Mattlures Posted April 19, 2009 Posted April 19, 2009 No Shanner the pic is not Perry period. There is no suggestion. It is simply not him. Shoadows etc. that is a differnt man and that is undisputed. It simply is not Perry in that picture. FACT.
George Welcome Posted April 19, 2009 Posted April 19, 2009 Question it if you will but be assured of this: It is the world record according to the keepers of the grail: it will remain the record until someone catches a bigger fish. No amount of discussion is going to change what is now recorded.
SDoolittle Posted April 19, 2009 Posted April 19, 2009 does anyone know what perry caught the fish on?? just curious 8-) A Creek Chub Fintail Shiner. I always thought it was a Creek Chub Wiggle Fish. I guess even that is uncertain.
CatBassin Posted April 19, 2009 Posted April 19, 2009 Triton_Mike, I see how it made a soap opera. I read it more for entertainment than education. But I do see what your'e saying.
ROCbass Posted April 19, 2009 Posted April 19, 2009 No Shanner the pic is not Perry period. There is no suggestion. It is simply not him. Shoadows etc. that is a differnt man and that is undisputed. It simply is not Perry in that picture. FACT. Ok, so its not him. How do you know? were you there when the picture was taken? Who is in the picture if not Perry? The biggest piece of evidence aside from a couple old poor quality photos against it being Perry that I have seen is that his son said his dad didn't smoke. Lots of people quit smoking. I agree that it is extremely likely not Perry, but the evidence that I have seen is far from enough for me to declare it a fact. The fact is I don't know George Perry or anyone else who was alive in Georgia in 1932 from a hole in the ground, and a photo of a man whose face is barely visible is not enough for me to say with 100% certainty who it is or is not, no matter what anyone else says. Then again I tend to be a little more skeptical than most people.
Super User WRB Posted April 19, 2009 Super User Posted April 19, 2009 "The fact that no pictures were taken and that no parts of the fish ever survived the fish fry is telling as well. Perry's fish was probably 13 pounds." Incorrect sir, there was a picture taken, here it is... this fish is a monster. and as far as florida goes, there very well could be a record bass in this state. there are lakes like stick marsh and rodman where they could live and never see a lure. as well as okeechobee, toho, and many others do to there size. Actually the bass looks bigger than it is! The boy would need to be about 5'8", the man around 7'6" for the bass to be 32" long. I would estimate that bass to about a 75 to 80% girth bass, typical for Florida bass in caught Florida. The bass shown is about 14-15 lbs, IMO. What has never added up is George Perry's account of the conditions during the time he caught the bass...stormy rainy weather and didn't get back to weight it until after dark. No one has ever located George's fishing partner, he disappeared and was never interviewed. The Perry bass; 32" long is 3" longer than any bass ever officially recorded, including Dottie the *25.1 lb bass. Back in the day that Perry entered his bass, the only prize was fishing tackle and lures. Authentication wasn't strictly adhered to for fresh water bass contest until nearly 20 years after the catch, when the IGFA decided to list fresh water world records. Whatever the Perry was, it is the official world record, the bench mark to break. WRB *Dottie official length and girth has not been disclosed to date. The 25.1 lb weight was weighed on the anglers digital scale, unofficially. Whatever Dotties weight was when caught last, it was over 21 lbs., was she over 22.25 lbs.??? we will never know.
mattm Posted April 19, 2009 Posted April 19, 2009 Ok, so its not him. How do you know? were you there when the picture was taken? Who is in the picture if not Perry? The biggest piece of evidence aside from a couple old poor quality photos against it being Perry that I have seen is that his son said his dad didn't smoke. Lots of people quit smoking. I agree that it is extremely likely not Perry, but the evidence that I have seen is far from enough for me to declare it a fact. The fact is I don't know George Perry or anyone else who was alive in Georgia in 1932 from a hole in the ground, and a photo of a man whose face is barely visible is not enough for me to say with 100% certainty who it is or is not, no matter what anyone else says. Then again I tend to be a little more skeptical than most people. C'mon it may or may not be Perry's fish, but it isn't Perry. His own family is saying that. The picture isn't so poor that his own family wouldn't recognize him and they all seem to say it isn't him. It really doesn't matter though the picture really doesn't prove anything besides two people are holding a very big fish. Could be anywhere between 13-25 lbs. I doubt the weight personally, but that doesn't matter. Perry did what was required of him at the time and the record is his. Me or anyone else saying it was or isn't the record is just a guess.
mattm Posted April 19, 2009 Posted April 19, 2009 Also I highly doubt what Hannon is saying comes out of jealousy. It's not like he would have the world record if Perry's fish was discounted so what would be his gain? I'm not even a Hannon fan, but don't see what he would have to be jealous of. Imo, it's just his honest opinion.
Super User cart7t Posted April 19, 2009 Super User Posted April 19, 2009 Later that day, Perry and Page took their catch to the general store in nearby Helena, Ga., where the proprietor - a notary public - weighed and certified its dimensions and weight. A customer mentioned a Field & Stream magazine bass contest, and encouraged Perry to enter his fish, which also was weighed and measured on certified scales at the town's post office. So Mr. Perry, Mr. Page, the proprietor of the store the fish was originally taken to, himself a notary and then the Helena postmaster are all liars? Gotcha. ;D
Super User bilgerat Posted April 19, 2009 Author Super User Posted April 19, 2009 Line from my original post: This is sure to stir the pot. Boy, I called that one........
Super User Micro Posted April 19, 2009 Super User Posted April 19, 2009 Let's apply some forensics. The best reference for the length of that fish is the kid standing obliquely next to it. According to the Center for Disease Control - Anthropometric Reference Data For Children and Adults, the average height of a 5 year old is 44.5 inches. I printed out the image and measured the height of the boy and the length of the fish. The fish is 71% of the height of the child. Assuming the child is of average height - 44.5 inches, the bass in the photo is about 31 inches long. Hannon said in his diatribe that the first, nearly 21 lb bass, was 26 inches long. I suggest to you this bass is longer, and have no reason to disbelieve that it weight the claimed 22+ lbs. I say this is Perry's bass, that Perry accurately stated the weight, and overstated the length. Got a better method? Post it. All you guys that catch big fish and hold them way out in front of you to make them look bigger have have done nothing but muck things up. ;D
Randall Posted April 20, 2009 Posted April 20, 2009 Just some thoughts on Perry's fish from my point of view living in GA and fishing some of the best lakes GA has for big bass for the past 15 years. 1. There have been fish caught in GA over 30 inches long. WRB said very few fish have been verified over 30 inches. That's just what you see on the record books since most of those fish are from California. I catch 28-29 fish pretty often and have caught four over 30 inches in just the past few years. Cali fish may have the girth but Georgia fish have plenty of length so it makes a fish threre and here hard to compare in a photo. Add the girth to that length and you have the makings of a huge fish. Looking at the photo of someone holding what could be Perry's fish in front of the post office and comparing it to my 15lb 12oz bass in girth then I believe that fish could have weighed 22 lbs if it was 32 1/2. It looks that big to me comparing it to what a normal Georgia fish looks like in girth. 2. As to comparing what GA has as far as bass today and back then there is no comparison. Trophy bass fishing in GA has been ruined by anglers moving spotted bass from one lake to another and our DNR stocking hybrids and Stripers in almost every lake we have that has Trophy bass potential. So, I can't really judge Perry's fish on what GA produced since his fish. It's a whole different ballgame here now than it was then. 3. As far as the bass in that areas genetics I would guess it to be a FloridaxNorthern. That is pretty common in that area of South Georgia as well as Northern Florida. Some pure Florida strain bass have been brought from South Florida and stocked in ponds here in GA from way back. Many lakes were built over those ponds and now most of what I fish for around Atlanta which is North or Central GA have Florida genetics. There are lakes built way back in the fifties and sixties in extreme North GA that had and have bass with Florida genetics. I going out tomorrow with the hopes I might see a 16lb or 17lb bass on a bed. If I had lived in GA in Perry's time I believe I could have a a good shot at a much larger fish. But, I don't know if Perry's bass was 22lbs. I wasn't there so there is no way for me to know.
etommy28 Posted April 20, 2009 Posted April 20, 2009 randall makes a good point, there was nothing that would compete for food with that fish other than native species then, now there are cichlids, striper hybrids, snakeheads and all kinds of other things... by the way while people talk about the next record bass coming from cali.NEWSFLASH: THOSE ARE MOSTLY FLORIDA STAIN BASS as well as many texas and mexican bass are.
the zone Posted April 20, 2009 Posted April 20, 2009 just to chime in on this, Perry's fish is likely to be a farce. The probability of catching a world record fish in Georgia is relatively low. Especially with the lack of 20+ pound fish to give warrant to such a feet. Notice, i didn't say it was impossible. However, who said a little myth and lore is a bad thing? Texas, California and Mexco are producing. Heck Cuba is a possibility. Who knows? But I like to think that the pig is floating somewhere out there.
Super User Catt Posted April 20, 2009 Super User Posted April 20, 2009 A notary public (or notary or public notary) is a public officer constituted by law to serve the public in non-contentious matters. A notary's main functions are to administer oaths and affirmations, take affidavits and statutory declarations, witness and authenticate the execution of certain classes of documents. The notary would have had to by law witnessed the measurements and weight of the bass before he could apply his stamp of notary to the entry form. Indisputable evidence or not? I think it is
Super User Micro Posted April 20, 2009 Super User Posted April 20, 2009 The Zone, Randall already spoke to that issue. Today ain't the 1930s.
NYfishwow Posted April 20, 2009 Posted April 20, 2009 All you guys that catch big fish and hold them way out in front of you to make them look bigger have have done nothing but muck things up. ;D i agree with bassnajr , in the pic the child is standing behind the fish then side by side, its not accuate measurement. Still it was the golden ticket fish of that time, Perry will have almost a 100 year streak if no one ever breaks his record.
DawsonH Posted April 20, 2009 Posted April 20, 2009 The kid isn't standing far from that fish because of his arm position, also the man holding the fish does not have his arm in a position that would be conductive to holding it closer to the camera. Edit: It also appears to me that the child's left foot is closer to the camera than the fish, and that the man's elbow is closer to the camera than the fish. With the angle of the man's arm holding the fish, it is not possible for it to be held closer to the camera than the boy because his arm is bent back in towards his body. From looking at the feet of the man and the boy you can see that the boy is standing closer to the camera, and it appears to me with his left foot closer than the fish.
Super User SoFlaBassAddict Posted April 20, 2009 Super User Posted April 20, 2009 Gotta love a bass caught so long ago causing such a controversy to this day. For all of the people out there stating that it's a "FACT!!!11" thats it's not Perry in the picture, prove it. On the other side somebody needs to prove it is him. Honestly though, does it really matter now? The record is the record and it will be until somebody lands a bigger fish. Personally I could care less about catching record fish as cool as it would be. I'm sure theres bigger fish floating around some of the remote areas of the world. It wouldn't surprise me if theres a few massive fish floating around in the unmolested parts of the Everglades or some of the swamps up in northern Florida. Nobody will ever know for sure. One day it will be broken and people will be calling whoever the person is that catches it a cheater, lier, etc etc.
mattm Posted April 20, 2009 Posted April 20, 2009 Posted by: Catt Posted on: Today at 9:12pm A notary public (or notary or public notary) is a public officer constituted by law to serve the public in non-contentious matters. A notary's main functions are to administer oaths and affirmations, take affidavits and statutory declarations, witness and authenticate the execution of certain classes of documents. The notary would have had to by law witnessed the measurements and weight of the bass before he could apply his stamp of notary to the entry form. Indisputable evidence or not? I think it is Catt, Please understand that I have no idea what Perry's fish weighed, but you notarty argument holds no water. There are dishonest, naive or imperfect people in all walks of life. The notary could of easily been lying for Perry took his word for it or just made a mistake. We all have heard stories of judges, policemen and doctors that have just as respectable positions that have abused their authority. The notary could of just easily of been spot on and recorded the whole situation correctly. The standards back then were loose and Perry may or may not of benefited from that. Either way the record is what it is and if anyone wants it they know what they have to do. Dottie proved it is possible.
Mattlures Posted April 20, 2009 Posted April 20, 2009 Members of Perry's family have stated that the man in the picture is not George Perry. There is your proof. FACT FACT FACT. plus anybody who is not blind can see it is a different man. arguing against this FACT only makes sombody look unreasonabl and their other arguments loose validity. As for the picture itself. I feel the fish looks big enough that it is in the realm of possability that it is 22.4. I also feel it is possible that that is a picture of Perry's fish. However there still id no proof where that piture was taken and nobody can identify who is in the picture. That picture alone tells me that it was possible that a 22lber existed and that it was caught in GA by Perry. The problem is there are so mant strong arguments against the record being legit. I just dont know. If that were Perry in the Pic that would be good enough for me. It is also possible they found a floater? heck maybe they used dynomite? I highly doubt it but its not impossible. George welcome said it best. The IGFA says its the world record. They keep the records. We all know the weight to beat. like I said before I have accepted the record. I am not sure if I believe it but I accept it. Did you guys know the freashwater hall of fame lists the Trew bass as the world record? I am thankful that the IGFA keeps the records becuase if they didnt kooks like hall of fame would accept anything as a record. quote author=537862707F75786E26222726170 link=1240098315/69#69 date=1240200231]Gotta love a bass caught so long ago causing such a controversy to this day. For all of the people out there stating that it's a "FACT!!!11" thats it's not Perry in the picture, prove it. On the other side somebody needs to prove it is him. Honestly though, does it really matter now? The record is the record and it will be until somebody lands a bigger fish. Personally I could care less about catching record fish as cool as it would be. I'm sure theres bigger fish floating around some of the remote areas of the world. It wouldn't surprise me if theres a few massive fish floating around in the unmolested parts of the Everglades or some of the swamps up in northern Florida. Nobody will ever know for sure. One day it will be broken and people will be calling whoever the person is that catches it a cheater, lier, etc etc.
Super User Catt Posted April 20, 2009 Super User Posted April 20, 2009 Of what benefit would it have been for the notary to lie? The notary simply made a mistake in reading a ruler or weight scales? The standards back then were loose? A pound was still a pound and an inch was still an inch. mattm that's is the silliest argument ever George L. "Dazy" Perry the son of the record holder flatly stated in the ESPN article When I saw the cigarette in the man's mouth, I knew it wasn't my dad because he didn't smoke," Perry said. "I believe the picture was taken by Aunt Mae (the former Lelia Mae Walden who married James Bowen Perry in the early 1930s, according to family records). I don't know who the little boy might be. How much more proof do you need
Super User Micro Posted April 20, 2009 Super User Posted April 20, 2009 The fish in that photo is NOT 20 lbs.+.... You were there and weighed it? i agree with bassnajr , in the pic the child is standing behind the fish then side by side, its not accuate measurement. You must be looking at a different picture than me. Because the kid in the picture I posted is most definitalte standing very close to and beside that bass. Members of Perry's family have stated that the man in the picture is not George Perry. There is your proof. FACT FACT FACT. plus anybody who is not blind can see it is a different man. arguing against this FACT only makes sombody look unreasonabl and their other arguments loose validity. As for the picture itself. I feel the fish looks big enough that it is in the realm of possability that it is 22.4. Matt, stop getting so worked up. You're going to give yourself an aneurysm :-[. Perry's family has stated that's Perry's fishing partner that day. They've also verified that the photo was taken in front of the GA post office where it was weighed. Just like the known photo of Perry. It's a 20+lb fish, even by your standards (and 30+ inches by mine). So it's almost certainly Perry's fish. Unless it's some other 20+lb GA fish no one knows about (and do we really want to go there?). What is not in dispuite is that it's a fish caught in its native range that wasn't stocked and virtually hand fed high fat, high protein non-natural meals to make it big. That alone makes it a more impressive fish than any fish I've seen from other states.
Super User Catt Posted April 20, 2009 Super User Posted April 20, 2009 Micro The photograph was discovered in 2005 by Jerry Johnson of Waycross, Ga., in the effects of his late aunt, Mildred Johnson of Alma, Ga. The Johnson and Perry families were friends not relatives Jerry Johnson could not identify who the people in the photo are. George L. "Dazy" Perry the son of the late George Washington Perry stated he does not know who the people in the photo are and all he could identify was the location as being that of the post office. What happened to Jack Page, Perry's companion on the trip to Montgomery Lake? There are no Pages in a list of surnames in the Telfair County History, 1807-1987. Unfortunately, the Telfair County courthouse burned in 1934, destroying records that could have helped identify the man who witnessed the catch. If there were interviews with the Perry family I would like to see links or copies so we could read them ourselves.
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