What creates a "Big Bass?"

[Bass_Akwards]

I'm looking for huge bass.  Everything is relative obviously.  A huge bass here in Colorado is 8 pounds, with the state record being 11.6.  that's lunch for the bass in Texas, Florida,  and Cali.

My question is...

What kinds of things should I be looking for in a bass habitat, both in and out of the water, that might create a state record, or at least some monsters?

For example, in a 10 mile radius around my house, theres 30 different ponds or so.  I've seen 8 pounders pulled out of 2 personally.  I've pulled 5 pounders out of some.  But what will make one pond have a maximum sized bass of 5 pounds, while the one down the road, has a max size of 9 pounds?

As far as I see it, many of the ponds have the same forrage base.  Things such as Frogs, mice, Blue gill, croppy. and cray fish lead the way in most ponds I fish.  So what else is there in a pond that creates a relative huge bass?

Pond size?  Pond depth?  15 other things I don't know about?

T

[BassinBoy]

Thats a very good question but sorry I cant really help.  Im curious to see the replys to this question.

[Paul Roberts]

The short answer is: Food.

With some qualifications:

-Appropriate sized food -for all year classes to bring bass to size.

-Available food -catchable, meaning not living where bass don't, or tucked away in dense cover where bass cannot efficiently get at them.

-A LOT of it!

Well, that was my simple answer, but there's more to it (nothing in nature is really simple) ...So...here's s'more...

In most waters (those that vary year to year in the above prescription) age of the bass matters. In the waters I fish it takes 8 years or more for a bass to reach 18 inches. In many of my ponds, bass hit 16inches and get really thin and then disappear. In others, the cutoff may be 18". Each year may vary too in what it offers to bass of various size classes.

It is possible for individual bass to jump a forage base bottle neck, usually by being especially aggressive. The very largest bass in most waters are often the most aggressive individuals. However, these fish tend to be most vulnerable to angling, and suffer attrition over the years it takes to grow large.

For an interesting study on this, see Brian Waldman's site: http://www.bigindianabass.com/big_indiana_bass/research/page/2/

Scroll down to: Pressure and Bass Aggressiveness

The final sub-set of individuals that may get really big are those that are very difficult to catch by anglers even dubbed by some researchers as "immune to angling".

As you can see, waters that produce really truly big bass are truly rare.

Would love to hear Bob Lusk weigh in here.

[FD.]

Food and Time...everything else relates to food and time.

There should not be any significant differences in the ability to produce large bass in similar geographic areas.

You can read about ph levels, O2 levels, average temp, trophic index, average depth, forage base, genetic predisposition and hundred other factor but the bottom line is food and time.

[FunnyFish]

Alright i agree, but if food and time are the main thing with bass growing. Then why do bass grow slower and live longer in the north, and grow faster but dont live as long in the south. Shouldnt that make the bass get bigger in the north. Has to do with being able to eat more forage all year round and the metabolism not slowing down do to snow. In Wisconsin our state record is around 11lbs. Then I see all these guys from the south or Cali....ect.ect. and these Bass dont even look real Which on a side note, screw you guys, you lucky #@%\  . Hope we get more post this subject. Already got some good stuff brewing.

[paul.]

very good replies so far.  my answer is twofold - genetics and environment.  since these guys have done an excellent job of covering environment, i'll touch briefly on genetics.  a bass cannot outgrow it's genetic ceiling any more than you or i, or any other living creature for that matter.  in any body of water, i think the gene pool is an essential factor in bass growth.  small bass tend to produce small bass with poor growth potential (low genetic ceilings).  big bass tend to produce big bass with good growth potential (high genetic ceilings).  to some degree environment (optimum water conditions and plentiful/accessible forage) can compensate for a low genetic ceiling.  but there's no way environment can totally overcome poor genetics.  that is why i think it is so essential to release big bass.  hope this helps answer your question.  

   

[Mattlures]

Out here in Cali our lakes go through cycles. In the 80's the big producer was Castiac. It made a lot of huge bass but things have changed. The guys in the know, know which lakes are ripe and are holding the largest fish. They also know if they are improving or regressing. This is done by comunication whith other in the know and paying attention to fish reports and talking to the rangers and the local Biologist. For sombody with no clue on how to find the biggest fish, My first recomondation would be to call the local biologist. They are a great polace to start. The only better info would come from guys who are actualy catching the biggest fish but if your not tight with them they will probably not give up the goods. Check lake histories. Call the lake rangers. call your local biologist. Talk to local Bait stores. You should be able to narrow down your area to a few lakes with the best chances of kicking out a record.

I know of 2 lakes that currently have world records in them. I also know of 2 more that are VERY close. and even a few more that might get there in 5 years. I also know of wich lakes are going down hill.

This is valuable info when looking for the biggest fish.

[George Welcome]

The ecosystem that is a bass's habitat has prescious little known about it.

This is known: it takes a intricate balance of forage, predation, enviornmentally  sound water conditions, and correct fisheries management to produce the possibility of a bass getting large.

What isn't known: What is in reality the correct balance of forage, predation, correct fisheries management, and enviornmentally  sound water conditions to produce the possibility of a bass getting large.

If and when these factors are learned there will be lakes and ponds in abundance across this great land of ours that not only will be producing the numbers, but also the size of bass that is desired.

No single factor, from forage, to genetics, to adequate predation is understood to date. However, the fisheries science community is most certainly in an ongoing study of the matter.

Prognosis: The subject is complex to a level of extreme. When faced with a direct question such as the one that started this thread the fisheries scientist can but shrug his/her shoulders and say, "we are working on it." Simply put, it's not likely, until one of these creatures talk to us, that we will get a handle on it.

The answer to the initial question:  Fish with a dedication for the bass that you seek, have a bit of good luck, and keep your enviornment clean.

[Catt]

Six outstanding answers!    next  

[tyrius.]

Then why do bass grow slower and live longer in the north, and grow faster but dont live as long in the south.  

They are different strains (species?) of largemouth bass.  Florida bass can not survive in the north.  Genetically they are different.

[jiggerpole]

The answer is multiple. 1. Is Food ( lots of it) so a lake that has a good  a PH  and a good supply of nutrition good water quality the right amount of oxygen, cover or habitat ect. all have an effect on the growth rate of fish. 2. "Genetics" It is a known fact that the Florida strain gets big. If you cross the Florida with the Northern you get the best of both worlds. Big and agressive. I know guys here in Alabama that can grow a 10 pounder in 4 to 5 years flat. 3. Population Balance! Especially the small lakes and ponds need to be monitered closer. If I had to guess, most ponds and small lakes and even some bigger resorviors are out of whack and could be better if fishers were more educated in the methods fisheries biologist used. A lot of times you see slot limits and those are intended to protect the fish in that slot. The ones under the slot and above the slot need harvested. Most will release the smaller ones thinking they will get bigger when in fact harvesting them will increase the available food for others. Not that many people catch the big ones but keeping them sometimes may be a good thing. Too many small ones are a bad thing and too many big ones are a bad thing. I know your thinking there is no such thing as too many big ones but Balance is the key to a healthy lake. 4. Fishing pressure from people who dont care or understand about the outcome of their fishing habits. It would be nice if everyone could be on the same page and become self taught managers of their resoure. I think this place is a good place to start. Ive not been on this site long but I have seen some great info and some very knowlegable answers here and I hope it continues. I know some of the Biologist that vist this site may have a better answer and maybe an article could be written on what to look for and how to find it on a bigger scale from a fishers point of view. Most of what I know is self taught with the help of a good friend of mine Scott Cherones. If I can learn how to manage a lake anyone can. 5. The growth season is simply put, Bass are cold blooded and need the warmer waters to have the faster matabalism that makes them more active feeders on the more abundent forage that warmer waters can produce. More planton and microscopic organisms at the bottom of the food chain will create more food for bait fish which feeds the Bass. Hope this helps.

[Paul Roberts]

Yeah, genetics. I hesitated on that one, mostly because I know few specifics about it really. Is it growth potential, or simple aggression that counts most? I suppose it doesn't matter which, the take-home message is the same: On most waters, release those big ones, and handle with care. Unless maybe your water is so intensively managed that 5lbers are a nuisance!

As to the FloridaXNorthern issue, here's an interesting bit of research on the subject:

http://www.bigindianabass.typepad.com/

Scroll to: It's All in the Genes

[JShrock07]

I fish a private lake about 85 acres big and I always catch small dinks.

I was told if you take the small fish out it will give the larger fish a

chance to eat more and grow larger. If that is true I would love to

hear it from ya'll.

PM me if you can help me out!!!!

[Mattlures]

Nitro because the lake is Private I assume its not getting fished a lot?

I also assume the fish are not being harvested? If this is true, it is your duty as a guest to remove as many small bass as you can. Now obviously you dont want remove all of them but That would practicaly be impossible anyways. Your answer is yes. You need to remove the small bass when you catch them. In most lakes LMB are the top predator. They will eat themselfs out of their food. By removing the small bass you will allow the bigger bass to get even bigger and you will also allow the prey species to increase their numbers.

[Bass_Akwards]

Great stuff as usual guys, thanks.  I find it very interesting how one pond can have a certain sized ceiling for growth, while a pond 100 yards away, can be completely different.  

[Paul Roberts]

I wouldn't blindly take out small bass. If they are very thin (like photo below) and big-headed, then go ahead. But if they are fat and happy, they may be part of a good year class and worth letting them contribute in their time. Large bass and small ones don't compete; they eat different sized prey. Bob Lusk may have more to say on this. Also, check articles on this site, and on PondBoss site.