Was 9/11 so long ago ???

[Guest avid]

In a filing made public Friday, lawyers for a Guantanamo detainee have asked a federal court to examine the way he was questioned while in secret CIA custody for three years and decide whether he was tortured.If the court takes up the request, it would shift from Congress to the courts the ongoing debate over whether so-called enhanced interrogation techniques authorized by President Bush against al Qaida suspects included illegal torture.

 (Emphasis mine)

I think the days of civilized warfare are a quaint relic of the past.

The determination of Al Qaida to blow up innocents in it's quest for global de-stabilization are well documented.  

There is no doubt in my mind that Al Qaida are using every resource at their disposal to obtain nuclear material for a dirty bomb.

I have no doubt that they will not hesitate to use any weapon of mass destruction they can get their hands on to kill as many people as possible, preferably Americans.

Torture is repulsive.  But so is the video taped beheading of civilians.  I say we have to use any prudent means of locating and killing these mindless fanatics.  

[frogtog]

A lot of people don't like George but he jumped right into the hornets nest over there. I have noticed that there hasn't been to many bombing over here lately either. I guess they are sitting back waiting for one of those other bozo's to get

in office.

[fourbizz]

To be detained for 3 years means that at the least, the prisoner is heavily associated with these psychopaths.

To prevent another 3,000 innocent lives from being lost, we must do whatever is in our power.

The "civilized" war to which you refer never existed. But the generals of old did not tie one hand behind their backs and then try to rebuild in their wake.  They accomplished their goals through the means neccesary and when the dust cleared, then the healing could start. They did not fight with one hand and try to make the country better than before with the other.

We made the mistake of not going into it with absolute and unerring conviction. Sure everyone was pi$$#d, but we weren't ready to go the distance.

It sucks, and I feel horrible for our soldiers who are not allowed to do what needs to be done.

[Fish Man]

Bravo Avid, we have had several big discussions in my civics class so far this year on the topic and my class usually feels the exact opposite of what u said and i usually am considered the bad guy, i agree there have been no bombing here since 9/11 and what is one prisioners life compared to the whole population of a city,

[tyrius.]

Don't really want to get into it here as bassresource isn't the proper message board for it, but everyone needs to take a hard look at what America's ideals are and what they should be worth before casually tossing your opinion about.

And from a history standpoint, "civilized warfare" has never existed.  That is unless you count wars prior to the American Revolution where the soldiers just stood in a big line and shot at the other line of soldiers.

[Fish Man]

im sure this will be labeled political but so be it, as far as american ideals are i know we believe in equality and things of that nature but still are our ideals letting cities of innocent people be blown to oblivion because one terrorist feels he was treated wrong? also the ideals that we have and documents like the bill of rights, constitution, etc were all based on what the founding fathers felt were right and that was way before we had masses of people willing to blow themselves up to kill innocent civilions, times have changed and so shouls our ideals and beliefs in order to make out country a safer place to live

P.S im not typing this to start a debate or anything of that nature just throwing it ou there, thanks  

[Sam]

Avid,

Americans just forget stuff.

Something as horrible as 9/11; WWII; Korean War; Viet Nam Conflict; Exxon Valdez oil spill; past transgressions by our elected officials; the cold blood murders of Americans across the globe; the Kennedy assasination; the great things Ronlad Regan did; and so on are just forgotten.

Since 9/11 did not affect the vast majority of US citizens, we don't care. We live in our own fishbowl, doing things with our families, friends, churches and coworkers and life just goes on as if nothing occurred.

This is why we have corrupt politicians in office; we have more than 50% of our tax dollars going to social programs that do not work and not for the defense of the country; why immigration is out of control; and the list goes on.

We just forget the bad stuff.

Tonight my wife and I saw a wonderful play, Swingtime Canteen, about five girls on tour for WWII in London.  Songs were from the 40s and they were great.  Outstanding play if you ever get the chance to see it.

But we have forgotten WWII.  Very little time is spent studying what lead up to WWI and WWII and their details in our schools.  

So to answer your question...no, 9/11 was not so long ago.  We just don't remember it.

[edbassmaster]

Tortured for three years while being detained...that is cruel. The families of the 9/11 victims will only be tortured for the rest of their lives :'(

[jeremyt]

Yes 9/11 was too long ago. I say this because most of America has forgotten ( out of sight, out of mind). I have spent a total of 21 months in Iraq. The general public says that it has nothing to do with 9/11. I say crap, there has been a major turn around in the life that Iraqi's live. Terrorism runs rampant in that region, so yes we should be there. As much as it pains me to say it as I pray to god that no one (civilian) has to experience. I think that if the attacks would have hit the west coast (hollywood) that the outlook on this would be different. Just a humble opinion from a dumb ole jar head.

[Bassn Blvd]

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/years/2007/0524072torture2.html

[Fish Man]

wow some of those are the kinds of things i thought only existed in nightmares

[Bassn Blvd]

There have been attacks.  Bombs have been recovered along with 600 AK47's and 500,000 rounds of ammunition with documents to blow up the U.K in New York since 911.   The items were located here in the states.

[Fish Man]

yea but what i mean is that those were all foiled terror attempts and if we didnt  torture any terrorists to recover the information they may have been able to carry out those plans

[fourbizz]

They have not been tortured. They have been questioned with fervor.

[Big T]

What we do is not torture. Torture is what happened to our POW's in Vietnam, while the tree hugging hippies were over here were protesting like they are now. Our soldiers do fine job at protecting the rights of the average American. I do not get this mentality of protect the rights of foreign criminals. Just the humble opinion of an Average American who owes alot of gratitude to out Armed Forces.

Big T

[Glenn]

Avid - you're going to give me heartburn.

This topic teeters on the edge of being too political for these forums.  The mods and I are keeping a very close watch on this one.  Fair warning.

[Bassn Blvd]

Yea Avid!  What are you doing out of photography class anyway.

[Gatorbassman]

The way our society is now many people will never understand that they don't just want to kill our troups. They wan't all Americans dead. Every man, woman, and child, and anyone who associates with us. Do we let them go back home after a few years in prison? Only to turn around and try to kill us again. This is a different type of enemy. Unlike any we have ever fought before. How are we supposed to combat them? With a slap on the hand and a "See ya later."? Because we will see them later.

[Guest avid]

Avid - you're going to give me heartburn.

This topic teeters on the edge of being too political for these forums.  The mods and I are keeping a very close watch on this one.  Fair warning.

OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOpppps

nevermind

Sorry Glenn.  I didn't even think about the forum rules.  my mistake.

I would like to add one thing before I zip my lip.

where I lived in New York, I watched the smoke rise from ground zero for months.

You could actually smell it.

It was a horrible daily reminder of the horrors of islamic terrorism.

I wanted everyone that had anything to do with that nightmare dead.

I wanted Al Qaida exterminated.  

I still do.

:-X

[roadwarrior]

Sorry Glenn. I didn't even think about the forum rules.

Duh?  

:

[Guest avid]

Sorry Glenn.  I didn't even think about the forum rules.

Duh?  

:

You gotta be kidding me.  

Tell me you didn't know where your global warming thread was going to go?

I mean it's not like it doesn't  get heated and political EVERYTIME it comes up right?

[roadwarrior]

C'mon avid, just playing. I wasn't really talking about this thread. :-*

My take is kill them all and let God sort 'em out.

I haven't forgotten and I will NEVER forgive.

p.s. Global Warming was THE topic in the news this week. We had seven pages without much politics and I closed the thread when the traffic slowed so it wouldn't turn into "one of those".

[bighed]

C'mon avid, just playing. I wasn't really talking about this thread. :-*

My take is kill them all and let God sort 'em out.

I haven't forgotten and I will NEVER forgive.

p.s. Global Warming was THE topic in the news this week. We had seven pages without much politics and I closed the thread when the traffic slowed so it wouldn't turn into "one of those".

What he said

[maxke01]

Our war is in Iraq when we need to be in Afghan!

[PaparockArk]

We are in Afghanistan and have been since before Iraq.

Our nation today is not number with the same type people as it was after Pearl Harbor. Such should have nothing to do with politics. It should have to do with the character and understanding of the people. We face not an organize army that fights according to the Geneva convention nor is even willing to sign it but acts more as organized murderers. Some say they worry about how our soldiers may be treated. Really? Now these types have tortured our people by cutting of their heads on videos, dismembering our soldiers to be found by their comrades, targeting unarmed women and children by rape, bombs, assassination , and ripping their bodies apart as examples to others, as reprisals, or just to try to foment a war between rival factions of their fellow Muslims. All this and still some think pouring a little water up only three of the worse mass murderers noses is torture which by the way many of our men experience as part of their training to resist such interrogation. That saved thousands of lives according to those involved in the events because of all the information the three top terrorists have revealed. However you know as well as I do that the terrorists have been murdering, mutilating, beheading, and Truly Torturing our soldiers and civilians anytime they wish with the full knowledge of and impunity from being held responsible by the governments were they are operating. So what will water boarding the top terrorists to save lives change? This is not politics this is rational thinking. You can choose to side with the terrorists such as Khalid Sheikh Mohammed but once he started talking he never stopped was never water-boarded again, and in hours and hours of conversation with his interrogators, often over a cup of tea, he poured out his soul and the murderous deeds he committed.

"He was sitting across the table from his interrogator, and he just blurted out, 'I killed Daniel Pearl. I killed him Hahal .' There was no water-boarding, no belly slapping; just two guys sitting across the table having a cup of tea."