball will travel over a distance of 15.7mm.

In one revolution the outer surface of the ball will travel over a distance of 31.4mm.

This means either the outside of the ball is spinning faster than the inside of the ball, or, one or both surfaces are slipping on the races.

[J Francho]

Sorry ghoti, you are wrong on this one. Put a pen on the desk. Put a book on top of the pen, parallel to the desk. The desk and the book can move independently of each other. The pen is the bearing. That is why ball bearings work. The inner race and outer race move independently of each other. There is NO slippage. The surface area that the ball touches on each race is ALWAYS equal, irrespective of diameter. If there was slippage, the concept would not work. Think about it.

This is veering way off topic, though. You can call me at home if you want to debate it more brotha.

[Delaware Valley Tackle]

IMO the accuracy gained by easier casting is what makes it all worthwhile. Any added distance is icing.

[BassThumb]

IMO the accuracy gained by easier casting is what makes it all worthwhile. Any added distance is icing.

Very true. This was an unexpected benefit to spool bearing upgrades.