carolina rig - speed

[jb_adams]

Sounds like a good tip for river fishing.  There is very little to no current on Beaver.  Not enough to impart action on a worm anyway.  Sounds like you have heavily fished that area for many many years.  Thanks for the tip!  I am still learning to expand my skill of patience.  It's the most important virtue or skill in fishing.

[Guest avid]

Excellent replies.

And the winner is........... drag and pause.

How far to drag and how long to pause are debatable and will probably vary from day to day, but the technique seems like the standard place to start.  Then experiment.

Question answered  

thanks to all

[Guest ouachitabassangler]

JB, if you've never tried scuba diving, take 3 lessons until you can spend at least a day watching fish and lure use under water. You would be astounded to find whatever you've imagined so far is probably not anything like real life there. It will change the way you fish. For instance, I was watching the edge of a hydrilla flat about 12 feet down a sharp drop-off next to the weeds. I just wanted to see how bass related to the weedline. I noticed weeds swaying sometimes, other times leaning over.

We have a dam that holds back 40,000 acres of lake where few anglers believe any current exists until a flood comes. I didn't believe it was significant unless in the main river channel while the dam was in full generating mode, and then any current would be so slight as not to be measurable. The lake surface never shows signs of current. I learned differently.

I've learned wind causes currents that sway things on bottom down to about 8 feet. Several days of wind and high waves affects plants deeper. When the dam is opened for generating power all plants in the lake lean downstream a little, moreso where the lake is only 100 feet wide on the upper end where only a river bottom is. Whatever little current there is, even from a school of shad stirring things up, it's enough for fish to detect and use. And there's hardly a moment when some little current isn't going in some direction. So deadsticking a floating worm will be influenced by a current from somewhere or something.

Beaver has a 190 cubic foot per second flow today http://www.swl-wc.usace.army.mil/WCDS/Reports/Daily/White.htm, so imagine that passing through the narrowest neck of  the lake to get some idea of current. There is some, and often enough to wave a floating worm or influence movements of baitfish and the plankton they feed on. Most flow current will be through the middle 1/3 of a crossection of the lake, not on bottom, along the sides, or the surface, but the middle third generally following a historic channel bed.

Jim

[Matt Fly]

Concur with Jim.    Most bodies of water have current, even if its just wind, it matters.

[Shad_Master]

On one of the recent "People Who Fish" shows, one of the Murray's (Billy or Bobby) was discussing the C-rig and his advice was to make the leader the length that you can move the bait in one drag.  He was "dragging and pausing" long enough to reel up the slack (and of course catching fish on every cast) .  He also suggested that the "lift and drop" worked best for baits like Flukes or Senkos, but draging and pausing was the preferred method for any type of creature bait.

[jb_adams]

OK, I stand corrected yet again by people who obviously know a whole lot more than I do.  I'll learn to keep my newbie mouth shut one of these days so I don't embarrass myself further!  Then again, how else would I learn huh?

Thanks for the tips on the underwater currents.  Sounds like very very good information.

Now, to clarify the drag and pause method.  Is this a medium speed drag or a quick flinch or jerk measured by the  leader size?  I usually twitch it back to me once or twice and pull it half the leader or the leader distance in one twitch.  Is this too fast?  It seems to be working on occasion.

[Rattlinrogue]

I also use the drag and pause method.Sometimes I drag and reel without pausing.Othertimes I pause between dragging and reeling depending on how the bass are cooperating.I know that I need to slow down now and really cover every bit of stucture that I'm fishing.I've been trying to cover too many spots and not taking the time to really take a piece of structure apart.

[fishinTexas]

Well no wonder I haven't been catchin to many w/ this rig. I have been doing it wrong all along. I been lifting and dropping w/ a lizard instead of dragging. Yet another reason why I love this website. What about weight size? I think I have missed a few because the weight I used was to big.

[jb_adams]

What about weight size? I think I have missed a few because the weight I used was to big.

Well everything I have read and been told is that the weight depends on the depth you're fishing.  For water up to 10ft. deep, I see no reason for a 3/4oz. egg sinker because they just catch everything on the bottom.  Plus they make an awfull splash in the water.  Sounds like you just threw in a big rock.  I use a 3/8-1/2 swivel sinker.  It is pear shaped and has a swivel built in at the top to tie the line.  It doesn't catch along the bottom as much as the egg sinkers.

For water over 10ft in depth (like 20-30ft), I could see the benifit of using a 3/4oz. or 1oz. weight.  There are plenty of C-rig posts here which I'm sure has much better information.

One thing I learned recently about C-rigs is that you can add brass knock plates or brass weights to use with glass beads.  It acts similar to a rattle on a jig and helps attract attention to the bait.  Does it work?  I haven't tried it yet but I hear it works great.

[Matt Fly]

jb,

   Depth is not my concern for the weight.    Wind or current determines how small of a weight I can use.  Time of the year (seasonal pattern and water temps) determines leader length.

Some times a heavier weight is used to stay in contact with the bottom so you can tell what the bottom is composed of.    Rocks, brush, wood, mudd..........its a search tool used to probe out areas.

As for the splash, your not targeting a tree or dock where a money cast is needed, normally, if fishing a point, you cast past your target and ease the rig back to the point or hump.

As for the beads and noise, I always have one bead above my keeper or swivel with my sinker.      

Do not use tungesten and a glass bead, the weight is harder and can crack the bead which might fray or cut your line.

Hookem

Matt

[slappy]

I do about a 4-5 foot drag then let it sit all while my rod tip is pointed to the water this helps me get a long hook set

[Rattlinrogue]

I use a 1/2 ounce brass weight,two plastic beads,and a brass knocker above the swivel.The package says 1/2 ounce, but it sure feels more like an ounce.

[Guest ouachitabassangler]

I want the lightest sinker I can get by with, but there's something to think about with that. If the sinker is too light a bass can pull a bait lifting the sinker too easily. If the bass feels the weight before you detect a bite, the bass is likely to drop it. I'd much rather have the bass tighten up on the line without lifting the sinker. You should then see line movement or feel the bass without a sinker being involved. You don't want the bass lifting a light sinker and hanging it up, causing a premature binding on the leader, alerting the bass something is wrong. Another point to ponder is having enough sinker weight so a side sweeping hookset pulls line through the sinker, setting the hook before the hookset lifts the sinker up. I believe a lifting sinker reduces hookset effectiveness, picturing the angles involved. Part of the hooset power is lost lifting the sinker, slowing movement of the hook away from the bass. That little delay in moving the hook in the right direction can result in the bait being spit out. A bass can bite then spit within about 1/10 of a second, an inhalation bite taking 1/20 second or less. I know this sounds probably too nit picky, but angling involves critical angles and timing of angles. I want the line doing all the right moving before overcoming the mass of the sinker. So, if using light line and a very light bait, a 1/2 oz sinker would make sense unless that weight is too light for current or wind. 1 oz or more makes sense for a 7" worm with 4/0 hook on 14# line in moderate wind. A 2 oz sinker makes sense with 17# line in 10 mph wind with foot high waves, needing a solid anchor for the line.

Jim

[K_Mac]

I want the lightest sinker I can get by with, but there's something to think about with that. If the sinker is too light a bass can pull a bait lifting the sinker too easily. If the bass feels the weight before you detect a bite, the bass is likely to drop it. I'd much rather have the bass tighten up on the line without lifting the sinker. You should then see line movement or feel the bass without a sinker being involved. You don't want the bass lifting a light sinker and hanging it up, causing a premature binding on the leader, alerting the bass something is wrong. Another point to ponder is having enough sinker weight so a side sweeping hookset pulls line through the sinker, setting the hook before the hookset lifts the sinker up. I believe a lifting sinker reduces hookset effectiveness, picturing the angles involved. Part of the hooset power is lost lifting the sinker, slowing movement of the hook away from the bass. That little delay in moving the hook in the right direction can result in the bait being spit out. A bass can bite then spit within about 1/10 of a second, an inhalation bite taking 1/20 second or less. I know this sounds probably too nit picky, but angling involves critical angles and timing of angles. I want the line doing all the right moving before overcoming the mass of the sinker. So, if using light line and a very light bait, a 1/2 oz sinker would make sense unless that weight is too light for current or wind. 1 oz or more makes sense for a 7" worm with 4/0 hook on 14# line in moderate wind. A 2 oz sinker makes sense with 17# line in 10 mph wind with foot high waves, needing a solid anchor for the line.

Jim

Jim, you once again get right to the heart of the matter. I almost always use 1 oz. of weight. I've tried lighter but find I feel and hook more fish with a little heavier weight. I think your explanation explains why. Thanks.

[mudcatwilly]

I use two methods.  Drag and pause or pump and pause.  With the pump and pause, I lift the rod tip about 12 inches, let the sinker hit bottom, reel in the slack, and then pause.  Use a monofilament line because it sinks slower than flourocarbon.  The bite can be real subtle, so make sure your have a sensitive rod.  Sometimes, it doesn't feel like a tap, it more like steady pressure or or a mushy feeling.  When it doubt, set the hook.  Swings are free!

[jb_adams]

I use two methods. Drag and pause or pump and pause. With the pump and pause, I lift the rod tip about 12 inches, let the sinker hit bottom, reel in the slack, and then pause. Use a monofilament line because it sinks slower than flourocarbon. The bite can be real subtle, so make sure your have a sensitive rod. Sometimes, it doesn't feel like a tap, it more like steady pressure or or a mushy feeling. When it doubt, set the hook. Swings are free!

I too use the pause and pump method and I agree that the feel is sometimes mushy.  Like you said, swings are free!