Catch and release ethical question

[Guest avid]

I was bank fishing a small catch and release only pond yesterday.

It was fun untill the fire ants decided to join the love bugs to make me miserable.

Anyway, I caught a 14" bass on a chug bug.  

He took it all the way down.  Every hook was stuck in him someplace including the gills.

I was patiently trying to gently remove the hooks, but I would get two or three out and he would flop and get stuck all over again.

He was bleeding pretty badly and I could clearly see damage to the gills.

I got the lure out though the bottom of the gill plate but this bass was obviously not going to make it.

Yet, the rules on this pond are quite clear "Catch and release only"

so I released him back into the pond.  He actually swam away and for a moment I had some hope but then he came floating up and was clearly dying.

This bothered me, but I did what I thought I had to.

what would you do?

[Raul]

Yet, the rules on this pond are quite clear "Catch and release only"

There isn 't much to think about, the rules are crystal clear.

[Jeff_NHBA]

Hi Avid,

By the letter of the law, I think you did the right thing to release the fish.  Eventhough the gills appeared to be damaged, I think I would have tried to revive the fish by moving the fish to keep water running over the gills.  Assuming fish blood clots like ours, the fish would eventually stop bleeding.

Also, if you know you are going to a C&R only pond, you could mash down the barbs on your trebles to make it easier to remove the hooks from the fish.  Trebles are easy to replace.

[Garnet]

I'm glad that all my lakes are public and don't get into this situation.

I carry offset sidecutters to cut those hooks with out cutting gills. The offset sidecutters let you see better.

Then hold the fish for a few minutes to allow clotting and release. If you release to quickly they will bleed out.

If this didn't work.

I would retrieve the bass and make a small cut and remove to air sack. It's up close to the spine the fish will sink and the turtles will look after it.

Garnet

[Bassinfreak2]

You were not doing any of that defensive fishing were ya??   LOL!

I think you did the right thing. The rules are clear. C & R only. If I were in your shoes I would have done the same thing.

I actually keep some Please Release Me on hand and rub some of that on sore places of the bass I catch. I have not had a gill hooked fish since I started using it so I am not sure how I would apply it in that case.

[largemouthslayer]

Yet, the rules on this pond are quite clear "Catch and release only"

There isn 't much to think about, the rules are crystal clear.

Catfish bait!

[Raul]

Unethical, C&R only.

You can 't choose which rules to obey or not.

[jaskoh]

As largemouth kinda stated. I would agree with what you did because even though the bass died it will still made a catfish or atleast some turtles happy for a little bit.

[Glenn]

Then hold the fish for a few minutes to allow clotting and release. If you release to quickly they will bleed out.

This is incorrect.  The exact opposite it true.  Wounds on fish will clot under water faster than in air.  It's how nature works.  Otherwise all naturally wounded fish would bleed to death.

Also, although not mentioned here, do not revive a bass by moving him back-n-forth in the water.  The gills are designed to handle water intake one way - when the bass is moving forward.  Moving him backwards may in fact damage the gills.  So move him in a circle in a forwards direction instead.

[SPEEDBEAD.]

Then hold the fish for a few minutes to allow clotting and release. If you release to quickly they will bleed out.

This is incorrect. The exact opposite it true. Wounds on fish will clot under water faster than in air. It's how nature works. Otherwise all naturally wounded fish would bleed to death.

Also, although not mentioned here, do not revive a bass by moving him back-n-forth in the water. The gills are designed to handle water intake one way - when the bass is moving forward. Moving him backwards may in fact damage the gills. So move him in a circle in a forwards direction instead.

Glenn, I think what he meant was to hold them in the water, then release, as opposed to letting them swim away immediately. I dont believe he was suggesting to keep them out in the air.

Wayne

[Fish Man]

sorry for hijacking the thread but i just had an idea (a very rare thing ;D) while i have never done this an wouldnt until i know its safe....would salt be a good way to stop the fishes gills from bleeding.it would be good if it stopped the bleedding like it does on a cut by clotting up the blood but i dont know if somthing like salt would do harm to the gills were it is somthing that isnt supposed to be there

[Guest avid]

I actually did hold him in the water facing the direction the breeze was blowing the water, but much to my surprise he swam away immediately.

Perhaps, I should have cut out all the hooks etc, but this is an ethical query not a " how to" question on prevention. (which, I think would make an excellent thread)

So let me re-phrase and put it into the realm of the hypothetical.

"Despite your best efforts at not harming the fish, his thrashing and struggle to escape damaged the gills to the point where he was bleeding profusely and was clearly going to die"

what would you do?

[flechero]

"Despite your best efforts at not harming the fish, his thrashing and struggle to escape damaged the gills to the point where he was bleeding profusely and was clearly going to die"

what would you do?

In that case, I would follow the rules and "let it go."  Although I disagree with them, the rules are there for a reason and people woud start thrashing the gills when unhooking or letting fish swallow before hooksets so they could keep a fish if there were a dead fish exception (seen that happen on a private lake)  A dead fish on occasion sure beats a fished out pond.  As I see it, there was only one choice... anything else would have been criminal.

[Raul]

Rules come first.

[Deuceu72]

You did the right thing.......

[Guest avid]

I hate seeing dead fish floaters.

I like the idea of punturing the air bladder.

Thanks Garnet for that suggetion.

These situations don't happen to me often, but they do happen.

I wish I were so conservation minded that bending down the barbs on a plug was something I would do, but in all honesty that's not going to happen.

I doubt if cutting off hooks embedded in a bass gills will help it survive.  The gills are pretty fragile and modern hooks will last a long time in fresh water.  I would need to see research proving it works before going that route either.

I think it is inevitable that we are going to kill a bass now and then.

I can live with myself.  I keep virtually no bass I catch, often use circle hooks and routinely conduct myself in an ethical and gentlemanly fashion.

[Garnet]

Most of my experience is with tubes and smallies. I cut the hook so the fish can eat even a 4/0 gami jig hook can cause problems. The side cutters work for throat hooked fish.

Glenn I'm talking about fish bleeding heavily if you hold that fish about the same amount time as it takes to snap a photograph before putting them in the livewell I've had low %  survive to be released in couple hours. Quickly putting fish into livewell that are bleeding heavily never survive.

A low salt solution in your livewell helps.

Garnet

[Pa Angler]

You did what the rules state and so you should not feel guilty some fish will perish even with catch and release that's just the nature of the beast.

[Guest the_muddy_man]

Hey The Gators got a free mail

[jomatty]

i wouldnt like it but i dont think there was really any decision to make.  i think you had no choice but to throw it back.  it is unfortunate that some places have to have rules like this but the problems with any exceptions to catch and release would obviously be exploited by those that are unethical so i see why it is that way.

[Avalonjohn44]

sorry for hijacking the thread but i just had an idea (a very rare thing ) while i have never done this an wouldnt until i know its safe....would salt be a good way to stop the fishes gills from bleeding.it would be good if it stopped the bleedding like it does on a cut by clotting up the blood but i dont know if somthing like salt would do harm to the gills were it is somthing that isnt supposed to be there

I would not put salt on a bass's gill wound.   Such an overabundance of salt will cause more damage by disrupting the balance of water in the cells of the gill (as well as anywhere else it touches).  The salt will draw out the moisture while replacing it with sodium, and the cells will be destroyed, actually bursting - just like it does with slugs and worms.  While you may think it aids the clotting of a wound on your hand, the damage you are doing to the skin and tissues is worse, and your body ends up healing more than it needed to.  Kind of like the butter on a burn myth.  Don't do it to yourself or to a fish!  

[Garnet]

You need to go to B.A.S.S. site and look in conservation for there book "Keeping Bass Alive" were they decribe a non iondized salt dip to maintain salt level in blood.

Also as a kid the aquruim guy told me to put my gold fish in a salt dip if they started to roll on me. It almost allways worked.

Garnet

[Jeff_NHBA]

Then hold the fish for a few minutes to allow clotting and release. If you release to quickly they will bleed out.

This is incorrect. The exact opposite it true. Wounds on fish will clot under water faster than in air. It's how nature works. Otherwise all naturally wounded fish would bleed to death.

Also, although not mentioned here, do not revive a bass by moving him back-n-forth in the water. The gills are designed to handle water intake one way - when the bass is moving forward. Moving him backwards may in fact damage the gills. So move him in a circle in a forwards direction instead.

Glenn, I think what he meant was to hold them in the water, then release, as opposed to letting them swim away immediately. I dont believe he was suggesting to keep them out in the air.

Wayne

Keeping the fish in the water was implied.

[Cigarlover 1]

Too bad it wasn't a CP&R only pond.  ;D

Seriously, if it were me and the fish was still alive I would release it right back in the water. Like Flechero said I don't really agree with it but the rule is the rule. Having the C&R only rule takes any ethics out of the equation IMO.

[Garnet]

Sorry Shellback I mean when the hook is removed wieght 30 sec or a minute for the bleeding to stop. This is the same as snapping a pic takes a minute.

You must remember these are dead fish you can't make a mistake.

In Avids case he has to release.

In my case I want to get the fish to the wieght scales alive if I'm fun fishing I'm eating it. Never once have I had a fish bleeding badly that I put strait in the live well survive. By getting the bleeding stopped and then get in the livewell I've had maybe 20 % survive. Better than nothing.

Garnet