Why arent more reels like this(Quantum smoke s3)

[MediumMouthBass]

4 hours ago, woolleyfooley said:

Which daiwa and Shimano reel models are made in China?

Most budget oriented reels $60-150 from both brands are either made in China, Thailand, Vietnam, or some other country. Only the more premium or a select few popular reels are made in Japan.

If you look it up, both brands have "fabrication facilities" in almost a dozen countries.

[KP Duty]

Nice.  The S3 has a closet fanbase, and a crapload of glowing reviews on TW.  

[LonnieP]

2 hours ago, woolleyfooley said:

Which daiwa and Shimano reel models are made in China?

Tatulas are made in Thailand 

[zell_pop1]

Daiwa makes reels all over Asia, Shimano either in their Malaysian factory or Japan  

[FishTank]

I had a couple of Smoke reels and one Tour S3. I ended up selling them. They just weren't getting used. I had no issues with them. They were just taking a back seat to my other reels.  I had a few issues with Quantum over the years but this series of reels was solid.  

 

A lot of stores stopped carrying them and they seemed to stop distributing them to mom and pop shops. I think this has hurt them in the long run. 

[Bass Rutten]

For any one interested there's a brand new LH 7:1 smoke s3 on ebay right now for $82.50, thought about it for a new froggin reel, but think I 'll stick to the new tatula which can be had new for $120

[GReb]

I’ve always been a fan of the ACS braking system and the quantum’s I’ve owned have given me no issues. However they have had some quality control issues through the years. Quantum/zebco is more focused on the cheaper “Walmart” products because there’s less competition from higher end brands and they sell a ton of them. 
 

As far as 200 sized reels the current market is more geared towards smaller reels. Most applications just don’t need the capacity and the ergonomics of a smaller reel are preferred by the majority of bass anglers today. There is still a need for them though. 

[Bigbox99]

1st, reels like what you want exist but I don't think you even know what you have.  The S3 holds less line than a Tatula 200 and appears to be a normal 34mm or possible 36mm spool which puts it line capacity roughtly equal a Daiwa 100 reel.  Just compare the wide and deep 36mm spool on this Tatula 200.  I don't care what the line cap stats say for either reel on TW because they are made up  nonsense from the manufacture.

 

2nd, I wouldn't consider a standard bass 100 sized reel with a aluminum frame and plastic handle side plate to be a heavy duty reel.  I'd want to see an aluminum handle side plate and set plate (non handle side plate part that cam locks into the frame) and a larger capacity spool.

 

3rd, those 20+ pound drag numbers are made up.  If you lock down a "13" pound drag Daiwa and yank on it with a scale you can get in excess of 20 pounds of drag.  The manufactures knows this and use a more realistic smooth max drag rating but some disingenuous companies use the nonsense locked down drag number to post a higher number on paper to fool low information anglers.  It's similar to when some pack a high number of garbage bearings into a reel.  It's to fool people into thinking more number mean more gooder and into buying their product.   

 

Also I have no idea where this idea that you need to have a large drag number to set the hook on a heavy fish.  Heavy fish are the easiest things to get a hook into since their weight aids in setting the hook.  It's those smaller ones that just get yanked towards me that always have the worst hook penetrarions.  If the drag is slipping on the hookset then that is YOU pulling the drag and not the fish.  Once the fight it on and fish start to run then that's when the drag system gets tested.  For the barramundi guys I have been talking to over the years they seem to like the Daiwa Ryoga with its 13 pounds rated drag.  Their concerns are not the drag on a reel but it staying smooth after many hard fights and the strength of the clutch mechanism.  Reels they favor on the enthusiast side are the 1st gen Ryoga 100 and 2nd gen Morethan PE special with the bronze main gear.

 

Anyways, what you have sounds like a pretty standard 100 size bass reel and I'm glad you like it.  I started with Quantums many years ago from watching Bill Dance on the TV and they served me well.  

[Bigbox99]

Upon further inspection it looks like the spool might be a 36mm deep spool where the capacity is increased by taking the abor down to the spool shaft. You typically only see this on salt water reels to increase line capacity for species of fish that can run and pull drag.  Some bass reels like the Tatula 200 and 300 use this to increase line capacity with large diameter lines.  You are never casting down to these tiny arbors because the very small diameter arbors need to have the spool spinning at insane speeds to dispense line on that is a <10mm spool  by the time you get that deep into the spool on the cast.  

 

There are also "jigging reels" like the Seasir Megacuda which feature a light weight 36mm deep spool, 33 lbs of drag and, 110 power hande and aluminum frame for $30.  I have 2 that I use as normal bass reels.  There is also the Daiwa Coastal 80 which has a deep 33mm spool and a tiny frame.  

 

They're out there but it's not a common configuration on bass reels so if you are limited to buying on TW then they do not exist for you.  

[Jonjhb whrfvo8iu43]

On 11/11/2024 at 6:43 AM, Bigbox99 said:

Upon further inspection it looks like the spool might be a 36mm deep spool where the capacity is increased by taking the abor down to the spool shaft. You typically only see this on salt water reels to increase line capacity for species of fish that can run and pull drag.  Some bass reels like the Tatula 200 and 300 use this to increase line capacity with large diameter lines.  You are never casting down to these tiny arbors because the very small diameter arbors need to have the spool spinning at insane speeds to dispense line on that is a <10mm spool  by the time you get that deep into the spool on the cast.  

 

There are also "jigging reels" like the Seasir Megacuda which feature a light weight 36mm deep spool, 33 lbs of drag and, 110 power hande and aluminum frame for $30.  I have 2 that I use as normal bass reels.  There is also the Daiwa Coastal 80 which has a deep 33mm spool and a tiny frame.  

 

They're out there but it's not a common configuration on bass reels so if you are limited to buying on TW then they do not exist for you.  

Actually i do have the seasir but the tolerances, max drag and casting is just not the same. With the centrifugal brakes on the Quantum, i can really maximize casting without backlash compared to the seasir. Also the seasir is also an ounce heavier which just make working lures not as comfortable. The Daiwas line cap is  less than the Quantum, holding 25yards less of 30lb braid and its also an ounce heavier with a heavy spool. This limits it to heavy baits compared to the smoke. I have the 150 and i struggles with lighter lures compared to the smoke so i dont think the 200 would do much better.  Also i get why some dont think heavy drag is important but when most of your fish is over 15lbs and hooked near mangroves and docks, having a heavy drag definitly prevents them from running into the snags. I guess you could thumb the spool but you cant really reel while thumbing can you.

On 11/11/2024 at 6:43 AM, Bigbox99 said:

Upon further inspection it looks like the spool might be a 36mm deep spool where the capacity is increased by taking the abor down to the spool shaft. You typically only see this on salt water reels to increase line capacity for species of fish that can run and pull drag.  Some bass reels like the Tatula 200 and 300 use this to increase line capacity with large diameter lines.  You are never casting down to these tiny arbors because the very small diameter arbors need to have the spool spinning at insane speeds to dispense line on that is a <10mm spool  by the time you get that deep into the spool on the cast.  

 

There are also "jigging reels" like the Seasir Megacuda which feature a light weight 36mm deep spool, 33 lbs of drag and, 110 power hande and aluminum frame for $30.  I have 2 that I use as normal bass reels.  There is also the Daiwa Coastal 80 which has a deep 33mm spool and a tiny frame.  

 

They're out there but it's not a common configuration on bass reels so if you are limited to buying on TW then they do not exist for you.  

Also the seasirs actual drag is 15lbs ,ive tested all of my reels with a scale and the ratings from American and Japanese brands are pretty accurate but the Chinese are not. Its still a good reel but just needs some quality control. The biggest issues i have had with these are that they auto engage at least several times per trip and this then ruins the pinion after.  Before covid ,i  had a couple of smoke hds but had to sell them for a need at the time. Those have alloy sideplates as well but still weigh under 7oz. 

[dodgeguy]

On 11/9/2024 at 3:26 PM, MediumMouthBass said:

"ItS nOt A dAiWa Or ShImAnO"

These 2 brands have taken over and everything else is slowly dwindling away.

Even Lews and Abu have lost alot of popularity, more so Abu though.

Between lack of investors, lack of additional funding, lack of sales and with the covid and post covid economy how are they supposed to take what little sales they have and spend a fortune on marketing, new production, revamping the brand to get popularity?

 

Ive been fishing since i was a few years old, only ever heard of Quantum when i went into a Walmart/DSG and saw their cheap spinning reels on the shelf. Between no one i knew having them or even talking about them, paired with the 0 ads, marketing, youtube influencers i had no idea they actually made casting reels, let alone good ones. Most people i talk to that are my age that fish dont even know who they are. The old school guys that grew up watching tournaments know who Quantum is but that was decades ago, recently what have they done? Atleast Lews is hitting the youtube influencers hard. Somehow they are selling a ton of those cheap garbage plastic framed Mach series reels, because they know who to market their brand to.

 

Awhile ago i was seriously considering buying a really nice Quantum reel at a insane discount, but i held off on it because i wasnt sure if they went under there would be parts or a warranty left.

It would be nice if they made a comeback, they would have 0 chance against the main 2, but they would do good against the rest. But like everything in this world, you have to have the money and the right people.

Where'd we get Lews is doing bad ? I've never heard that. As far as i know they are doing really well. They sell plenty of high end reels that compete against shimano and diawa just fine.

Quantum at one point was doing really well. Can't answer what went wrong.They are currently owned by the same company that owns Lews. Why they haven't done what they did with Lews to Quantum  I don't know. Maybe they have future plans.

[bowhunter63]

Miss the old Quantum 1310 mg and Pro 4. They ruled the 80 s . Would like to see them come back. A little competition is a good thing 

[zell_pop1]

Like @Bigbox99 referred to, look at inshore baitcasters and you can find what you want. 

[Jonjhb whrfvo8iu43]

7 hours ago, zell_pop1 said:

Like @Bigbox99 referred to, look at inshore baitcasters and you can find what you want. 

I have but they all have lacking drag, heavy spools and they themsleves are heavier than the smokes. I I hope someone offers one before all the smoke s3 sell out.

[bacolmm]

I picked up a Smoke S3 on this post’s recommendation. I’ve only fished with it once, but I’m impressed!

[redmeansdistortion]

On 11/9/2024 at 4:23 PM, MediumMouthBass said:

Pure Fishing in my opinion ruined most (not all) of the brands they acquired in one way or another (except Berkley, and a few others).

I wouldn't be so quick to blame Pure Fishing, but who owns them instead.  Outdoor Technologies Group was founded by Berkley as they started to acquire other brands, and changed their name to Pure Fishing in 2000.  Outdoor Technologies Group, and by extension, Pure Fishing wasn't the devil we make them out to be.  They still let their companies innovate and mostly stayed out of the way until Jarden took it over in 2007.  That's when we started seeing concerted effort for outsourcing design and manufacture to other places and quality beginning to decline.  Fast Forward to 2018, and Sycamore Partners purchased Pure Fishing from Jarden, putting us where we are now.  When Sycamore took over, they mandated Abu stop producing parts for reels made prior to 1997, this made the lifetime warranties that came with some Abus null and void.  Sycamore also made Abu scrap contracts with all small business partners that made unique Abu models or parts.  For those not aware, Sycamore is a private investment firm with a reputation for selling off portions of companies or minimizing operations in order to generate income, sometimes leading to liquidation and bankruptcy.  The most well known brand they bled dry was Bed Bath and Beyond, among others.  Unfortunately, with the announcement that the Svangsta factory would be laying off over half of their workforce, I get the impression the goal is to reduce Abu to a brand only and do away with most anything coming out of Sweden.