Bass Tournaments???

[lovecranking]

I would like to hear from some knowledgeable people familiar with fishing in bass tournaments and explain a few things to me. I've been fishing for 20 years and have been on lakes while bass tournaments were going on while I & others were just trying to get a day of fishing in. I just fished this last Saturday & Sunday on a lake that had 2 small bass tournaments going (about 20 boats each). Here is a sampling of what went on. The bass boats fly away from the dock to get to their spots at top speed at around 5:30am. Of course violating the no wake zone, 15 mph nighttime speed limit and 35 mph weekend speed limits. All day long you could hear them flying across the lake at full throttle and see the rooster tails from their bass boats. Then cutting through boats fishing at high speeds & come to a halt & start fishing right in the area that you are fishing. Then watching 6-8 boats going full speed right up to the buoys in the no wake zone at the dock where the weigh in is and seeing the shore take that beating and of course violating the no wake zone. It is amazing that nobody gets hurt and these guys just don't get how their actions are dangerous to themselves and others. As if this isn't bad enough, let's talk about the bass. Alot of the bass caught were in deep waters in this tournament. The bass are then put in the livewells to bounce around in and remain there while the boat is going full throttle throughout the day to different locations. Now after weigh in, the bass are released at the docks in shallow water. It's hard to imagine that this is good for the bass. What makes any logical person think that this does no harm to the bass or even make them die sooner than they normally do? Now I realize that DNR allows bass tournaments to go on because it is popular with those that fish who like the competition. It's obvious that I don't fish in any tournaments. But I'm trying to understand how bass tournaments are really a good idea for proper lake management. The response I always read is 1) that it's good for the local economy (It's hard to imagine that people seriously believe this). 2) competition to see who on that lake can catch the most bass under the same conditions. 3) the chance to win money and/or prizes and finally 4) because even that small group should be allowed to use the lake. Is it right all at the expense of the bass population? But lets say through DNR and the lake police, the ones fishing in the bass tournaments (and I think it is a very small percentage) are educated as to the proper way how to fish & move their boats properly on the lake throughout the tournament. How is this good to let a very small group be allowed to hold these tournaments? It's a shame to see these tournaments unleash their damage to the bass population and put other boaters/fishermen in danger because of their actions throughout the day. How does any DNR see a need for these tournaments? This is what I don't understand and maybe I haven't looked at it from the proper perspective.  

[BadKarma42]

I could be reading more into this than intended, but it appears to me that the primary issue that you are having is the conduct of the boats (speed, wake, operation) more so that the tourney.

Why not say something to the people issuing the permits?

As for management of the lake, are you refering to the managment of the fish or the actual operation of the lake?

[lovecranking]

I honestly don't think this is good for bass and in the long run do damage to the bass population.

[Shad_Master]

Is it good for 'em? No, probably not - but then is it good for fish to be caught in the first place? You might want to talk to someone at your DNR - you may find out that someone there has a good understanding of fish management and would be able to answer any questions you had about tourney fishing.

As for the "no wake" rule - this should be the responsibility of the tournament organizers and participants should be penalized for violating lake rules (BASS does this - Iaconelli a few years ago and Guy Eaker either this year or last year). My club has a "no wake - no pass for the first 30 minute rule" -- this means that noone is allowed to pass any other competitor under power for the first 30 minutes. The club will occasionally vote to suspend the "no wake" rule depending on the rules for the lake itself.

[-badhabit-]

Those must be very unorganized local tournaments.

All of the club rules from several clubs I have read would disqualify all of them. You can get DQ'd for violing speed limits, no wake zones, and for not respecting the local fisherman. They also have stout penalties for unhealthy or dead fish.

They all stress conservation in every way with bylaws that include leaving a lake either better or equal to the condition it was before they came.

I am not a tournament fisherman but do give the same respect I get from the tournament fishermen (good or bad).

Here in Central Florida even with 10K+ lakes the larger lakes see a lot of tournaments, some have 1 or 2 every week by different clubs.

If I were you I'd show up about weigh-in time and have a talk with the clown running the circus.

I wish you well,

[lovecranking]

ShadMaster, ok so you are telling me that when you or I catch a large bass and we then release it where we caught it. The damage to this fish will be the same compared to catching it in a tournament under the conditions I stated above? I don't think it's even close. Badhabit, I'm not talking about clubs enforcing their rules and possibly DQ'ing anyone. I'm asking what does this do to the bass caught? And why allow it for a hand full of fishermen compared to the thousands that use that same lake?

[preach4bass]

Bass tournaments are great for our nation's lakes.  Without bass tournaments there would be no BASS.  This is important for at least two reasons:

1.  BASS is responsible for catch and release being so popular.

2.  BASS ia a major (perhaps the biggest) player in helping to conserve and manage lakes.

So, without bass tournaments you would probably keep every bass you caught and eat it (along with every other fisherman) and our bass fisheries would suffer.

[Shad_Master]

You know lovecrankin, I'm not trying to start an argument. You asked for opinions and I gave you mine. If tournament fishing hurt the fish all that much, I really can't see that any of the state management people would even allow it.  There is no percentage in them encouraging something that will harm the fish. There is a lake near here that has at least one tournament every weekend during the season and some times two or I have even seen two clubs fish tournaments at the same time on Sat and then have another one on Sun. Why does everybody fish there - 'cause it's a great fishery. Some of the tourneys are C&R, others are weigh-in. During the hottest part of the summer, the DNR may require that they have a mid-day weigh-in. But I have never heard of any drastic repurcussions for the fish.

The simple answer to your last question is - 'cause they bought a license, too.

[lovecranking]

Shad_Master, I agree they did buy a license. And I'm not trying to argue with you as I didn't get into it with the tournament guys on the water or at their weigh in site. I'm just thinking that I'm not seeing the whole picture and just asking questions. I appreciate your honesty and thank you. Preach4bass, you're kidding right? You sound a little like the superstar athelete that says, "without me there would be no sport". But maybe I didn't take your comments as they were meant. Everyone has an opinion and the right to it. Thanks for the input.

[preach4bass]

Shad_Master, I agree they did buy a license. And I'm not trying to argue with you as I didn't get into it with the tournament guys on the water or at their weigh in site. I'm just thinking that I'm not seeing the whole picture and just asking questions. I appreciate your honesty and thank you. Preach4bass, you're kidding right? You sound a little like the superstar athelete that says, "without me there would be no sport". But maybe I didn't take your comments as they were meant. Everyone has an opinion and the right to it. Thanks for the input.

You're right, you didn't take my comments as they were meant.  How can I sound like the superstar athelete that says, "without ME there would be no sport"?  I don't fish tournaments anymore, so a better way of wording it would be, "without THEM (BASS and other tournament organizagions and tournament fishermen) the sport wouldn't be as good."

I understand your frustrations.  We've all had tournament fishermen in their fast bass boats ruin a spot on the lake.  There are some that are arrogant and annoying.  We don't have to like every tournament fisherman, but it would be ignorant to not acknowledge how tournament fishing has helped bass fishing as a whole.  Eastern NC, where I live, is a perfect example of this.  Back in 2003 (I believe it was) a hurricane messed up the lower Roanoke River and Albemarle sound.  The fishery really took a beating.  But BASS helped restock the river and sound and now it's back up to par.  That wouldn't have happened if it wern't for tournament fishermen.

[Matt Fly]

First off, what lake did this happen on?   This will tell us what state wildlife laws are in place.

What else does tournament fishing do for us.    It gives authorities some ideas of sizes of bass being caught, rate of catch, numbers of licensed fishermen fishing said lake.

  In short, it provides the state with useful info without having to spend resources and time on the water doing creel surveys.

Local clubs are sometimes just that, good ole boys having fun.    If dangerous conditions exist because of someone breaking the laws, then you simply report them to the authorities and let them catch them doing so.

Or you could mention it to the TD, he may put the word out to be safer.    I know that trails with good turn outs, and not pro side, has strict launching policy.  5:30am sounds fishy to me, most tournaments I fish only launch at safe light.

AS for waves beating the shores, the wind does the same thing.      

As for the safety of the fish, the guys who earned  their degrees so they could  make correct creel assessments on various lakes.    IE......they would change the limits on various lakes if they thought it was necessary.      As the law stands right now on most lakes across the US, I think we could all legally keep what we wanted as in the days of old and then where would we be?

By the way, its not just tournament guys who are irresponsible on the water.

Matt

[CJ]

Very well put Matt.

Lovecrankin',in your case,for your lake you may have a point.

Bass tournaments are good for the local economy.Why else would it be the Chamber of Commerce pay orginazations to hold tournaments on their lakes.

Don't brand all of us as "Bass Tournament parasites".I will admit there is some guys out there that need to have more respect for other fisherman and the bylaws.

Tournament fishermen don't hurt fish populations near as much as recreational fishermen.Think about it.ALL tournament guys release their fish.

[MemphisFisherman]

You mentioned you can't possibly think it's good for a fish when they get caught out of deep water, road around the lake in the livewell, and then released into shallow water...Is this good for the fish? Certainly not, is it bad for the fish? I am a believer that if you put a fish thats still flopping around all over the place and he swims off without much trouble, that it may take him a couple hours or even a couple of days to readjust but he will do just fine. How often do you see bass floating around dead in this lake, or any of the other lakes for that matter? Not very often, they are resiliant fish. And even if 75% of these fish died, its no worse than keeping and eating the fish, but hey...let's be honest here, too often I see people playing some type of saint and saying they never keep fish, even on this forum. Let me clear it up right now, lakes are managed by creel limit's, limit's that say how many fish and what size fish you can remove from a lake. Ignoring these rules EITHER DIRECTION can effect a lake in usually an adverse way. In other word's, if everyone was catch and release, kiss a bass on the mouth and give it a back rub then you may just end up with a very overpopulated lake and smaller sized bass, maybe even unhealthy, starving bass. So, my point is what's the really huge harm if a few bass are harmed in the process? It happen's, it sucks for the fish...but the turtles love it, and they have to eat too. But then again as I stated earlier in the post, I don't think alive and well bass released in a tournament end up dead, I just don't think it happens.

[Catt]

A study done by Hobson Bryan, Ph.D. at The University of Alabama on a Bass Federation tournament in March 2000 on Lake Tuscaloosa indicated that contestants averaged four practice visits to the lake before the week of the tournament. The average expenditure per contestant was approximately $1,100. With over 300 anglers, the direct economic impact was $330,000. A multiplier of three (i.e., the average number of times this money will circulate through the local economy) accounted for an economic impact of over $1 million. He also stated that "the value to communities of such events in the terms of publicity and repeat visitation is equal to roughly half the immediate economic impacts."

[frogtog]

Lovecrankin: theise are the rules we have to go by and they are very strick when it comes to this part. If you break the rules and I see you, it is my duty to turn you in or I'm as quilty as the rule breaker.

Effective: 10/07/2006

RULE CHANGES: The following rules shall apply to American Bass Angler, Inc. American Fishing Tour tournaments, with the following exceptions: (i) rules for special tournaments may differ from those contained herein and (ii) these rules may be changed by American Bass Anglers at any time upon notice by American Bass Anglers to its members, which notice may be published on the American Bass Anglers internet site at www.americanbassanglers.com.

1.       Interpretation of these rules shall be left exclusively to the tournament director. In the event of a rule violation, the tournament director and/or American Bass Anglers, Inc. Headquarters may impose such sanctions, as deemed appropriate, including but not limited to, disqualification, forfeiture of prizes, forfeiture of entry fee and prohibition from participation in subsequent tournaments. The decision of the tournament director/ABA Headquarters shall be final in all matters. Protests for any rule infraction must be made in writing within 30 minutes of the official check-in time in each tournament.

a.       Each contestant agrees to report any tournament rule infraction to the tournament director.

b.      Failure to report to the tournament director any tournament rules infractions or false reporting of tournament rules infractions will be cause for being disqualified.

c.       Rules infractions will result in penalties that may include

(1)     Loss of weight for the day of the rules infraction.  

(2)     Disqualification from the event.

(3)     Disqualification from future American Bass Anglers, Inc. events for a period of time up to a lifetime disqualification.

2.       COMPETITOR'S CONDUCT CODE

a.       Members that participate in American Bass Anglers, Inc. events will at all times observe the Competitor's Conduct Code and all applicable tournament/conduct rules for the tournament event in which they are participating as stated here. All Contestants shall conduct themselves professionally at all times.  Their actions may not reflect unfavorably on the sport of bass fishing, American Bass Anglers, Inc., its members or affiliates, officers or representatives, tournaments or sponsors.

b.      All competitors will in their best efforts provide a high degree of professionalism, integrity and conservation in the sport of professional angling. Any Competitor who violates any of the Competitor's Conduct Code may be penalized which may include: fines, disqualification from events, forfeiture of winnings, and suspension or non-acceptance of entries from ABA events to include permanent suspension. American Bass Anglers, Inc. may use these actions singularly or in combination as deemed appropriate.

[Surveyor]

I know this doesn't really adress the thread but I think it's a great story and the stories are better than the fishing aint it?

I was fishing Lake Eufaula a couple of weeks ago during the FLW event. Had picked up on a spot Labor day that I wanted to go back to. Started fishing b4 daylight but I made the mistake of fishing a couple of other spots first not knowing the tourney was going on. When I got to the spot I wanted to fish there were 5 boats there or very nearby. I had caught 8 fish there that were great tourney fish (between 2.5 & 5lbs). Burned up a tank of gas trying to find somewhere else then finally went back to Rood creek. Was fishing the banks mostly cause I am really a cover type fisherman and there was a boat fishing in the main stream (carolina & Texas rigged). I started talking to these guys about there luck and told them of my experience that day and last weekend. They caught a couple small ones but I saw them cull one and I caught one and released it (about 2 #). As I got further away I overheard "That old man aint never caught what he said". Well as luck would have it I felt that "sponge" in the treetop I flipped into and set the hook. Knew it was a good on because the drag screamed as I set the hook (using 50#braid and tight drag). Dragged him out of the treetop and saw it was a "real" good one and he had swollowed the hook. Played him around the front and trolling motor so those guyes could see, then lipped him and did my best Iconelli. Held him up for all to see, took out the scales and proclaimed 5#11oz. Then released him, pointed to where I released him and yelled to them "there he is". They cranked up and left.

Now I know you tourney guys may think I was unsportsman like and I may have broken some of the tourney rules but "just had to do it"

I talked to Tim Malcolm (the tourney winner) later that week but didn't mention this. I would like to fish in some of the tourneys but am really torn between just fishing here at home in my own private 90ac lake and going to the "big" lakes. I can't catch crap at lake Blackshear but Eufaula is a different story. I think I could probally catch em on Seminole too.

If anybody needs a co-angler for the FLW at Seminole next month I'm still thinking about and will probally fish it with an invitation.

[roadwarrior]

Welcome aboard!

[NJfishinGuy]

here in NJ, fish are pressured more than any state in the US probably. were the most populated state in the us i believe. its near impossible to get on the water anywhere ever and not see at least 1 or 2 other boats on the water and sometimes 20 or more besides you.  this is not counting days with tourneys going on. also remember now that our biggest lake here is 2600 acres and most lakes are in the 50-500 acres range. our lakes are POUNDED harder than a girl in a window in Amsterdam lol but they still produce fish constantly. on top of this the few lakes with the most tourney pressure also produce the biggest bass. so no i dont believe it shortens their life inless the people are carless.

hate the rude not the fisherman

[Matt Fly]

Surveyor,

  Welcome to the forum.

We have alot of guys on here that are from Florida.    I like a good fishing story, keep them coming.

Matt

[SENKOSAM]

Question:

How did you find out how deep the bass were caught? If caught in less than 30 FOW, would it make any difference that they were kept in a livewell for 6 hours or longer?

Question:

Were you able to count the number of dead fish at weigh-in? Do you know for sure the percentage of dead fish per total caught? Do you have an idea of total harvest for that lake?

Guessing or assuming doesn't count.

Question:

Does law inforcement have a boat on the lake on a daily basis or during every weekend?

Will local law enforcement accept a picture of the boat registration as proof when a boat speeds in a no wake zone? Will they investigate?

Question:

Do you belong to a club or organization that fishes the lake often? (If so I have a suggestion.)

Granted, slobs can ruin a day, whether they be anglers, ski boaters or jet skiiers; slob clubs can hurt a fishery (thank god there a so few!) The problem is dealing with what can't be fixed or if it can be fixed, acting realistically. I'm both rec and tourn. angler and sympathize, but realize that I can choose when and where to fish so as to have a nice day. I'm lucky in that I don't have to use my bass boat since I also have a 4wd truck for off road, a canoe, 12' jon boat and waders and many peaceful out-of-the-way waters I can schlepp to at a moments notice within an hour from home.

If the fishery is declining, the DNR needs proof so as to institue slot limits or restrict tourney permits. If there is no state sponsored protection available, take up pan fishing because anyone with a license can keep fish and even release the half dead ones.  :'(  Fishing clubs and federations should buy newspaper space to educate the public about C&R and bass mortality. Each federation should send messages to each club reminding them about proper livewell care and boater courtesy and safety. We all tend to forget. Other than that, if some clown cuts me off and is racing to a spot, I find his boat and circle it. If he asks why, I tell him why and show him my digital camera.