Your buddy is hammerin fish and your NOT!!!

[Pintail55]

The previous thread about "What goes through your head when your not catching fish" got me thinking.

I what goes through your head when your buddy is hammering the fish and your getting nothing. I went out to a local lake today with my buddy and he was tearing them up I got the shaft. He caught around 20+ fish plus 2 5#ers and I caught 1 fish in 10 hours of fishing. I was using the exact same lure and exact same presantation. I was happy for my buddy : but it was very frustrating. Just curious if this ever happens to anyone else.

Oh yeah and the only fish I did catch jumped right as I lipped her and buried one of the crank bait hooks all the into my thumb joint past the barb and itwas so far in I couldn't push it all the way through and cut the barb, I had to grit my teeth and pull I backwards against the barb to get it out :'( . That added to the wonderful experiance. My addvice is don't ever bury a hook past the barb into yourself It not very fun to get out .

[cart7t]

First things first, is our equipment the same?  Is his reel slightly slower or faster than mine and the speed difference is triggering the strike?  How about line size and type?  Is he imparting any other action into the lure that I'm not?  In your scenario, you're fishing a crankbait.  Is he throwing out the back of the boat and catching fish? In that case the forward movement of the boat along with his cranking is possibly gaining him a little extra depth edge.  If not, maybe it's the direction of the bait movement.  I definitely would douse my lure in fish formula as a means to mask any scents that might be on my hands that got onto the bait and is turning the fish off.  

Just a few things I'd think about.

[cpvenom]

I agree about the masking of scents on your hands. Some people excreet amino acids that are a turn off to bass. Next time try using a fish formula, or have your friend rig the bait for you, as he may have the more attractive amino acids.

[papa smurf]

I think about what a shame it would be if he "accidentally" : fell in the water.

[Guest ouachitabassangler]

Whenever I fish with a partner I make it a point to always fish a bait very different than what he's tied on. Once one of us hits on a pattern we both fish the same bait type, fine tuning different directions. For instance, one will go darker in color, the other lighter. One goes larger, the other smaller. One faster, the other slower if that doesn't cause agony for one. A well placed slow fished lure ought to make it back at a good speed in the time the other completes several casts before moving on. Well, as long as I'm not wanting to crawl a C-rig, taking 10 minutes to cover a choice piece of structure, and he's wanting to power fish a buzzbait. A little cooperation helps both. The object is to locate biting bass, so one or the other will hit on them faster and between the two the best pattern & technique will come to light faster.

Jim

[tuxdaddy]

First things first, is our equipment the same? Is his reel slightly slower or faster than mine and the speed difference is triggering the strike? How about line size and type? Is he imparting any other action into the lure that I'm not? In your scenario, you're fishing a crankbait. Is he throwing out the back of the boat and catching fish? In that case the forward movement of the boat along with his cranking is possibly gaining him a little extra depth edge. If not, maybe it's the direction of the bait movement. I definitely would douse my lure in fish formula as a means to mask any scents that might be on my hands that got onto the bait and is turning the fish off.

Just a few things I'd think about.

I agree with all thats been said, but I remember something Bill dance brought up once also.. How much line does your buddy have on his reel... The amount of line on your reel determines your actuall retrieve speed.... If he's a little low on line, he may be going at the right speed to attach the bass... I've experienced this as well.. Sorry about your thumb as well..

Tux

[Guest avid]

I was using the exact same lure and exact same presantation

with all due respect, I seriously doubt it.

Many times we THINK we are doing the same thing, but given the huge difference between your numbers and his means that he ABSOLUTELY was doing something a little different.  It could be any number of things, but probably something so subtle that you didn't notice.  Some examples could be that he was targeting specific features, like little cuts in the shoreline, or maybe he was letting his bait sink an extra second to gain a little extra depth.  One of the things we often do in this situation is overwork the bait.

The other obvious possibility is that he was in the front of the boat and you were following behind him throwing the exact same lure the fish either ate or ignored.

My rule of thumb when fishing behind someone is to go with the opposite of what they are using with one major exception.  Let me explain.  If they are using topwaters, I'll use something that sinks,  If they are fishing plastics on the bottom I'll fish hard baits higher up in the water column etc.  the one major exception is a jig.  If the person in the front of the boat is NOT fishing a jig.  I will. I'll stick with it changing colors, trailers speed, etc. till I find the ticket.

Another go to lure when things are tough is the Senko, but sometimes the guy in front of you is moving the boat too fast, that's why the jig can be unbeatable.

Good luck.

avid

[roadwarrior]

Great point avid, a Senko might be the worst choice you can make if your partner is running a bank. The Senko is totally ineffective in a situation where the boat is always on the move. Even if you cast forward, the bait is invariably worked way too fast.

[Pintail55]

I should have been alittle more specific. I tried every thing in my box will he was fishing a black and blue 1/2 oz jig with a black and blue brush hog trailer. Until finally for the last 5 hours I switched to the exact same black and blue jig with a black and blue brush hog trailer. I do agree that it is difficult to fish the EXCACT same as your buddy. I did think about it but didn't give it to much thought. His line was 15# p-line and I was throwing 50# Power Pro. I guess every little thing matters. I did also think about our locations on the boat so after awhile I decided to have him come up and run the controls and I started throwing from the back. I guess it just wasn't my day.

[Guest ouachitabassangler]

That difference in line was enough to make a big difference. I prefer using braid even in gin clear water, but as soon as I think bass are line shy I switch to invisible line. That happens when bass are highly pressured and there's not much floating vegetation to blend the braid into the environment. We have a huge amount of hydrilla here, rooted as well as floating where not rooted, so I can get by with it.

Jim

[Pintail55]

I should add I also did try mono 12# XL  (probally not long enough).  I felt more comfortable with the braid because the fish were in the brush pile (all the way in the piles) and I should have given the mono a better chance. Plus It might have been scent to, he was chewing a different brand then me  .

I also was going to add I've never used p-line before and afer seeing how well and epecially how strong it was for my buddy I'm thinking I may have to give it a try.

[pcorajr]

Im no bass pro but there are so many small indications of what happend. the differance in line, moving boat, scent, and presentation. The way each individual works a bait will be different to the outcome of another person working the same way.

2 Weeks ago i was teaching my wife how to work a booyah jig along some cover, we where using the same rod and reel same line and same lure, she was even holding the rod the same way i was, and still her jig had a different action than mine. Its just how it works i guess.

I personally gave up on using anything above 30# on any braid. when i was using spider wire 50 # for almost 2 weeks I was having a hard time landing fish, they didnt even look at anything I offerd. after that i switched to 12# Yo-zuri hybrid and im back to my self again.

[Guest avid]

this is a tough situation.  If the guy in the front of the boat is hammering them on a jig then you are definitly in for a long day.  I would try a carolina rig.  fish a little deeper than he generally is.  

also, did you happen to look at how he tied the jig to his line?  Personally I don't think the power pro would matter except in the clearest of water with the shyest of bass.  I have never had a problem with power pro on jigs.  If you believe that to be and issue than tie on a few feet of clear leader.  Confidence matters.

BUT.  was he using a loop knot?

I have never seen or read much about this, but I have personally had days where a jig did not work for me UNLESS I used a loop knot.  This allows the jig to flutter a little on the horizontal plane while sinking vertically.   There have been days for me when this knot was the only way I could get a jig bite.

Sometimes it's the little things that mean alot.

[galv]

were all the fish bass?

im guessing it was line.  i was fishing earlier this year and my buddy caught about 20 to my five.  we were at a new unknown pond and all we were catching were crappie and perch.  after a few hours we gave up on even trying to catch bass.  they obviously didn't like my braided line but were all over my buddies lighter mono line.    both of us were tossing spinners and i was having a tough time, while my buddy was catching them with his lure by accident hanging off the side of the canoe into the water. i ended up catching the 1 and only bass of the trip.

[K_Mac]

As has been said sometimes it is the most subtle differences I believe, esp. with a jig. I've been on both sides of the fence-catching fish when my partner was not, and getting my rear kicked. The difference between two short hops and a pause may be only an inch or two, or a second or less when performed by two different fishermen but can make all the difference to the fish.

[Guest the_muddy_man]

Oh Im Sorry was that your tackle bag I knocked in the lake  That usually takes care of that problem

[j-bass]

I don't really have any problems with my friends catching more fish than me (plus, that rarely happens  ;D) because all of them are more than happy to practice catch and release.  What bugs me is when I see some jacka$$ catching and keeping left and right.  Karma is kinda screwy sometimes (one day, maybe the game warden will roll around and set things right).  BTW, its usually the same jacka$$.

[ernel]

If you really want to find out if it is the fisherman or the gear, ask your buddy to swap rods for a few and see if he still out catches you. If he doesn't, then it will rule amino acids and brands of chew. Making sense that the faster fall rate of the flourocarbon, or the lack of line visability was leading to more bites. If he does, then he is doing some little something that the bass like that you are not seeing or doing. This would be a good time to push him in the water and make him swear on his life before letting him back on board that this never happened. If not he will be telling everyone that he wooped you with your own rod.

[RobDar]

this used to happen to me as well...

Either i am catching and my wife is not...

or she is and I am not...

( which is holey better than niether of us catching anything)

every tournament...when we had our limit it is usually one of us caught 4 or all 5 of them and the other was the sucker for the day...

but I think we have got that figured out...

We used to do the same thing...try and match up lures etc etc etc...there are just way too many subtle differences to account for...

One time I even grabbed her rod and fished with it...AND SHE STILL CAUGHT ALL THE DARN FISH!!!! with a different lure, rod, different everything...

so now we do not try to match up at all...if she is catching them on a texas rigged worm...I will move to a deep crank I can bounce off the bottom...If she is running a spinner...I will throw a jig and pig or a Fluke...

I does not sound right at all does it?

If they are hitting a 6 inch bright pink Senko...why throw a Green Long Lipped Bandit Crank?

I do not know, but the last three tournaments we have both caught fish...so something is working...

[Raul]

You need to ask yourself given that situation what is making the difference, if both, let 's assume, are using the same baits, same techiques, and pushing it, the same gear then the differences can be attributed to:

1.- His position in reference to your position in the boat: the guy in the front of the boat casts first.

2.- He is doing something you are not: each and everyone of us imparts the bait his own personality, that 's the reason why it 's called fishing and not catching, fishing is as much an art as it is a science, the science comes when you study how the fish behave, where to find them, all the tid bits of information you use to solve the puzzle, but the art is a completely different story, that 's when two persons if both are fishing with the same "everything" separate completely, it 's your personality at the end of the line what 's catching the fish.