Glock woes, and a new SIG

[Micro]

I bought a Glock 30SF recently, despite all the internet posts that said they were problematic. I went through several hundred rounds without a hitch. I chocked the complaints up to typical internet hysteria.

Now I know better. This was my experience yesterday.

The slide failed to return to battery multiple times on just 10 rounds of hollow point ammo. I had multiple failures to return to battery on just a few rounds of of Winchester ball ammo. Then, not only did I have multiple failures to return to battery on 50 rounds of another brand, I had multiple rounds that failed to go off due to light primer strikes.

First time I've every had a gun that actually got worse as it was broken in.

So, upon exiting the range, I traded the gun. I'm just not going to try and fix a realtively new gun with under 1,000 rounds through it.

Here is my replacement. A new Sig Sauer P220R Carry in .45 ACP with SIG Lite night sights. If it fails to perform as expected, I'll trade it on an HK.

[firefightn15]

Jackpot micro, sweet ride! 8-)

[-HAWK-]

Interesting. So are those problems limited to the Glock 30SF?

[VolFan]

I've seen those same problems with Glock 23s as well, mostly with less expensive "practice" ammo.   Apparently some of the lower energy rounds don't have the oomphf to cycle the action.  And their firing pin spring seems to be weaker. I don't know if the 30 and 23 use the same spring or not.  Never had a problem with service ammo or with my 22.   Winchester seems to be having trouble with primers in a few lots of ammo as well, so that could be a contributing factor too.

[Micro]

The issue I experienced is almost exclusively a G30SF issue.  There have been reported issues with just about every Glock here and there, but that's typical for every model from every maker.   All my other Glocks were perfect.  I had 20,000+ rounds through a G21 I owned and shot constantly for years.  I can't remember any failures, though there may have been one here or there. 

Something about the G30SF has changed with recently manufactured guns.  The slide is rubbing across the trigger bar leaving a gouge.  This is almost universal on G30SF guns with serial numbers M**###.  Mine was an NNP### serial numbered gun.  Most people report the gouge, but only a few have reported the failures to return to battery.   Mine functioned perfectly for awhile, and then the symptoms started.  Other people have reported that the problems arise after awhile, not necessarily at the beginning.  That's why i find the whole thing bizarre.  Usually, you can shoot in a somewhat problematic gun.  Mine started out good and became problematic. 

Glock has recognized the issue and has released a new replacemetn trigger bar for the 30SF.  But people are reporting problems with that bar, too.  I decided not to bother.   I decided to just go with a gun that is highly regarded.

As far as other model Glocks, I think they are okay.  Right now, Glock as an issue with their .45 caliber SF models.  They need to recall them.

[skunked_again]

I bought a Glock 30SF recently, despite all the internet posts that said they were problematic. I went through several hundred rounds without a hitch. I chocked the complaints up to typical internet hysteria.

Now I know better. This was my experience yesterday.

The slide failed to return to battery multiple times on just 10 rounds of hollow point ammo. I had multiple failures to return to battery on just a few rounds of of Winchester ball ammo. Then, not only did I have multiple failures to return to battery on 50 rounds of another brand, I had multiple rounds that failed to go off due to light primer strikes.

First time I've every had a gun that actually got worse as it was broken in.

So, upon exiting the range, I traded the gun. I'm just not going to try and fix a realtively new gun with under 1,000 rounds through it.

Here is my replacement. A new Sig Sauer P220R Carry in .45 ACP with SIG Lite night sights. If it fails to perform as expected, I'll trade it on an HK.

youre going to love that sidearm. it loves to be shot.

[Bassn Blvd]

Here's what I know. Over 2500 cops on my police force. That equates to over 2500 Glocks. 600-1000 rounds shot through each gun each year. That's over 2milliion rounds a year at 800 rounds each.

I think we had less mis-feeds all year than you did in one day.

Me personally, I have shot over 7000 rounds through my Glock and have had only ONE jam.  And that was user error.

[RobbyZ5001]

Here's what I know. Over 2500 cops on my police force. That equates to over 2500 Glocks. 600-1000 rounds shot through each gun each year. That's over 2milliion rounds a year at 800 rounds each.

I think we had less mis-feeds all year than you did in one day.

Me personally, I have shot over 7000 rounds through my Glock and have had only ONE jam. And that was user error.

That is reassuring to hear that from you Bassn!

[Micro]

Glocks are ultra-reliable.  I have a G21SF that has never had a problem.  A regular G21 that I shot the hell out of with no problems.  A G36 that functioned flawlessly, even though it chewed up my middle finger.  And a G17 that rocked.  Glocks are awesome. 

Like I said, this issue surrounds the G30SF.  AFAIK, it doesn't even affect the G30, just the SF.  Apparently, there is some issue with the SF frame, rails, and/or tirgger bar. 

[Sam]

You broke your Glock?

What did you do wrong?

Just kidding.

Glad you got the SIG.

Merry Christmas! 

[bass or bass ?]

I'm strictly a S&W man.

[bigtimfish]

AHHHH! A Sig, a thing of beauty and very trustworthy. My father has a p226 and it is a bad mofo. Never a problem and on point. Congrats.

[Fishing Doug]

I had the same issue with my Glock 17. It would jam with cheap ammo but never had a problem with premium ammo. Anyway, that was enough for me to lose confidence in it. Not taking the chance of a jam if I ever get in a position that it 'has' to shoot.

Nice new rig, Micro.

[jdw174]

In my gunwriting days, I had one of the first Glocks to test for a write up.  I fired 3500 rounds thru it without cleaning, including a ton of lead bullet reloads.  It jammed once at around the 3500 mark due to the slide failing to fully go back into battery.  Cause was a small ring of lead from the reloads that built up around the chamber mouth.  I flicked it out with a pocketknife and fired another 3K rounds without problem.  I bought the gun when I finished the testing and won a lot of "mouse gun" matches with it at the local IPSC club.

I'm not a fan of "crunch-tickers" (DA first, SA followups), but the SIG is definitely the best of that lot IMO.  Had a little P226 that I wish was still around.  Fine firearms.

[Siebert Outdoors]

Nice gun.  Sigs are awesome.

I've never been a glock fan. 

[TommyBass]

Here's what I know. Over 2500 cops on my police force. That equates to over 2500 Glocks. 600-1000 rounds shot through each gun each year. That's over 2milliion rounds a year at 800 rounds each.

I think we had less mis-feeds all year than you did in one day.

Me personally, I have shot over 7000 rounds through my Glock and have had only ONE jam. And that was user error.

To me that says 2 things...

1) Glocks are evidentally cheap enough that a state can afford to buy that many for its officers.

2) They may still be somewhat reliable... as long as your officers are actually reporting every single misfire / jam.

To me glocks have their place (like stated above) but when it comes to reliability they fall middle to end of the pack.

Sigs are great guns and very reliable. They are used by the SEALS, Dept Homeland Security, Coast Guard, and many others. You don't see too many glocks in the upper teirs.

Hold them side by side and wiggle the slide on them... alot of the glocks have some minor play/wiggle.. I havn't found a SIG that wiggles at all.

Will a glock save your life from the bad guy? Probably a 99.999% chance it will, so I wouln't fret if you have one. Alot of people stand by them, which says something for them.

Personally I'm a Kimber guy.

[Bantam1]

The Sig 220 is one of the nicer .45's I have shot. I do not own one currently but it is on my list to purchase. I currently own an HK USP in .45 and a Para/Custom 1911. The HK has been 100% reliable from day one. It will cycle any ammo I put through it 

Nice purchase Micro! You will be happy with the Sig.

[Micro]

The HK USP is on my short list.  Awesome gun. 

[South FLA]

Hope RobbyZ5001 sees this thread maybe he will trade in his Glock for a Sig now .  My Sig P226 is one sweet gun though. Enjoy! 

[NOVA Angler]

I've seen those same problems with Glock 23s as well, mostly with less expensive "practice" ammo. Apparently some of the lower energy rounds don't have the oomphf to cycle the action. And their firing pin spring seems to be weaker. I don't know if the 30 and 23 use the same spring or not. Never had a problem with service ammo or with my 22. Winchester seems to be having trouble with primers in a few lots of ammo as well, so that could be a contributing factor too.

I have several thousand round through my G23 with no failures to speak of.  I've even experimented with heavier recoil springs and still no problem.  It's interesting to hear others describe glocks as not being reliable.  I was always under the impression that they were closer to the top of the list.  I think most of the negativity towards glocks is related to internet hysteria that Micro described, especially since glocks account for such a large poriton of the handguns out there.  I'm not questioning the problems surrounding the G30SF, just the overall attitude towards Glock.

[VolFan]

Let me be very clear...I carry that 22 every day and have shot 10's of thousands of rounds through it.  It gets a god cleaning after every session and  preventive maintainence every year.  I've had one misfire on a bad primer.  Never had any other problems with it.  Another point to bring up with this is, if you don't grip the gun firmly enough, you can affect how well the gun cycles.  Not saying anyone has limp wrists, just posting another idea. 

[skunked_again]

Let me be very clear...I carry that 22 every day and have shot 10's of thousands of rounds through it. It gets a god cleaning after every session and preventive maintenance every year. I've had one misfire on a bad primer. Never had any other problems with it. Another point to bring up with this is, if you don't grip the gun firmly enough, you can affect how well the gun cycles. Not saying anyone has limp wrists, just posting another idea.

which is why shooting weak hand youre more prone for problems.

i like all guns, being a gun nut. i rented a Sig 229 in .40 today and was impressed. having huge potato peeler hands limits me on grip size however. it took me a long time to break the habit of re-gripping the gun in-between rounds and shooting small frame guns does not give me the secure grip "feel" mid size guns do.

[done]

Last week I picked up a S&W M&P 40. I hit up everyone I knew around here for info on models. I looked at a Glock but got some advice from my sister and brother in law who both on cops.

On their force they are issues S&W 40 from the city. They have the option to give them back and purchase a 40 cal Glock on their own. A LOT did and they had issues, I should say the 2 women did as did some of the men. From what they told me, their problems were a result of a weaker grip on the weapon. The recoil would cause the weapon to jam (not a good feature for a cop).

The weight on the S&W's would lessen the recoil enough that they did not have these issues.

That being said the Glock I played with were very comfortable weapons, light, had some good power and for the handful of round I fired, did not jam. I just loved the feel of the S&W's. The recoil issue though was big for me since the weapon is to be for me AND my wife when I go on travel.

[Micro]

I think my next .45 ACP is going to be a Beretta Px4 F Storm.  Many knowledgeable folk are calling it the best polymer framed gun yet.  I've had the opportunity to handle them and they are the best feeling gun I've yet picked up.   Field stripping is the easiest I've seen on an auto.  I haven't fired one, but I'm impressed as heck so far. 

[bassnleo]

Last week I picked up a S&W M&P 40. I hit up everyone I knew around here for info on models. I looked at a Glock but got some advice from my sister and brother in law who both on cops.

On their force they are issues S&W 40 from the city. They have the option to give them back and purchase a 40 cal Glock on their own. A LOT did and they had issues, I should say the 2 women did as did some of the men. From what they told me, their problems were a result of a weaker grip on the weapon. The recoil would cause the weapon to jam (not a good feature for a cop).

The weight on the S&W's would lessen the recoil enough that they did not have these issues.

That being said the Glock I played with were very comfortable weapons, light, had some good power and for the handful of round I fired, did not jam. I just loved the feel of the S&W's. The recoil issue though was big for me since the weapon is to be for me AND my wife when I go on travel.

It's not necessarily all grip, that's part of it, it's the overall stance. A weak grip, arm position, and stance can cause the Glock to fail to eject a fired round. The gun relies on soild back pressure to complete a cycle of the slide. It's an easy fix and instantly points out someone who does not have proper shooting mechanics.

That being said, I've owned several Glocks (but not the one which started this thread). I am currently issued a .40 cal G23 and have had zero issues with it, and like Bassn Blvd I have thousands of rounds through mine.