Lipless crankbait question

[huskertko]

When you fish a lipless crankbait, does it dive to a specific depth during the retrieve, or does it run gennerally at the depth you let is sink to before starting your retrieve?  

The reason I ask is that was fishing an area that has grass beds about 4 feet down, but even if i started my retrieve the minute the crank hits the water it always seems to dive into the grass beds.

[TWP]

There could be a couple of problems. is this lipless crankbait a floating one? How much does it weigh? how fast is your retrieve? Either these or your hitting clumps of isolated grass that towers up to 3 or 2 foot deep.

[huskertko]

Thanks, they are not floating cranks.

Retrieve speed varies from fast to slow roll, obviously the slow roll would allow it to sink into the grass but i would think that the fast retrieve would keep it above it.

[Raul]

Lipless crankbaits sink at a predictable rate of 1 ft/sec for every 1/2 oz Huskertko. They are great as countdown baits.

[Matt Fly]

A good tip, when hitting or snagging grass, rip the bait out.  Use the rod to lift the bait up as you are ripping it free.  This will trigger some aggressive strikes on the fall.

[Guest avid]

Lucky craft designs lipless crankbaits to run at specific depths. Check em' out Luckycraft.com

[Matt Fly]

Raul,  is that for any pound test with the1/2 oz. bait size.  Is 10 lb test and a 1/2 oz bait still going to fall at the same rates as15 lb?

Lipless crankbaits sink at a predictable rate of 1 ft/sec for every 1/2 oz Huskertko. They are great as countdown baits.

[shiloh]

Lipless crankbaits sink at a predictable rate of 1 ft/sec for every 1/2 oz Huskertko. They are great as countdown baits.

Interesting...

Does that mean a 1/4 oz llipless crankbait would sink at a rate of 1 ft/2sec (6 inches/sec)??

[Raul]

Actually the line diameter has little to do with the drop rate in a sinking lure Matt, it does alter the depth of a lipped crank though, you loose as much as 1 ft of diving depth for every 2 "pounds" you increase the test poundage. Lipped cranks are designed to be fished with "10-12 pound test", the truth is that they are designed to be fished with 0.250-0.280 mm diameter line, most monofilament lines have pretty much that diameter in "10-12 pound test".

Nope Shiloh it doesn 't work that way, you cut in half the weight and the bait should sink in the double of time, well mathematically speaking it should but it isn 't, 1/4 oz sinks at 1 ft/ 1.5 sec.

[Nick_Barr]

thanks for the sinking ratio tips, Raul you should make some of your own lures, If you did i sure would buy them.

[ifishflorida]

Rat-L-Trap makes different models including floating and a suspending model they call  a "Red Zone". They work much better in a shallow water column like you described.

[Matt Fly]

Next Insight please.   Why the fuss on Flourocarbon allowing the line to sink giving cranks a deeper running rate from different monos?  Normally Raul, I run 12 lb P-line for cranks, sometimes smaller.  Re-pharse.  Whats so special about Flourocarbon?  I've used it a number of times, I've had questionable breaks that don't occur with my normal set ups.  More money for the product, yet I've encountered more breakoffs than normal times.  I can't use something I don't trust.  I use the swimming pool to get my drop rates,  sometimes my baits are beefed up to slow fall rates down.  I  knew that diameter effected running depth, but didn't know that mono size doesn't really effect drop rates.  Nice to know, or learn something new every day.  

Actually the line diameter has little to do with the drop rate in a sinking lure Matt, it does alter the depth of a lipped crank though, you loose as much as 1 ft of diving depth for every 2 "pounds" you increase the test poundage. Lipped cranks are designed to be fished with "10-12 pound test", the truth is that they are designed to be fished with 0.250-0.280 mm diameter line, most monofilament lines have pretty much that diameter in "10-12 pound test".

Nope Shiloh it doesn 't work that way, you cut in half the weight and the bait should sink in the double of time, well mathematically speaking it should but it isn 't, 1/4 oz sinks at 1 ft/ 1.5 sec.

[Raul]

About the claim that fluorocarbon allows the bait to run deeper or having breakoffs I can 't say anything because I have no experience with fluorocarbon as main line. I fish with nylon mono, the only times I 've used fluorocarbon is as a leader in saltwater Matt.

[shiloh]

Nope Shiloh it doesn 't work that way, you cut in half the weight and the bait should sink in the double of time, well mathematically speaking it should but it isn 't, 1/4 oz sinks at 1 ft/ 1.5 sec.

Raul:

Thanks for the info!

I won't even ask what the sinking rate is for a 3/8 oz lure...  

Geez...do I need to take a calculator (or a slide rule...anyone remember them??...) out in the boat? I don't think there is room in my tackle bag... ;D

Seriously...good info...THANKS!

[Raul]

Just remember that 1/2 oz sinks at 1 ft/sec. It comes very handy to remember it, many times you locate the fish at a certain depth and just by counting sec after your bait lands helps you to keep the bait always at that level.

A couple of years ago my compadre and a very good friend of mine and I were fishing at "La Sauceda", I located the fish supended around standing timber at 7-10 ft depth, by running any bait at that depth you could bet you were going to get a strike, my friend and my compadre took out their lipless cranks ( regular 1/2 traps ) and I told them: cast near the trees or between them, after the bait lands let it fall by counting 8 seconds and then begin to retrieve, while I ate a sandwich they did that and had a blast, almost every cast caught a fish.

[basser89]

With flurocarbon, you can get extra depth with it because of the density of the line. It is not as buoyant as mono, so it sinks. That's how you'll get the extra depth. Hope this helps!

[Chris]

Knowing that a rattling bait in most cases unless its real heavy runs about 4-5 ft deep(1/2 oz). 1/4 will run about 3-4ft. This is just throwing it out and reeling it in. When you count a bait down to lets say 10 ft deep and you use a regular retrieve. There comes a point when your bait looses depth as you reel. Where you think your bait is running 10ft down it might have just lost 1-2 ft after you have reeled it in 10-20 ft. For you to keep that bait at that depth you need to slow roll that bait and count it back down a ft or two. This will keep the bait in the area not the exact depth. Your bait from the line drag and the angle of you being on a higher position (you in the boat)will force a bait to loose depth. The deeper you go the heavier a rattletrap you will need to hold that depth through the duration of your cast you still need to count it back but not as much as a lighter trap. If you take a 1/4 oz and count it down to 10 ft it would be very difficult to maintain that depth with any accuracy through the duration of your cast. I use countdown baits a ton and it took me some time learn that your bait doesn't stay at the depth you think it is and that you need to count it back down. In the winter this technique is my bread and butter. The heavier your line is the more dramatic the loss of depth is. Thats why you can take a 1/4 oz trap and run it in 2-3 ft of water on 17-20lb test without much of a problem. The line drag keeps the bait up. Line diameter and type of line does effect the fall rate of a bait be it a jig or trap. 20lb mono and 20lb braid have different fall rate than 20lb Flourocarbon. Mono and braid floats Flouro sinks. These different styles of line also effect the amount of line drag it has. All of them cause the bait to loose depth when reeled in. You still need to count that bait back down to stay in the area of the desired depth. I just use trial and error I count it down and reel to a point the count it back down two or three then reel more then count it down more. I keep adjusting until I make contact with the fish then duplicate it.