Siebert Outdoors Posted January 25, 2008 Posted January 25, 2008 I built alot of this up over the last couple cold months. The scope will be changing soon. Gotta love the rights and freedoms we have. I love the USA! Quote
Super User burleytog Posted January 25, 2008 Super User Posted January 25, 2008 If I could stop buying rods & reels, I'd have the $$ to do something similar to one of mine. A vertical foregrip is starting to grow on me. I think I'll put one on a 6.8 SPC upper for next deer season. You need an EOTech or ACOG on that thing. Quote
thetr20one Posted January 25, 2008 Posted January 25, 2008 Beautiful rifle. That huge scope is a little overkill though. Would like to see it with a red dot for faster sighting. Do the deer in your area wear turbans or something? Is it a suppressive fire rifle or a short range sniper rifle? Sorry I just am having trouble Understanding this weapons purpose. 5.56 for deer? Throw that scope on a 7mm mag and I get it. I use a 50 cal. frontloader for all gun seasons here never needed a follow up shot yet. Knock on wood! I thought hunting was about getting close to the game and dispatching it as quick as possible. Still a beautiful rifle just confusing. Please don't consider this a bashing. Quote
Super User burleytog Posted January 25, 2008 Super User Posted January 25, 2008 Still a beautiful rifle just confusing. What is confusing? :-? Quote
Super User grimlin Posted January 25, 2008 Super User Posted January 25, 2008 Gman,that is one awesome gun you got. Quote
Siebert Outdoors Posted January 25, 2008 Author Posted January 25, 2008 A vertical foregrip is starting to grow on me. I think I'll put one on a 6.8 SPC upper for next deer season. You need an EOTech or ACOG on that thing. Yeah that is the only scope I had laying around. I had a good deal on a acog but didnt want to drop that much when I could buy a leupold. I've been kicking around the 6.8spc upper too. I just about pulled the trigger on it. I just need about 500 bucks. I want one real bad. Also that front grip makes it more controlable. not much on a simi auto. Shooting a full auto you can notice a world of difference in controlability. Its easier to hold down on target. Dont worry its not illegal with a class 3 license. So there isnt anything illegal going on here. Has something to do with where I am. but enough about that. thetr20one No offense taken. The scope is extreme over kill on that gun. Just didnt have a smaller one laying around. I use it for varmint hunting. Probably take it out coyote hunting tomorrow. I could deer hunt with it I've got smaller mags for it to stay within the wildlife code. If you dont express your rights you dont have rights. Know your laws and rights and enjoy them to the fullest. Many Americans have given their lives for the freedoms we have and we all should respect that and enjoy and express what they have given us. A member on another forum has a great signature. It reads: If you are reading this thank a teacher. If you are reading this in English thank a soldier. Quote
Low_Budget_Hooker Posted January 25, 2008 Posted January 25, 2008 LAME!!! Use a rod and reel like everyone else!! Quote
llPa1nll Posted January 25, 2008 Posted January 25, 2008 LAME!!! Use a rod and reel like everyone else!! Couldnt agree more, dont you just hate cheaters taking sight fishing to the next level... ;D Quote
FishingBuds Posted January 25, 2008 Posted January 25, 2008 Love the gun, love the look. I once put a BSA with a 7inch sun shield on a marlin 22, it got the comments during squirle season ;D You've got my supprot Quote
Super User burleytog Posted January 25, 2008 Super User Posted January 25, 2008 I've been kicking around the 6.8spc upper too. I just about pulled the trigger on it. I just need about 500 bucks. I want one real bad. http://www.ko-tonics.com/ Everything I've read about them has been good. Quote
thetr20one Posted January 25, 2008 Posted January 25, 2008 Gman I fully support your ownership of this bad boy. I personaly own 2 russian ak-47s semi auto of course. But here in Ohio these rifles are limited to recreational use. We buy cases of ammo and shoot the crap out of cinder blocks,pumpkins,melons and whatever else happens to need destroyed. The confusing part was just the real purpose of the weapon and the perceived purpose of it. I am a purist and personally would choose open sights over the luepold and have found a red dot with a small MOA dot to be perfect for the MP4 . In a civilian world these are no more than sporting rifles. I guess coyote hunting would be ok. For coyotes I use an over under 20guage/.222 it's perfect! P.S. the 100 round dual drum mag would look alot more intimidating, if you can find one! Quote
Josh VanderMeer Posted January 26, 2008 Posted January 26, 2008 HOLY CRAP i didnt know those things were legal.... up here in Canada we arent even allowed hand guns! Quote
FishingBuds Posted January 26, 2008 Posted January 26, 2008 HOLY CRAP i didnt know those things were legal.... up here in Canada we arent even allowed hand guns! Man that sucks for ya, read today about Toronto Mayor David Miller, when will they try to ban crime instead????? http://www.nationalpost.com/opinion/story.html?id=253889 Quote
Brian_Reeves Posted January 26, 2008 Posted January 26, 2008 If you're looking for a new upper reciever, check out the ones for H&K. I forget the model number, but I shot one while in Iraq. It's a very, very noticable difference. While I'm thinking about it...want a stock market tip? The Army may be switching all Infantry M4's to the H&K upper reciever in 2010. I already bought shares, just in case they actually do. As far as scopes on an M4. Red dot scopes suck. They are cheap and are bad about letting you down when you really need them. (Please argue this point with me if you want story time ;D) ACOGs are better than EOTechs because of the no battery issue and EOTechs have no magnification. EOTechs also have issues with paralax after about 200 yards. ACOGs with an iron sight or modified with reflex sights are you're best bet. Or better yet, use an EOTech for a pistol, mount it to the top of your ACOG, and you're set. Believe it of not, this rig will drill close range targets EXTREMELY fast, faster than any red dot scope. Get out to longer ranges, and the ACOG takes over. I like how you look the front sight post off and opted for the flip ups. Nice. Only one question...where do you mount your bayonette? ;D Quote
thetr20one Posted January 26, 2008 Posted January 26, 2008 Cheap? Being in the military you should know cheap. Almost everything the military uses is manufactured by the lowest bidder! Your armory problably has piles of non-working malfunctioning M16,M4,240 series,S.A.Ws. and just about every other weapon you can find. Even your TA-50 is problablably made in China now. Your berets are. Right! Just because it's a Colt doesn't mean quality. The H-k upper sounds like a band-aid for a bullet wound. Most of the military weapons need revamped or replaced. H-K,Barrett, even Colt all have prototypes that would be viable. The M4 is still basically a Vietnam era weapon in a smaller package. Somewhat reliable but still has the tendency to quit when you need it most. After serving in Iraq I have the utmost respect for you but you have to know the civilian world carries higher quality weapons than the military. (when was the last time you had the choice to upgrade your reciever,barrel,trigger sear,firingpin,barrel,or springs?) I was not talking a BSA red dot! Almost all riflescope manufacturers make a red dot or holographic sighting system that are as or more reliable than ANYTHING you will find in your armory. Lets be real the M4 is more for close quarters than long range shooting. If I was in combat in the open with a M4 I would hope my man with the 240 bravo or S.A.W was near! Quote
Brian_Reeves Posted January 26, 2008 Posted January 26, 2008 I wish the army would switch to a 7.62mm assault rifle, but the chances of that happening aren't at all that much. Being in the Infantry, I've had the ability and time to shoot Trijicon ACOG's, EOTech's, and virtually every scope known to man. We are encouraged to put our own optics on our weapons. I've shot civilian red dot scopes as well as the military, and yes, they all suck. The reason is that any red dot style scope features at least a 40mm viewing tube. That little red dot in that big ole tube makes paralax a problem for shooting any distances, even short range known distances(not close combat). EOTech's have the same problem, but since their lens is much smaller and the reticule is large, paralax is less of a problem. ACOG's do not have a problem with paralax at all, since it is a fixed sight and not a projected image. As far as the M4 and it's distance shooting...there isn't very often at all when shots over 300m are required in combat on the basic level. Most of it is acros fields, down streets, or house to house. The size of the weapon (M4) is about perfect to meet these demands. Three and four hundred meter shots are very easy and the rifle is really accurate out to those ranges. It is actually accurate out to about 800meters, short barrel and all, but it lacks knockdown power. The reason why the 5.56mm bullet is preferred by the US military isn't because of cost, it's because of it's speed and level trajectory and accuracy at range. It takes a 7.62mm much longer to travel the same distance as a 5.56mm. This increases our odds of at least wounding our opponent and gives us a better first strike capability. Besides, it takes more resources to treat a wounded man than to leave a dead man. The 5.56 is a much more deadly round than people give it credit for. The SAW fires the same bullet as the M16/M4, just at a much faster rate of fire. The SAW is viewed by us in the military as a piece of junk while most of us cherish our M4 and M16 rifles. I've only had an M4 or M16A4 fail on me when I failed to perform proper maintenance. They are much better than you're giving them credit for (when properly cared for). Sure, better stuff is available, but our stuff ain't that bad. And a side note, our arms room doesn't have any broken or malfunctioning weapons. We turned them in long ago. All working stuff now. Quote
thetr20one Posted January 26, 2008 Posted January 26, 2008 I understand ballistics and agree the M4 is good to 300+ yards, but like you say the energy the bullet carries past that distance drops dramatically. I like the S.A.W because of it's rate of fire not the round. It delivers the suppresion fire,you know it's nice to have a S.A.W gunner in your squad. The 5.56 was developed for maximum damage without a heavy round. The 7.62 is very heavy in comparison,other than being heavy itself thats why the 240 Bravo needs 2 people to carry the components and ammo. I am happy to hear the ARMY is getting it's stuff strait. Quote
Brian_Reeves Posted January 27, 2008 Posted January 27, 2008 We went out in sector a lot without a SAW at all. It's weight, the weight of the ammo, and inconsistancy of operation made it more of a burden than an asset. When they work properly, they rock. Just finding those few that won't jam every 5th round is tough to do. The 240 can actually be manned by one guy, but must be transported by two. Usually we don't take it on patrols unless we plan on making a hasty D, LPOP, COP, or SKT somewhere. It's weight just makes it impractical for clearing operations or presence patrols, which is our bread and butter over there now. The M4 can deliver a nice suppressive fire if volley fired and controlled. A squad of riflemen with M203 grenade launchers provides tons of suppressive fire. But even with all of that, you're right that it does not transfer energy well at all. It's too fast and too light and lacks the knockdown that would be really, really nice. I would LOVE a semi automatic 7.62mm assault rifle with the advanced rail system, and a short barrel. Accuracy out to 600-700 yards with knockdown power. Kinda like this....http://www.springfield-armory.com/armory.php?model=18 And sorry about the hijack GMAN. To get it back on topic, is that a surefire light?? ;D Quote
Siebert Outdoors Posted January 27, 2008 Author Posted January 27, 2008 No not yet. Its a laser. Its freaky how accurate it is too. I sighted the scope in at 50yds and adjusted the laser to the center of the scope. Its dead nuts. Just on closer or farther targets you have to figure in some trig. Otherwise you will miss because of the angle the laser sits. Quote
thetr20one Posted January 28, 2008 Posted January 28, 2008 Brian. Have you had the opportunity to see or operate the Barrett .50 anti sniper rifle?That my friend is one impressive weapon and the only weapon currently manufactured by a private company for the military. Over 3000 meters of pure accuracy semi auto and very low recoil. AWESOME. Cant go wrong with a rifle that can penatrate a armored vehicle and do incredible damage at those ranges. Quote
thetr20one Posted January 28, 2008 Posted January 28, 2008 Brian I also realize the ammo n tripod carrier for the S.A.W gunner also carries your beloved MP-4. Quote
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