World records live VS. artificial????

[tyrius.]

The misconception that live bait catches more is unreal.

If you feel really confident with that response, than next time you and a buddy go fishing, put a bet on who will catch the most fish. You use artificial and let the other person use live bait. At the end of the day, YOU WILL be paying the other person money. I say this because I have fished side by side people that have very little fishing experience using live bait while I throw artificial. In every case I was out fished.

George is a very successful guide on Stick Marsh in Florida.  So, he knows what he's talking about.  If live bait caught more fish then he'd push people to use live bait.  Instead, I think, he uses a TON of senkos, swim senkos, and traps.

[George Welcome]

The whole live bait, artificial bait discussion has been hammered to death and will continue to be so.

However, the record is listed as world record, not restricted to just the north American continent. So the conversation of northern bass and southern bass is purely academic.

[WRB]

The heaviest NLMB that I know of is 16 lbs 4 oz, Mallard lake, Arkansas state record. There are at least 75 FLMB that exceed 17 lbs., 12 over 20 lbs. If the Perry bass weighed 22 lbs 4 oz., it was a FLMB strain.

WRB

Didn't have to be: could have been an F1 (intergrade) If it was Florida strain it was transplanted one.

George, the F1 or F35 is still a Florida strain if the lateral line pore scales exceed 66. The F in F1 = Florida strain. Don't get carried away with the "pure" Florida strain, we may not have any "pure" Florida strains outside of central Florida anymore. With all the bass water flowing north from Jacksonville, it's not a strecth to think interprizing anglers transplanted FLMB into Georgia. We planted NLMB into California back in the late 1890's and FLMB in 1959.

My heaviest northern strain LMB was caught by in 1971 at lake Casitas and weighs 12 lbs 4 oz. I also caught a 18 lb 11 oz FLMB from the same lake in 1981, in fact with the same type hair jig off the same point.

I'm just as proud of the 12 lb 4 oz NLMB as the 18 lb 11 oz FLMB because they are about equal trophy size bass.

Both these bass are nearly the same length; 27 1/2" NLMB and 28" FLMB, the 6 lb difference is in the body girth! NLMB & FLMB are different bass.

WRB

No, the "F" stands for "filial." F1 is filial 1, or generation one in not so correct but simpler terms.

Stand corrected.

I don't agree that a bass with a fine scale count  (69 to 73 pore scales) that grows 25%+ heavier in the exact same lakes (northern strain 59 to 65 pore scales) can be considered the same largemouth bass. The two sub species are easy to identify and the IGFA should recognize the differences, IMO.

Whatever; B.A.S.S. is announcing the IGFA decision on the Kurita FLMB tomorrow, 8 Jan 2010.

We can go on and on, lets just agree to disagree and continue to pursue catching bass with lures or live bait is the anglers choice.

WRB

[I Love BassResource]

Look here brotherman I guarantee you I can take a fluke and imitate a real shad, or for that matter take a pointer and have a whole school of bait following it, IT LOOKS LIKE A BAITFISH

Baitfish will follow a lot of things. That doesn't mean that what they are following truly immitates a baitfish. You can get baitfish to follow a spinnerbait, a jig (swimming), even swimming a worm. So, you're point isn't really accurate.

and as dick wrote, you are throwing livebait and holding on, Why else would we buy our kids minners and worms at the local bait shop going to the lake so they will have an improved chance at catching something. So with that being said Ima say there should be a split between records with livebait and with artificial. Cause lets face it livebait is so easy a Caveman can do it!!!!!!!!!

Again, this whole discussion has nothing to do with loading the boat with dinks. We're talking about catching a record fish.

And the current pending world record was caught on??? Live bait....

My neighbor heads to Toho every Feb for largemouth. Every single guide they have ever hired and ever 10+ bass that his group has ever brought back, came from using shiners.

Sadly enough I know this because he has 4 of them mounted...

[WRB]

I have been on both sides of the live bait fishing for bass issue. During the 60's and 70's I fished with every type of legal live bait because that was how trophy bass fisherman fished back then. Live waterdogs (tiger salamanders), crawdads and golden shiners where legal live bait in CA, and very effective baits fished properly. It became obvious to me that we were destroying our trophy bass fisheries by over harvesting big bass using live bait. SoCal bass lakes are small, most under 2,000 acres and hundreds of bass fisherman using live bait everyday had a major impact of the bass population.

I  made a personal decision to stop fishing with live bait after catch several hundred 10+ bass, releasing all that were healthy. Today, 40 years later, my belief that live bait fishing still harms trophy bass populations hasn't changed in regards to small lakes.

However, today fewer bass fisherman fish with live bait, other than guides who fish for a living. The average bass angler fishes with lures.

I still believe that bed fishing isn't good for any fishery, especially using live bait.

I have caught a lot of giant bass on lures over the past 40 years but would have caught a lot more using live bait. That was my choice and it was right for me.

[Dr Pigg]

I have been on both sides of the live bait fishing for bass issue. During the 60's and 70's I fished with every type of legal live bait because that was how trophy bass fisherman fished back then. Live waterdogs (tiger salamanders), crawdads and golden shiners where legal live bait in CA, and very effective baits fished properly. It became obvious to me that we were destroying our trophy bass fisheries by over harvesting big bass using live bait. SoCal bass lakes are small, most under 2,000 acres and hundreds of bass fisherman using live bait everyday had a major impact of the bass population.

I made a personal decision to stop fishing with live bait after catch several hundred 10+ bass, releasing all that were healthy. Today, 40 years later, my belief that live bait fishing still harms trophy bass populations hasn't changed in regards to small lakes.

However, today fewer bass fisherman fish with live bait, other than guides who fish for a living. The average bass angler fishes with lures.

I still believe that bed fishing isn't good for any fishery, especially using live bait.

I have caught a lot of giant bass on lures over the past 40 years but would have caught a lot more using live bait. That was my choice and it was right for me.

  On a thread several days ago, alot of ya'll listed the pros you would like to spend the day with....  WRB is still my pick!  He's forgotten more than most pros today KNOW  8-) 8-)

[D4u2s0t]

I really dislike these conversations...

that being said, i've OFTEN outfished people using live while I was using artificials... It doesn't always give you the edge. You still have to know where to throw your bait, how to detect a subtle bite, how to keep a fish on the line, etc. If you can't outfish someone who has no fishing experience, maybe you need to work on your presentations instead of knocking live bait. (I don't use live bait, except for panfish)

If live bait and artificial should have it's own title, so should shore fishing, people that don't use depthfinders, people that don't use expensive equipment, etc. You say it's "easy" to catch a big fish on live bait? go catch a world record, and let us know how "easy" it was.

2 people can be fishing the same spot, with 2 different artificials... Most likely, 1 person will catch more fish. Should that other person not be allowed to use that bait because it gave them an "edge"?

Bottom line is it's all personal preference.  If someone is fishing legally, shouldn't matter what they caught the fish on.

[VABassin'14]

A fish doesn't get to be huge by not being smart. She as seen everything, and has been educated over the years of her life. She knows what is real and what is fake, therefore, using live bait makes a difference because the huge fish knows that your live bait is real food. That is the advantage of using live bait.

[Grey Wolf]

A fish doesn't get to be huge by not being smart. She as seen everything, and has been educated over the years of her life. She knows what is real and what is fake, therefore, using live bait makes a difference because the huge fish knows that your live bait is real food. That is the advantage of using live bait.

What a very simplistic way to approach the issue. If it were all that simple.

[bocraw]

There is nothing that says the IGFA has a monopoly on recognizing record fish.   I think it is fine for BASS, Bass Resource, or any other organization to have their own records.  My fishing clubs tracks records and for all bass we use artificial only.  For saltwater fish we separate the categories into "all tackle", "artificial only", and "fly rod". 

[SirSnookalot]

IGFA has line class records, why not one for artificial vs. live bait?

I agree, separate records for live vs bait also line classes as well. The Japanese record was caught using 25# line fighting the fish for a mere 3 minutes.   No denying the record and the fact it's a huge fish but catching that fish using lighter line and tackle would be a lot more impressive to me, would have he landed it on a fly rod?

It's not always what you catch but how you catch it.

[RoLo]

Perish The Thought

The IGFA has met great difficulty in trying to determine whether a record fish is authentic or not,

and great difficulty trying to determine whose in first place and whose in second place.

We certainly don't want to burden them with having to verify whether a record fish

was caught on an artificial lure, natural bait or an artificial lure tipped with natural bait  :

Roger

[George Welcome]

IGFA has line class records, why not one for artificial vs. live bait?

I agree, separate records for live vs bait also line classes as well. The Japanese record was caught using 25# line fighting the fish for a mere 3 minutes. No denying the record and the fact it's a huge fish but catching that fish using lighter line and tackle would be a lot more impressive to me, would have he landed it on a fly rod?

It's not always what you catch but how you catch it.

Would have probably stressed the fish to the point of extreme exhaustion and killed it.

[WRB]

Bass fight hard for a very short time period and do not have sustained energy to continue fighting longer than a few minutes. A long run for a LMB is about 50 feet; bass rely on making quick turns to capture prey or escape other predators.

The IGFA already has line weight and fly fishing world record categories. The all tackle world record is the Kurita/Perry record.

WRB

[swilly78]

No.