I'm so split between the Shimano Stradic FL and Shimano Vanford F

[TheLokoWuaka]

I currently have a St. Croix 6'8" MH extra fast rod for bass fishing, and I'm currently looking for a new reel. I'm torn between the Stradic and the Vanguard. The size I'm trying to get is a 3000. Any tips or advice that could push me in one direction would be greatly appreciated. 

[WRB]

The Vanford has a shorter reel stem then equal size Stradic. This may be an issue if you have large hands.

Tom

[LonnieP]

I held both of them of them in the store and the Vanford was much lighter, so I went with it. I had to change the way I hold the rod though due to the shorter stem.

[MiceNReets]

1 hour ago, TheLokoWuaka said:

I currently have a St. Croix 6'8" MH extra fast rod for bass fishing, and I'm currently looking for a new reel. I'm torn between the Stradic and the Vanguard. The size I'm trying to get is a 3000. Any tips or advice that could push me in one direction would be greatly appreciated. 

I have the same rod in mojo bass and I love it with the Stradic FL 2500. Feels great in hand and to fish all day.  

[TheLokoWuaka]

36 minutes ago, WRB said:

The Vanford has a shorter reel stem then equal size Stradic. This may be an issue if you have large hands.

Tom

I have pretty big hands, and I'll definitely keep that in mind. Thanks!

[TheLokoWuaka]

14 minutes ago, LonnieP said:

I held both of them of them in the store and the Vanford was much lighter, so I went with it. I had to change the way I hold the rod though due to the shorter stem.

The lighter weight is quite tempting, but the shorter stem is a bit of a turn-off.

[TheLokoWuaka]

12 minutes ago, MiceNReets said:

I have the same rod in mojo bass and I love it with the Stradic FL 2500. Feels great in hand and to fish all day.  

How far can the FL cast? I need it to cast decently far for bank fishing.

[MiceNReets]

13 minutes ago, TheLokoWuaka said:

How far can the FL cast? I need it to cast decently far for bank fishing.

I bank fish and I’m extremely happy with the distance I get.   It’s pretty much the 2017 Stella.  

[Flyfish-mt]

I’ve been using Stradics for the past 30 years and currently have a couple of the 3000 FL’s.  I primarily use them for inshore fishing and they are rock solid.  Correct me if I’m wrong but the Vanford has a composite body whereas the Stradic FL has an aluminum body?

[bulldog1935]

@Flyfish-mt Vanford is the '20 name for Stradic CI4+

And yes, the reason Vanford has a shorter knee is for Shimano design to hit their stiffness target - Stradic forged alloy is inherently stiffer than the composite.  

The composite frame is the only difference between the two reels - both are assenbled in Malaysia and share identical drive.  Both have composite rotor, and Vanford's is cut-out for lighter weight.  

 

Beginning with Stradic, all worm-drive Shimano reels are the same design as Stella, with model grades separated by bearing count, MOC and labor costs setting the price (Japan/Malaysia, Al/CI4+/Mg) - from Stradic to Stella, parts inerchange.  

Stradic FL is '18 Stella design, and when '19 Stradic (FL) was introduced, TackleAdvisor's take-down review dubbed it "The Best $400 Reel You Can Buy"

 

The only change in '22 Stella and Stradic FM, etc, is a slightly increased spool pitch (slightly longer spindle).  This change shows Shimano was so happy with the strength of their '18 design, they simply pushed it a little harder.  

 

@TheLokoWuaka for MH, I would definitely pick Stradic toughness over Vanford light.  

(Stradic FL + Yumeya shallow braid spool)

[Flyfish-mt]

     

Great information Bulldog!!

 

One of the prerequisites for me when it comes to spending $150+ on a spinning reel is that it must have worm gear oscillation for superior line lay.  Along w/ the Stradics, I had several SS1300 and SS700 reels due to the great line lay.  I guess if weight is a huge factor, then I would consider the Vanford. 

[FrnkNsteen]

As usual,... @bulldog1935 nailed it!

 

The only thing I would add is to consider the weight difference betwen the Stradic and Vanford in parallel with the weight of the rod you are going to put it on to assess which will balance better.

 

For instance, I have both Vanford and Stradics. On my Fenwick rods that have a more substantial, full handle, I don't need as much reel weight to balance the setup on my fingers, so the Vanford balances very nicely. My absolute favorite is my Fenwick ET Smallmouth 6'9"ML with a Vanford 2500 I use for wacky rigging smallies!!

 

I have other rods that are a split grip, or completly open like the Phenix Feather that don't have as much handle weight. The heavier Stradic balances them out a little better.

[casts_by_fly]

I was just coming to type what frnknsteen wrote.  This past winter my dad and I both ordered new reels (and me a rod).  He went 4k size vanford, I went 3k sized stradic (FL, previous model to current).  His is on a 7' zodias M, mine is on the zodias 6'9" ML.  Both rods have carbon monocoque rear grips which are really light.  I had intended to use a 1k size reel and it was no where close to balancing it.  The 3k did at an ounce or so heavier and feels great in hand.  Its a much better balanced package (size, weight, swingweight, etc).  His 7' with the vanford feels tip heavy for me and how I hold the rod.  His reel is also an ounce and a half lighter I think.  That's great for him because heavier setups tax his elbow and I think he holds the rod further up the grip.

 

I think the stradic is the best value for money spinning reel available and I wish I had bought a couple of them when they were clearing the FLs out at ~30% off.  Given that option now I'd buy two more and just set them aside for the future.

[GetFishorDieTryin]

7 hours ago, casts_by_fly said:

I was just coming to type what frnknsteen wrote.  This past winter my dad and I both ordered new reels (and me a rod).  He went 4k size vanford, I went 3k sized stradic (FL, previous model to current).  His is on a 7' zodias M, mine is on the zodias 6'9" ML.  Both rods have carbon monocoque rear grips which are really light.  I had intended to use a 1k size reel and it was no where close to balancing it.  The 3k did at an ounce or so heavier and feels great in hand.  Its a much better balanced package (size, weight, swingweight, etc).  His 7' with the vanford feels tip heavy for me and how I hold the rod.  His reel is also an ounce and a half lighter I think.  That's great for him because heavier setups tax his elbow and I think he holds the rod further up the grip.

 

I think the stradic is the best value for money spinning reel available and I wish I had bought a couple of them when they were clearing the FLs out at ~30% off.  Given that option now I'd buy two more and just set them aside for the future.

Im really surprised at that.  I would think the 7' M Zodias would be made to balance perfect with a 7oz or slightly lighter reel.  

The weight difference between a 3k Vanford and Stradic is well less than .5oz.  Basically you can upsize a Vanford and it will be the same or slightly lighter than a stradic 1 size smaller. 

The line is what really makes the difference.  If you get a shallow spool 4k the weight is really close to a deep spool 3k with FC.  Reel for reel, it comes down to purpose for me, because Ive never had issues with the stem length.  On XF rods that are meant for finesse or semi/slackline techniques I want the lighter reel, it will be a more sensitive outfit.  For plugs or M power and stronger rods over 7'6 the stradic     

[TheLokoWuaka]

11 hours ago, bulldog1935 said:

@Flyfish-mt Vanford is the '20 name for Stradic CI4+

And yes, the reason Vanford has a shorter knee is for Shimano design to hit their stiffness target - Stradic forged alloy is inherently stiffer than the composite.  

The composite frame is the only difference between the two reels - both are assenbled in Malaysia and share identical drive.  Both have composite rotor, and Vanford's is cut-out for lighter weight.  

 

Beginning with Stradic, all worm-drive Shimano reels are the same design as Stella, with model grades separated by bearing count, MOC and labor costs setting the price (Japan/Malaysia, Al/CI4+/Mg) - from Stradic to Stella, parts inerchange.  

Stradic FL is '18 Stella design, and when '19 Stradic was introduced, TackleAdvisor's take-down review dubbed it "The Best $400 Reel You Can Buy"

 

The only change in '22 Stella and Stradic FM, etc, is a slightly increased spool pitch (slightly longer spindle).  This change shows Shimano was so happy with the strength of their '18 design, they simply pushed it a little harder.  

 

@TheLokoWuaka for MH, I would definitely pick Stradic toughness over Vanford.  

(Stradic FL + Yumeya shallow braid spool)

Awesome, thanks a bunch! I'm definitely going to get the Stradic and give it a try. I can't wait to see how it feels!

[MiceNReets]

You’ll be happy with the Stradic FL.  They’re very well made reels and I believe the best bang for the buck.   I sold all my spinning reels and all I have are Stradic FLs.   I even use a Stradic FL 1000 for my Ultralight fishing.   Just perfect.      Have 2 2500s and 2 3000s as well.   

[bulldog1935]

I have 3 small-frame JDM Shimano worm drive, '19 Vanquish C2000S, '19 Stradic 1000S, and '19 Stradic C2000SHG (same reel as USM Stradic 1000FL).  

They're all couldn't-pry-from-my-hands, and they fish hard in winter salt finesse.  

Vanquish hit its mark, designed from go to be the best finessse spinning reel ever made.  

But I wouldn't take anything for my little Stradic 1000S also in this niche, or my JDM equivalent to 1000FL.  These are little workhorse reels.  

 

Add to the list two large-frame Stradic FL and a medium frame '20 Twin Power.  

[Born 2 fish]

On 8/1/2024 at 6:13 PM, TheLokoWuaka said:

How far can the FL cast? I need it to cast decently far for bank fishing.

Your rod has more to do with distance then the actual reel.

[T2DM]

2 hours ago, MiceNReets said:

You’ll be happy with the Stradic FL.  They’re very well made reels and I believe the best bang for the buck.   I sold all my spinning reels and all I have are Stradic FLs.   I even use a Stradic FL 1000 for my Ultralight fishing.   Just perfect.      Have 2 2500s and 2 3000s as well.   

My Stradic FL 1000 looks better than yours...just because!🤣 but @bulldog1935's FL 1000 for some reason looks way better than both ours combined!😂

 

They just look so dang sexy!

 

 

 

 

[casts_by_fly]

7 hours ago, GetFishorDieTryin said:

Im really surprised at that.  I would think the 7' M Zodias would be made to balance perfect with a 7oz or slightly lighter reel.  

The weight difference between a 3k Vanford and Stradic is well less than .5oz.  Basically you can upsize a Vanford and it will be the same or slightly lighter than a stradic 1 size smaller. 

The line is what really makes the difference.  If you get a shallow spool 4k the weight is really close to a deep spool 3k with FC.  Reel for reel, it comes down to purpose for me, because Ive never had issues with the stem length.  On XF rods that are meant for finesse or semi/slackline techniques I want the lighter reel, it will be a more sensitive outfit.  For plugs or M power and stronger rods over 7'6 the stradic     

 

using the current fm stradic and not the fl I have (I think they are very close), the 3k sizes are 7.9 vs 6.3 oz. In the 4k they are 9.7/7.6.  That’s 1.6 oz or 2.1 oz depending on the size. For a given size, that’s a lot of weight and it matters sometimes. When I got my zodias I had a 1k stradic in the same order and at 6.5 oz it was way too light. I have an older stradic here which is about 7.5 or so and it was very good, hence I went with the 3k size to balance. Yes, you could upsize from a 3k stradic to a 4k vanford to keep about the same weight, but I don’t want a big honking reel when I don’t need it. Give me the all metal stradic in my case. 
 

The zodias rear grips are very light. I would expect a 7’ medium to match with a 3k sized reel also but the vanford is so light that there is nothing to it and you have to add 3x as much weight at the reel compared to a little heavier rear grip. And the front grip design basically forces you into a one or two fingers behind the reel post because there isn’t enough grip in front of the reel post for all four fingers. So effectively it means you need a heavier reel if you want the balance close to the reel post. 
 

on my 6’9”, the 3k is about perfect and makes a nice balanced rig. If I wanted a longer shimano, I would go expride for the lower weight SiC guides or to the curado for the heavier rear grip. 

[bulldog1935]

@T2DM - when you love something...

I love my counter-balanced and double handles in finesse fishing - they keep the rotor from turning under gravity acting on the offset weight of the bail.  Big fish sip tiny winter bait - they don't spend a lot of energy to eat it, because they don't get much back.  (Susie's catch on XUL)

Since my small-frame reels are in salt finesse niche, they get even more attention - MTCW dual-bearing titanium line rollers.  And MTCW TD drag knob (only made for small frame), which replaces the plastic drag knob with all-metal, and replaces the elastic strain of the plastic knob with the rate of an internal metal spring - comes with 2 springs for 2 different spring rates and drag ranges.  With the plastic knob, the entire drag range is in 1/2 turn of the knob - the metal TD drag range is spread over 2-1/2 turns, and there are twice as many click-detentes.  The spring also lets you push the front of the drag knob to add finger drag.  (Susie's fish made two 50-yd runs)

 

 

2 hours ago, Born 2 fish said:

Your rod has more to do with distance then the actual reel.

This gets said A Lot on the forum, and matching rod lure range with the lure weight is important.  

But from building and tuning reels, mixing and matching rods, lines and bearings on the casting range, you get more variation from the reel set up than from the rod choice, and surprisingly, that often includes rod length - I can think of two 6-1/2' rods that will cast light end toe-to-toe with some 8+' rods of the same lure rating.  The properties that make a rod cast well often aren't the same properties that make the rod fish well in many niches, also making the reel set-up important for optimizing cast distance.  

A spinning reel with good line management, matched spool depth and line, lets you load the spool to the line hook, and will cast into next week. 

[T2DM]

35 minutes ago, bulldog1935 said:

@T2DM - when you love something...

I love my counter-balanced and double handles in finesse fishing - they keep the rotor from turning under gravity acting on the offset weight of the bail.  Big fish sip tiny winter bait - they don't spend a lot of energy to eat it, because they don't get much back.  (Susie's catch on XUL)

Since my small-frame reels are in salt finesse niche, they get even more attention - MTCW dual-bearing titanium line rollers.  And MTCW TD drag knob (only made for small frame), which replaces the plastic drag knob with all-metal, and replaces the elastic strain of the plastic knob with the rate of an internal metal spring - comes with 2 springs for 2 different spring rates and drag ranges.  With the plastic knob, the entire drag range is in 1/2 turn of the knob - the metal TD drag range is spread over 2-1/2 turns, and there are twice as many click-detentes.  The spring also lets you push the front of the drag knob to add finger drag.  (Susie's fish made two 50-yd runs)

 

 

This gets said A Lot on the forum, and matching rod lure range with the lure weight is important.  

But from building and tuning reels, mixing and matching rods, lines and bearings on the casting range, you get more variation from the reel set up than from the rod choice, and surprisingly, that often includes rod length - I can think of two 6-1/2' rods that will cast light end toe-to-toe with some 8+' rods of the same lure rating.  The properties that make a rod cast well often aren't the same properties that make the rod fish well in many niches, also making the reel set-up important for optimizing cast distance.  

A spinning reel with good line management, matched spool depth and line, lets you load the spool to the line hook, and will cast into next week. 

Wow! That's some awesome stuff once again! Thanks for all of your knowledge and contributions in here, I sure do appreciate it, and I've learned a lot. I'm sure a lot of guys in here feels the same way. You're like the MacGyver of Fishing reels.

[F14A-B]

On 8/2/2024 at 7:32 AM, bulldog1935 said:

@Flyfish-mt Vanford is the '20 name for Stradic CI4+

And yes, the reason Vanford has a shorter knee is for Shimano design to hit their stiffness target - Stradic forged alloy is inherently stiffer than the composite.  

The composite frame is the only difference between the two reels - both are assenbled in Malaysia and share identical drive.  Both have composite rotor, and Vanford's is cut-out for lighter weight.  

 

Beginning with Stradic, all worm-drive Shimano reels are the same design as Stella, with model grades separated by bearing count, MOC and labor costs setting the price (Japan/Malaysia, Al/CI4+/Mg) - from Stradic to Stella, parts inerchange.  

Stradic FL is '18 Stella design, and when '19 Stradic (FL) was introduced, TackleAdvisor's take-down review dubbed it "The Best $400 Reel You Can Buy"

 

The only change in '22 Stella and Stradic FM, etc, is a slightly increased spool pitch (slightly longer spindle).  This change shows Shimano was so happy with the strength of their '18 design, they simply pushed it a little harder.  

 

@TheLokoWuaka for MH, I would definitely pick Stradic toughness over Vanford light.  

(Stradic FL + Yumeya shallow braid spool)

Nice write up. Btw, I have that glass rod, mine is the 7’medium. I have my 4000 Ci4+ on it. d**n finely built rod. 
 

I have the FL, the FM and just got a Vanford 2500 S. It’s perfect on my Edge rod. The Edge rod is a light action 7’ two piece. It’s awesome. The reel is 5.3:1 and is perfect for the 2 - 4 pound line I use.. it’s a blast to fish.

 

I started with Stradic in about 99 and have always had a few. 

[Susky River Rat]

@bulldog1935 every time I see that picutre of the reel spooled like that it’s so satisfying. 

[F14A-B]

4 minutes ago, Susky River Rat said:

@bulldog1935 every time I see that picutre of the reel spooled like that it’s so satisfying. 

Why? It looks grossly over spooled to me, I know he’s an experienced fisherman, but I guess different philosophy on the matter. Is that the way braid users roll? 
 

I'm a copoly mono guy myself.