Angler success : 99 % location/ 1% everything else???

[Fish Chris]

Location is certainly VERY important...... But I think 99% to 1% everything else, is a bit skewed..... Unless you were using that loosely, just to make a point.

BTW, I am NOT one of those guys that will just blindly fish down a bank, covering a ton of water. Instead, I have put together big fish routs, with several key spots, that I will put 95% of my fishing efforts into fishing.

So, you don't even have to ask me if I think location is important

Peace,

Fish

[SENKOSAM]

The original question:

Is knowing the seasonal locations of fish attracting structure in lake X far more important than the search lures or other equipment you use?

Chris, that's one way to look at it - both factors are on a sliding scale or in other words:

On some days fish are more active and predictable and therefore location trumps lure and presentation selection (spring - fish shallow and easy targets).

On other days, the only way you can get a reflex bite is with luck, with lures and presentations being as important as having a general knowledge of the lake or river locations(summer doldrums).

Knowledge of dead water areas (maybe 75% or more of the bottom?) saves time getting casting practice. 

Good point.

[slonezp]

Knowledge of dead water areas (maybe 75% or more of the bottom?) saves time getting casting practice.

Very important info when tournament fishing. Being knowledgable enough to eliminate non-productive water is as important if not more than finding water holding fish. Look at it as time management.

[MFBAB]

When you don't have a clue, the simple solution

is to fish points and around grass. Regardless of

how heavily these obvious spots get hammered,

they (almost) always hold a few fish.

8-)

This is close to my general strategy.  By choosing to start by targeting "points", or whatever you deem to be the prominent structure feature of your lake, you can essentially eliminate 90% of the water right out of the box.  By running points you can then systematically present a variety of baits in a smaller amount of water, covering the water column from top to bottom until you figure out a consistent presentation.  Then just replicate that depth/speed/structure combo all day.

As relates to the original question, if points are holding fish that day but I decide to only drag a c-rig on points all day, what happens if the fish are feeding on shad?  I'm in the right location but presenting under them.  If I throw a rig and then a crankbait and then a topwater or whatever it takes to cover the water column, I find out how they are feeding that day a lot faster

[SENKOSAM]

As relates to the original question, if points are holding fish that day but I decide to only drag a c-rig on points all day, what happens if the fish are feeding on shad?

Fine tuning to a productive presentation may be tough if you're not sure fish are present and feeding, but sometimes I guess faith in an area is all you got after 3 hours of no bites. Too often I'm guilty of not trying different lures or presentations after the first attempt and moving on. Call be skeptical but I usually assume that if fish were present, they were either completely turned off or at least bothered by my pestering.

How often does a secondary or tertiary presentation work for you in the same area after not getting even a nibble on the first try?

In tournament fishing, maybe that's the drawback with milk runs - anglers run & gun spots without giving them a chance with a secondary presentation with a different lure, different size lure or slowing down. My usual assumption is that I've cast to dead water after I got no hits with the same lure and that it's time to move on.

[MFBAB]

On that point pattern above, I'm not really talking about camping on an area for 3 hours.  More like hit a primary, work it 15 minutes or so with several baits, then hit a secondary, etc...Before long, you should have an idea of whether they are shallow, deep or inbetween and also whether they are in the creeks or on the main lake points, you just eliminate water (in this case the miles of straight banks in between points)to speed up that process.  Once you figure out the general depth and speed, you can start looking for structure or cover anywhere in that depth and try to replicate your pattern on it. 

[BlackBass19]

Alright we have established that you need to be on fish to catch fish regardless of technique, lures, etc.

When fishing a new body of water how do you go about finding fish? Let's assume it's March and that puts all of us in the pre/early spawn time frame. 

In order to gauge a pattern what three or four structural elements will you be looking for (vegetation beds, humps, flats, timber, etc.) and at what depth ranges do you want to find these items.

Sorry to hijack the thread was heading this way...

[Lund Explorer]

Alright we have established that you need to be on fish to catch fish regardless of technique, lures, etc.

When fishing a new body of water how do you go about finding fish? Let's assume it's March and that puts all of us in the pre/early spawn time frame.

In order to gauge a pattern what three or four structural elements will you be looking for (vegetation beds, humps, flats, timber, etc.) and at what depth ranges do you want to find these items.

Sorry to hijack the thread was heading this way...

I don't think you hijacked it, you just took it in the direction it needed to go sooner or later.  Because in my opinion, the idea that location is 99% of the game doesn't allow for enough left for the other remaining aspects. 

Earlier, I stated that success comes about through a combination of three parts.  This theory was put forth many years ago by the staff of In-Fisherman, and is the best explanation I've ever heard.  So in trying to answer your question regarding location, I'll ask you a few questions.

What are the bass looking for at this time of year?

That should be fairly easy.  Understanding that bass have three main instincts that dominate their life, Food, Shelter, and Reproduction, can narrow your search.  In this instance, pre-spawn is going to tell you that the bass will be staging somewhere near spawning areas on the lake you are looking at.

What kind of lake are you going to fish on?

The second part of this puzzle lays in the type of lake that you are targeting.  It would do little good to try to fish a midwestern natural eutrophic lake using tactics suited to a southern impoundment.  You can't follow creek channels into spawning coves on a lake that was formed without any creek channels in it.  So after you have learned of the habits of the bass, you need to learn as much about the various types of lakes, rivers, or impoundments there are, and the types of structure and cover you will find on these types of waters.

By combining your knowledge of the bass' seasonal needs and how these fish will relate to current conditions, you should be able to determine what types of structure or cover they will be focused on given those same seasons and conditions.  Once you have these two factors figured out, you come to the final question.

What baits should I use?

Almost every bait you can buy on the market will catch fish at some point in time, while very few will catch fish all of the time.  You need to think about the first two aspects of this effort to figure out which bait completes your entire plan for success.  If the season and conditions tell you that the bass will be actively feeding, then you should focus on baits that give you the best chance to quickly take advantage of this.  Conversely, if conditions tell you that most fish will be suffering from a case of lockjaw, then you will need to focus your efforts with baits that work better for neutral or negative bass.

So now taking all of this into consideration, I'll tackle your challenge of facing a new lake.  It doesn't matter if it's March, July, or December.  I should be able to look at what the bass are doing based on the season, I should understand the attributes of the type of lake it is, and taking current conditions into mind, I should be able to find fish and determine what type of mood they will most likely be in.

Case in point - Kentucky Lake and the upcoming Roadtrip.  I have only been on that lake once in my life.  I was 13 years old, and we fished for nothing but crappie.  Now I'm getting ready to go there this spring to fish for bass.  The lake is huge by the standards of the lakes I normally fish.  But I have confidence that I can catch fish down there.  I won't do as well as the guys who fish it all the time, but I should avoid the skunk.  This is because I know the fish I'm going after, I have fished impoundments like it before, and I know what the season is.  The challenges I will face are going to be based on the actual conditions for the time I'm there, and what baits I'll need to throw to maximize my chances based on the fishes mood.

I'm sorry this is so long, but I don't know how to explain it any other way.  It's F + L + P = Success.

[Catt]

Alright we have established that you need to be on fish to catch fish regardless of technique, lures, etc.

When fishing a new body of water how do you go about finding fish? Let's assume it's March and that puts all of us in the pre/early spawn time frame.

In order to gauge a pattern what three or four structural elements will you be looking for (vegetation beds, humps, flats, timber, etc.) and at what depth ranges do you want to find these items.

Sorry to hijack the thread was heading this way...

Understand what the primary prey species in your lake is and how that species relates to structure with each changing season...morning, noon, and night.

Locate prime structure, interpret it (find break lines), and then figure how fish it effectively (lure selection & presentation).

Next is timing; just because you didn't get bite does not mean the bass aren't there or you tied on the wrong lure. Some times it's a morning bite sometimes it's an afternoon bite.

[Team9nine]

A lot depends on what your overall expectations are. In other words, are you just talking about a regular old fishing trip where you're trying to catch bass of any size, or do you have the tournament mentality that you're after 5 of the best quality in the lake? If the former, location becomes a considerably smaller percent of the equation and probably isn't even primary. If the latter, then location takes on a much greater significance.

-T9

[5bass]

When fishing a new body of water how do you go about finding fish? Let's assume it's March and that puts all of us in the pre/early spawn time frame.

Find the baitfish first, then move to the first available cover or structure you can find. Fish the depth zone that the baitfish are using with a bait you can keep in that zone for the maximum amount of time.

It could be different in other places but overthe years I've learned that until the water hits 50 or so, the bass generally hang around the baitfish more than anything else. Because of this, I have zero confidence in an area that has no bait this time of year (sub 50 water temps)

[5bass]

Case in point - Kentucky Lake and the upcoming Roadtrip. I'm getting ready to go there this spring to fish for bass. The lake is huge by the standards of the lakes I normally fish. But I have confidence that I can catch fish down there. I won't do as well as the guys who fish it all the time, but I should avoid the skunk.

You dont have to worry about getting skunked on Kentucky Lake. There's so many bass in that place it aint even funny....and they feed right often. 

[SENKOSAM]

Lund Explorer, I hope you have a good map of the lake that includes detailed depth changes, old road beds, rock walls, stump field, etc. (if any).

Bait fish aren't always in areas you expect them to be and many times bass just hang out, not  immune to a well placed lure (pads, tree limbs, boulder). I fished a large deep reservoir last fall with someone who usually can pattern fish, but not that day. We ended up catching one fish per spot, spots located 100-200 yards from each other. Sonar showed schools of bait fish in open water near drops, but no larger fish beneath them. All fish caught were next to shore near cover (a tree, weed pile-ups and in a shallow weed bed). To top it off, the water was clear with temperature in the upper 40's and a 0-10 mph wind was blowing. (no wind at 7am).

It's always nice to be able to pattern fish, but there are too many days where I've run into one spot/one fish.

[kikstand454]

Alright we have established that you need to be on fish to catch fish regardless of technique, lures, etc.

When fishing a new body of water how do you go about finding fish? Let's assume it's March and that puts all of us in the pre/early spawn time frame.

In order to gauge a pattern what three or four structural elements will you be looking for (vegetation beds, humps, flats, timber, etc.) and at what depth ranges do you want to find these items.

Sorry to hijack the thread was heading this way...

I don't think you hijacked it, you just took it in the direction it needed to go sooner or later. Because in my opinion, the idea that location is 99% of the game doesn't allow for enough left for the other remaining aspects.

Earlier, I stated that success comes about through a combination of three parts. This theory was put forth many years ago by the staff of In-Fisherman, and is the best explanation I've ever heard. So in trying to answer your question regarding location, I'll ask you a few questions.

What are the bass looking for at this time of year?

That should be fairly easy. Understanding that bass have three main instincts that dominate their life, Food, Shelter, and Reproduction, can narrow your search. In this instance, pre-spawn is going to tell you that the bass will be staging somewhere near spawning areas on the lake you are looking at.

What kind of lake are you going to fish on?

The second part of this puzzle lays in the type of lake that you are targeting. It would do little good to try to fish a midwestern natural eutrophic lake using tactics suited to a southern impoundment. You can't follow creek channels into spawning coves on a lake that was formed without any creek channels in it. So after you have learned of the habits of the bass, you need to learn as much about the various types of lakes, rivers, or impoundments there are, and the types of structure and cover you will find on these types of waters.

By combining your knowledge of the bass' seasonal needs and how these fish will relate to current conditions, you should be able to determine what types of structure or cover they will be focused on given those same seasons and conditions. Once you have these two factors figured out, you come to the final question.

What baits should I use?

Almost every bait you can buy on the market will catch fish at some point in time, while very few will catch fish all of the time. You need to think about the first two aspects of this effort to figure out which bait completes your entire plan for success. If the season and conditions tell you that the bass will be actively feeding, then you should focus on baits that give you the best chance to quickly take advantage of this. Conversely, if conditions tell you that most fish will be suffering from a case of lockjaw, then you will need to focus your efforts with baits that work better for neutral or negative bass.

So now taking all of this into consideration, I'll tackle your challenge of facing a new lake. It doesn't matter if it's March, July, or December. I should be able to look at what the bass are doing based on the season, I should understand the attributes of the type of lake it is, and taking current conditions into mind, I should be able to find fish and determine what type of mood they will most likely be in.

Case in point - Kentucky Lake and the upcoming Roadtrip. I have only been on that lake once in my life. I was 13 years old, and we fished for nothing but crappie. Now I'm getting ready to go there this spring to fish for bass. The lake is huge by the standards of the lakes I normally fish. But I have confidence that I can catch fish down there. I won't do as well as the guys who fish it all the time, but I should avoid the skunk. This is because I know the fish I'm going after, I have fished impoundments like it before, and I know what the season is. The challenges I will face are going to be based on the actual conditions for the time I'm there, and what baits I'll need to throw to maximize my chances based on the fishes mood.

I'm sorry this is so long, but I don't know how to explain it any other way. It's F + L + P = Success.

x2.

knowledge and versatility can trump local knowledge regularly.

take a look at major tournements... esp those of the b.a.s.s. elite or F.l.w pro tour and you will see that RARELY does the "home angler" win. i think local knowledge gives you an upperhand in sudden game changing scenarios... but for the most part the advantage tops out at a good chance of at least being in the money.

if you fish a body of water regularly then you know that even the "hot" spots can skunk people or not have the weight to win a tourney. you know that even within a certain season the fish change mood day to day...hour to hour even. and certainly from one week to the next.

knowing how to figure out the puzzle is much more productive than having "spots". this is why kvd could come to your home lake and outfish its best guide more times than not. wheather hes been on it or not.

[silvercliff_46]

It's not just being on fish, it's being on active fish.  No one south of the ice belt can truly understand what negative attitude is in a fish, until you fish them below 30-40" of ice.  I have gone out with a very sensitive ice fishing narrow coned fish finder, AND a camera.  I have found tightly schooled fish stacked like cord wood, yet using several presentations still drew blanks.  On one occasion we did manage to take three crappies by bouncing the jig on their heads until they finally grabbed the micro jig.

Isn't it great that with all our electronic equipment, all the acquired knowlege, the fish can still stump us. ;D

[Lund Explorer]

Case in point - Kentucky Lake and the upcoming Roadtrip. I'm getting ready to go there this spring to fish for bass. The lake is huge by the standards of the lakes I normally fish. But I have confidence that I can catch fish down there. I won't do as well as the guys who fish it all the time, but I should avoid the skunk.

You dont have to worry about getting skunked on Kentucky Lake. There's so many bass in that place it aint even funny....and they feed right often.

Oh, I'm sure I'll catch fish.  Seeing as how Deb has said she plans on beating us like a tribe full of redheaded stepkids, the only question is who will come in second!   ;D

[Lund Explorer]

Lund Explorer, I hope you have a good map of the lake that includes detailed depth changes, old road beds, rock walls, stump field, etc. (if any).

Bait fish aren't always in areas you expect them to be and many times bass just hang out, not immune to a well placed lure (pads, tree limbs, boulder). I fished a large deep reservoir last fall with someone who usually can pattern fish, but not that day. We ended up catching one fish per spot, spots located 100-200 yards from each other. Sonar showed schools of bait fish in open water near drops, but no larger fish beneath them. All fish caught were next to shore near cover (a tree, weed pile-ups and in a shallow weed bed). To top it off, the water was clear with temperature in the upper 40's and a 0-10 mph wind was blowing. (no wind at 7am).

It's always nice to be able to pattern fish, but there are too many days where I've run into one spot/one fish.

I'm all set as Long Mike got me a really nice map of the lake, and I've spent quite a bit of time looking it over.  My Lowrance GPS also has good mapping that I'll have with me on the water.  I've kind of laid out a plan in my head, but will wait until I actually see what the conditions are before I see if it needs changing.  From reading about the prior road trip, it sounds like the weather could be a big factor.  Just part of the game I guess.

I can tell you one thing though.  From the looks of the place, I plan to fish most of these coves just like they are their own seperate lakes, all connected by a river.  The basis of the plan is "Old & Slow" with me as the former and the boat as the latter.  Once I make it into one of these coves, I'll pick my way though the entire place before moving on. 

One spot/one bass?  I can remember a time when it seemed like those darn fish should have called vitamin bass.... One - A - Day!    ;D 

Fortunately I haven't suffered from too many of those days lately.  If it is boils down to only one fish per/spot, I suppose I'll need 30+ spots then huh?