Best Modern Low-Stretch Copolymer / Mono (Life After Defier Armilo)

[MN Fisher]

Just now, FishTank said:

I have since moved on to other lines l like better. 

Ya, I don't use it on all my rigs - I've got InvizX, Sniper, Spro Gouken and some Tatsu for FC...832, Smackdown and YZ Super for braid - testing Revolve this year, and Seige for Mono.

 

What ever gives you confidence is the line you should use. 😊

[FishTank]

4 minutes ago, Catt said:

 

So you never retie Flourcarbon?

 

After 4 years of normal retieing hooks or lures you still have a full spool?

 

Interesting 😉

 

Not all FC but the Tatsu, yes. I only retied when I got really stuck or changed lures. I always check my line from time to time as well.  The spool got low on this reel, I changed it out last year. I can't remember what member it was but they had a similar experience with this line.  I also use a San Diego Jam knot. I seem to use less line with this knot the way I tie it. 

[Catt]

With the exception of braid I retie way more than that. Even with the San Diego Jam knot you're looking at a foot of line. 

 

I make a lot of long casts in heavy cover, there's no way to guarantee me there's no damage anywhere on the line...it's getting changed period!

 

Everyone has their own personal repertoire of confusion that works for them. 

[Team9nine]

1 hour ago, BassKat said:

Thanks, FishTank, that's an absolutely relevant additional factor. However, I very regularly fish incoming storms and throw baitcasters in sustained 30-35+mph winds with even higher gusts. This leads to a good number of overuns and I lose confidence in fluorocarbon afterward. I also opt for bank fishing in storms which leads to losing a lot of lures and line. Even if I'm in a boat, I fearlessly fish structure so there's a constant loss of some amount of line going on. 

This is the most telling aspect in your case. If backlashes and hangups that have to be pulled until something breaks are commonplace, then fluoro isn’t the answer for you. You’re much better off with some type of mono/copoly. I’d even hesitate to recommend a hybrid or coated fluoro line…and I’d never recommend Floroclear - lol. My guess is your first early break-off with it won’t be your last 😉

[woolleyfooley]

58 minutes ago, FishTank said:

 

Not all FC but the Tatsu, yes. I only retied when I got really stuck or changed lures. I always check my line from time to time as well.  The spool got low on this reel, I changed it out last year. I can't remember what member it was but they had a similar experience with this line.  I also use a San Diego Jam knot. I seem to use less line with this knot the way I tie it. 

I’m a tatsu lover as well. You can buy 1,000 yard spools for $150-200 bucks on amazon. It was cheaper a few months ago. Not sure why the price went up.

15 minutes ago, Catt said:

With the exception of braid I retie way more than that. Even with the San Diego Jam knot you're looking at a foot of line. 

 

I make a lot of long casts in heavy cover, there's no way to guarantee me there's no damage anywhere on the line...it's getting changed period!

 

Everyone has their own personal repertoire of confusion that works for them. 

How often do you change line?

[A-Jay]

9 minutes ago, woolleyfooley said:

I’m a tatsu lover as well. You can buy 1,000 yard spools for $150-200 bucks on amazon. It was cheaper a few months ago. Not sure why the price went up.

How often do you change line?

Tariffs

A-Jay

[MediumMouthBass]

4 hours ago, MN Fisher said:

I swap out the YZH on my rigs about once every three years. Since I only put 65-70yds on top of the backing, a 600yd spool will give me 8 re-spools. So $11 into 24 years is $0.46 a year per reel that I use it on.

I only buy YZH when Midway is running a 50% off sale or when DSG adds it to their buy 3 get 3 free deals. I pay $5.50 for one spool and i can fill up around 4 casting reels (without backing), and ive gotten up to 3 years out of it. The YZH i had on several reels that were 2-3 years old were about 75-85% full. Still getting great distance with my T wing Tatulas but not like i would if they were at full capacity. On all the reels when i pulled off the line it felt like it did when i put it on, practically new even after being in a hot or cold car 8 months out of the year. But i didnt like the stain it had from fishing the river the past few years so i changed it.

For 1 600 yard spool that will fill 4 casting reels with the average lifespan being 3 years at most i would pay $0.46 per reel each year. 

 

4 hours ago, FishTank said:

Not all FC but the Tatsu, yes. I only retied when I got really stuck or changed lures. I always check my line from time to time as well.  The spool got low on this reel, I changed it out last year. I can't remember what member it was but they had a similar experience with this line.  I also use a San Diego Jam knot. I seem to use less line with this knot the way I tie it. 

I think the reason so many see fluorocarbon as a line that cant last long is because of how many people talk about how their line breaks so much or they just run out of it frequently from retying/cutting it off to retie yet again. Which is caused by 4 things IMO.

#1 the Palomar knot, if tied incorrectly like crossing the line it will weaken it. And fail at some point.

#2 line burns from not wetting the line, again weakening the knot.

#3 pulling to hard when synching the line to fully tighten the knot, on lighter lb test i would notice the line would have ridges in it afterwards? Thats not the correct wording but it was odd, and it would have a slight discoloration too, it kind of wouldnt be clear. So that would mean id have to cut it off and retie.

#4 abrasion, not sure about every brand. But all the ones i used would get chewed up by rocks, and destroyed by Zebra mussels from the knot to 6' up the line. Along with getting sliced through by pickerel.

Having to cut that much line off from that takes a toll on how much is left on the spool.

 

When i used fluoro for trout fishing in creeks i would go through alot of line, i used the Palomar knot, and got stuck on rocks/overhead trees many times a week that would often break the line after a few tugs, and then having to cut the line and retie if it got burned. I would on average go through 2 spools of fluoro between 1-3 months. The reels would have 1/2-1/3 of line remaining by then and casting distance was very poor. Then when i started bass fishing i would use a ned rig with fluoro as a leader, i would break that off after a few seconds of pulling whenever i got stuck while bank fishing. Couldve been just how lighter lb fluoro is when stuck, couldve been the brand, couldve been the Palomar tied incorrectly, or maybe i didnt get the knot wet enough and it burned. It became to costly for me to justify buying anymore, and to much hassle to deal with.

 

I believe @FishTank when he says his fluoro lasts years, for one reason and one reason only. He said he uses the San Diego jam knot. Maybe if i had learned that knot years ago when i used fluoro my opinion on fluoro would be different than it is today. 

No matter how much we can argue about which line is better, i think all of us can agree no matter which line being used the SDJ is a god send.

 

[BassKat]

Team9nine, thanks for your input on Fluorclear. Based on what I'm seeing, it's probably important to note that TT's good Fluorclear review seems to predate their employment of an abrasion tester! I'll pull the plug and move toward testing based on the great feedback here.

[Catt]

46 minutes ago, woolleyfooley said:

How often do you change line?

 

More often than every 4 years 😉

 

[Shadow1]

I have used YZH in the past and liked it very much. Had a friend give me a spool of McCoys Mean Green. Haven't looked back. Very manageable and strong. Drop shotting in Canada 2 years ago. Fishing on a bluff wall in 7-10 feet of water. Cast out let it soak for a minute, my line starts moving off, set the hook, and my drag starts buzzing. Quite literally 10 minutes later, a 40" Northern is in the net! 10 lb 832 braid with a 6lb Mean Green leader.  Enough said about strength. 

[FishTank]

2 hours ago, Catt said:

With the exception of braid I retie way more than that. Even with the San Diego Jam knot you're looking at a foot of line. 

 

I make a lot of long casts in heavy cover, there's no way to guarantee me there's no damage anywhere on the line...it's getting changed period!

 

Everyone has their own personal repertoire of confusion that works for them. 

 

Maybe I tie mine short or something. I don't think I use a foot of line when I tie that knot.  I might cut off a few inches but that's about it. 

 

I also make long casts but around 120 feet or less with the reel (Steez SV TW) that had the Tatsu on it. I use this set up for Texas Rigged softplastic. You would think it would take a beating but the line lasted. 

 

One thing I would like to mention.... I am not saying all fluorocarbon lines are great. Just the ones I like. Kind of convenient, I know.  I have fished several I have not cared for but I have narrowed it down to handful and I continue to try new stuff as it comes out, if it's something I need. 

 

I knew I could find who it was if I dug deep enough....

 

 

 

[J Francho]

Those reels are part of drop shot set ups and I don't need the spool to full to the lip for vertical drops. It makes no sense to me to discard perfectly good line and refill. I've refilled those reels two seasons ago or so. They'll be fine this spring. 

[FishTank]

6 hours ago, MN Fisher said:

Ya, I don't use it on all my rigs - I've got InvizX, Sniper, Spro Gouken and some Tatsu for FC...832, Smackdown and YZ Super for braid - testing Revolve this year, and Seige for Mono.

 

What ever gives you confidence is the line you should use. 😊

What do you think of the line from Spro? 

[MN Fisher]

5 minutes ago, FishTank said:

What do you think of the line from Spro? 

I really didn't get much of a chance to really test it as I was shore-bound and it was on my main jig rig. But it seemed okay...I'd compare it favorably to InvizX, but it's price is higher, so I'd probably pass on it....it was given to me as part of a gift package, not purchased by me.

[BassKat]

Since a lot of people recommend YZH and Ultragreen and TT ran tests on them, I ran some analysis using TT's findings while making the assumption that the manufacturer's tendency to understate strength and underreport diameter would be uniform enough between offerings to determine which line-tests are most comparable between brands and draw some possible inferences about how the products compare. 

 

TT's findings on 10lb Ultragreen would indicate that Ultragreens 8lb offering is actually .0116" with 12lb tensile strengh and knot strength of 8.64lbs. Although both were good on stretch (lack of) / sensitivity, Ultragreen had about a 20% edge over YZH. On abrasion resistance, where I place a high premium, Ultragreen had a substantial 85.7% advantage over YZH, which I don't trust. The guys at TT reported having much better on-water experiences, and too many of you have reported the same. There's no doubt that these less expensive lines have bad batches and bad sections, and I think that's at play here.

 

To compare apples with Ultragreen v YZH, it's UG 8lb detailed above vs YZH 10lb, which is listed by Yo-Zuri and confirmed by TT as .012", with a 13.4lb tensile strength and knot strength of 8.71lbs. The two offerings' knot strengths being so close is why I plan to test 8lb Ultragreen v. 10lb YZH as roughly equal offerings.

 

Before leaving TT, I looked at other copoly/mono reviews; the testing of Super Natural seemed to validate my thoughts that it's a fine open water line, but maybe not the best for tangling with heavy cover as I always do. 

 

Where things got interesting was TT had a review on the original P-Line. Surprisingly, adjusted according to the percentage variances experienced by TT on the 12-lb, the 6lb-rated test advertised at .0084", but projected at .0089 with a projected tensile strength of 9.54 and knot strength of 8.34lbs ALMOST could compare to the lines above. The P-Line original 8lb, following the same logic, is advertised at .00949" but would actually be .0101" with a projected tensile strength of 12.72lbs and knot strength of 11.12. This is a line that is 15-19% smaller than the chosen Ultragreen and YZH lines above, with seemingly 27-28% more strength. On stretch/sensitivity, it falls right between YZH and UG (all three are good), and the abrasion resistance tested very good at about 77% of Ultragreen's really impressive abrasion resistance.

 

So my next question is does anyone have any experience with P-Line Original? 

[FishTank]

2 minutes ago, MN Fisher said:

I really didn't get much of a chance to really test it as I was shore-bound and it was on my main jig rig. But it seemed okay...I'd compare it favorably to InvizX, but it's price is higher, so I'd probably pass on it....it was given to me as part of a gift package, not purchased by me.

 

I saw it before Christmas a local shop and was curious. It was on sale, maybe clearance, for $12 but I had just placed a JDM order for line. Maybe I should have jumped on it.  

[MN Fisher]

2 minutes ago, BassKat said:

YZH 10lb, which is listed by Yo-Zuri and confirmed by TT as .012", with a 13.4lb tensile strength

Interesting - the IGFA got different results on their tests of YZH

[BassKat]

Yes, on the 10lb test, TT reported an average tensile strength of 13.4lbs vs IGFA's 16.5.  Like the questionable abrasion test results, I chalk it up to variances with lower priced lines. The good news is the candidates test good to great depending on the batch I guess.

[rangerjockey]

8 hours ago, FishTank said:

What do you think of the line from Spro? 

I fished it last summer and was very happy with it. I don't know who makes it for them but it fishes like Invisx.

[BassKat]

For your input, here's my round-one plan. In reading about Ultragreen, YZH, and P-Line Original, it seems that, because Ultragreen is reportedly a little stiffer and more expensive, I'm going to try it on my heavy-cover jig rod. Between YZH and P-Line Original, it seems P-Line Original is a little more supple than the other two, so I'm going to try it for medium-action power finesse applications. Then, because YZH sounds like such a great all-purpose line, I'm going to try it on an application or two falling in between.

 

I think all three of these lines will be plenty sensitive given the rods I fish, so I'm mostly trying to evaluate these (and other lines) pursuing above-average abrasion resistance while maintaining castability (lack of excessive memory) as it relates to both distance and accuracy. CXX is on my radar too (as well as others that have been mentioned), but I'm concerned CXX, and perhaps Ultragreen too, may be a little too stiff and memory intensive for me. 

 

If any of you have experience with 2 or more of these lines, please weigh in on my thoughts/plans. I'll be reporting on round one after prespawn. Thanks!

[BassKat]

For what it may be worth (probably not a ton), I researched line release dates for some chronological appreciation. 

- Big Game (1959)  >  P-Line Original, CX, & Fluoroclear (1982)  >  Sensation (1998)  >  Ultragreen (2008)  >  Yo-Zuri Hybrid, Izorline Platinum, Gamma Polyflex, & P-Line CXX (2010-2011)  >  *Izorline XXX (???, after Platinum)  >  Sufix Advance (2018)

 

Importantly, McCoy has been around since the 30s, but certainly constructed Mean Green as a copoly at a much later date I could not find.

 

Since 2008, based only on my reading (no personal experience), it seems Ultragreen, CXX, & Platinum fill the slightly stiffer, a touch more sensitive, a touch more abrasive resistant, a touch more memory category. And Yo-Zuri Hybrid and Izorline XXX strike a balance, while Mean Green, Gamma Polyflex, and Suffix Advance lean toward more manageability with perhaps a little less abrasion resistance. 

[Motoboss]

On 2/15/2025 at 3:15 PM, rangerjockey said:

Would anyone fish flouro on a crank bait rod if money were on the line ? I've been doing it for 10 years or so.

I use Invisx or Tatsu 12 and 10 lb.

 

Tried Mean Green but was just too unruly. P-Line Fluro’ but didn’t seem to be abrasion resistant enough 
 

YoZuri T7 for me 10# jerk baits M/F, 12# bladed baits MH/F and 16# t-rig and jigs H/F.
Smooth as butter, strong like bull.

[Team9nine]

1 hour ago, BassKat said:

For what it may be worth (probably not a ton), I researched line release dates for some chronological appreciation. 

- Big Game (1959)  >  P-Line Original, CX, & Fluoroclear (1982)  >  Sensation (1998)  >  Ultragreen (2008)  >  Yo-Zuri Hybrid, Izorline Platinum, Gamma Polyflex, & P-Line CXX (2010-2011)  >  *Izorline XXX (???, after Platinum)  >  Sufix Advance (2018)

 

Importantly, McCoy has been around since the 30s, but certainly constructed Mean Green as a copoly at a much later date I could not find.

 

If I might, some clarification on dating specific line brands based on a historical news search. Trilene introduced their original nylon fishing line back in 1959, but the Big Game branded line didn't come out until 1985. P-line as a company was founded in 1982, but Floroclear came out around Dec. 2000, and their CXX line dates to 1995. The earliest P-line reference I found was in 1985. The earliest YZH reference I found was in 2000. Mccoy Mean Green dated to 1993. Maxima Ultragreen was referenced to 1980 at its earliest. Izorline as a company dates to 1973 and was founded by Russ Izor. The line was originally manufactured by DuPont for him. Izorline Platinum dates back to 1998. Berkley Sensation = 2001.

[J Francho]

Those dates make more sense to me. 

[BassKat]

Thanks for the clarification, Team9nine!