The decline of our lakes.

[A-Jay]

33 minutes ago, ol'crickety said:

@A-Jay: Andy, I fear that your paradise might be lost in your lifetime, as I fear the same for me. Maine led the nation in the per capita uptick in population last year and the northeast has the nation's strongest housing market as people understandably move north to escape heat. Michigan and especially northern Michigan, overs the same advantages as Maine, with its relatively cool inland seas and a bounty of land. 

Anything is possible.

However, for more reasons than I'm willing to go into here,

I don't see it happening here in the next 10-15 years.

Which is probably just about all I'll have left.

If I'm lucky.

A-Jay

[ironbjorn]

Pollution, pressure and fishery abuse, the increase of shoreline property, and yes, even FFS, will one day combine to put the nail in the coffin for many if not most fisheries sooner rather than later. Most of us have noticed the rapid declines across the country. You can't have a million people living on the lake, you can't have massive pollution, you can't have a million boats on the water fishing all the time, and you can't target fish with precision in haunts you never could before FFS and expect everything to go on as usual. Only when the last fish is caught, and the last tree dies, will man understand that he can't eat money.

[Swamp Girl]

1 minute ago, ironbjorn said:

Pollution, pressure and fishery abuse, the increase of shoreline property, and yes, even FFS, will one day combine to put the nail in the coffin for many if not most fisheries sooner rather than later. Most of us have noticed the rapid declines across the country. You can't have a million people living on the lake, you can't have massive pollution, you can't have a million boats on the water fishing all the time, and you can't target fish with precision in haunts you never could before FFS and expect everything to go on as usual. Only when the last fish is caught, and the last tree dies, will man understand that he can't eat money.

 

I recently read "Cod: A Biography of the Fish that Changed the World" and its author detailed how scientists knew the once-great Grand Banks cod fishery was collapsing. They tried to limit the catches, but there was widespread cheating and pregnant females in the shallows were targeted. Even today, decades later, the fishery hasn't rebooted and some scientists fear it might never recover. 

[Kev-mo]

I've seen some things get better and others get worse. But overall it makes me incredibly sad to see what we are doing to this planet and each other.

 

As far as as the lack of amphibians goes... they've been on the decline worldwide for quite awhile. I'm like 97% sure they found a big cause was/is a virus or parasite or something from either N or S Korea. That coupled with declining habitat, water quality etc. again incredibly sad.

[gim]

12 hours ago, ol'crickety said:

I recently read "Cod: A Biography of the Fish that Changed the World" and its author detailed how scientists knew the once-great Grand Banks cod fishery was collapsing. They tried to limit the catches, but there was widespread cheating and pregnant females in the shallows were targeted. Even today, decades later, the fishery hasn't rebooted and some scientists fear it might never recover. 

 

The collapse of various salwater/ocean fisheries is well documented and this is one of them.  There are others too.  King Salmon in Alaska is another example that has very strict regulations and harvest.  Obviously species of mollusks like lobster and various species of crab are also affected.

 

There is a difference though.  Cod and Salmon and these other saltwater fish are commercially harvested for food on a large scale.  Bass are not.  There is a strong catch and release ethic amongst most bass anglers and as long as that continues, I think bass fisheries will remain relatively strong for the foreseeable future.  It would be a much different story if they were primarily targeted as a food source.

 

The key is habitat and water quality.  If we continue to degrade their habitat, continued problems will occur.

 

Keep any eye on other species of freshwater first before bass.  There are other more popular species in the northern tier that will plummet first like trout, walleye, and cisco/tulibee.  They need colder, more oxygenated water than bass do.  Their populations are the ones to watch before bass.

[fin]

I think in many ways we are very lucky to have lived (and fished) when we did. I feel pretty certain we have seen the peak in public fisheries.

[Pat Brown]

I'm as cynical and hopeless as the next guy when it comes to my opinions of human influence on nature/the environment - but bass are pretty hard to get rid of.

 

I think fishing pressure post COVID is 90% of why fishing is harder now than ever.

 

The bubble will burst and new generations of fish will be born.

 

It's all just the cycles of things rising in popularity etc.

 

Bass fishing around here before COVID was pretty much insane according to friends of mine and these days they all struggle to catch a fish.  Fishing pressure has a very real effect on small fisheries!

[Swamp Girl]

17 minutes ago, fin said:

I feel pretty certain we have seen the peak in public fisheries.

 

If you're right, then your gratitude is the way to go. 

[fin]

13 minutes ago, ol'crickety said:

 

If you're right, then your gratitude is the way to go. 

I'm not sure I follow. I'm very grateful for what I have experienced, but pessimistic about the future. Do you mean I should donate to the Sierra club or something like that?

[Swamp Girl]

38 minutes ago, fin said:

I think in many ways we are very lucky to have lived (and fished) when we did.

 

^This^ is your gratitude and I always applaud gratitude. 

[TOXIC]

We can always relate to “The good ol’ days” like when my grandfather took me to Canada and we didn’t keep a walleye under 8lbs because they were runts.  On the other hand, 2 years ago was the best year in 21 years of going to St Clair. 

[gim]

5 minutes ago, TOXIC said:

On the other hand, 2 years ago was the best year in 21 years of going to St Clair. 

 

My two best fishing seasons in 25 years have both occured in the last 5 years.

 

2020 (pandemic year) was my best ever.  2023 was my second best (last year).

 

25 years isn't an extraordinary time frame in the grand scheme of things but its a decent sample size given my age.

[TOXIC]

Notable this year watching the pro tour come to St Clair.  In years past 90% of them ran to Erie or Huron for bigger bags.  This year they all stayed in the lake and had record bags.  Ish Monroe even tried to make a run with largemouth.  

[MediumMouthBass]

On one hand i agree that alot of lakes are declining due to overuse of chemicals. Whether purposely sprayed or unintended ones from new or old construction/projects/homes/developments, as well as the unbelievable amount of pressure in the last few years, add jetskis on top of that, because why not.

 

On the other hand in the Susquehanna River people have been dumping chemicals, waste, oil and gas, along with all types of toxic pollutants from all the mines around and under it. We also have creeks that are bright orange that dump right into the river, that the local government tells everyone not to go near but just recently after several decades decided to allocate some funds to finally start cleaning it up. And any day of the week there might be a few diapers floating past you. Add on to it that any time it floods it brings who knows what into the river. Some areas have a ton of pressure and others its just a few people fishing it.

Still the fishing is out of this world when it comes to smallmouths, even after all of that.

 

In my personal opinion, the decline in LAKES specifically is from chemicals. Any lake i ever loved to fish for bass or panfish where dozens of each species were common in just one day, after being sprayed it was very rare if you even just caught 1 bass or bluegill.

But the creeks being ruined is all at the fault of the government. Im talking about the Class A streams (Natives), they keep taking and taking just a bit more each year to put their stocked ones in. But hey who needs conservation when youre making that kind of money.

Oh and the same guys putting in the stocked trout have no issue destroying bass and panfish lakes by dumping in more trout than the lake can hold either. But thats only a few states that have this issue.

[Swamp Girl]

Returning to JB's original post, I don't live that far from JB. You all know how many bass I catch. I dread the development disease spreading north. At one of the ponds I fish, the owners have a huge, electric-blue, floating, air-filled couch. They sit on it, drink, and talk louder and louder the drunker they become. They evidently prefer big, garish, loud, and ugly to the natural beauty of Maine.

[Will Ketchum]

When I was kid the U.S. population was 1/2 of what it is now and continues to rise. All those people have to go somewhere in the country and do stuff which affects the environment, not only our lakes and rivers but everything. Think about all those extra toilet flushes for starters.

[Swamp Girl]

1 minute ago, Will Ketchum said:

When I was kid the U.S. population was 1/2 of what it is now and continues to rise. All those people have to go somewhere in the country and do stuff which affects the environment, not only our lakes and rivers but everything. Think about all those extra toilet flushes for starters.

 

Exactly. Anyone who has been to India, China, or Southeast Asia knows what unfettered population growth looks like. 

[Zcoker]

We have a small lake here in southeast Florida, Kenansville Lake. At one time that place was the most epic place in the entire state to get a monster bass, so much so that it got the nickname "Jurassic Park'. Even now near death, it still produces monsters yet nowhere near like it did just a few years ago. They have literally 'nuked' that place to death. It's basically lifeless now. Dark brown dead and dying vegetation spread out all over the place like dry dead leaves, dirty dingy water...hard to imagine anything living in it. I fished it a few months ago and got only one decent fish. Yet we have places like the everglades that is doing much better thanks to some of these water management projects, which in fact do work--some of them, at least! Lake Okeechobee is another one. Years ago that place was a mecca for big bass. Over the years it's gone through much the same thing, a ton of nuking, which has about wiped out a big percentage of its greenery. Some places in it once so green and lively are now mudholes. Lotta folks blame it on the sugar fields but those are all south of the lake. It's the dense population boom north of the lake which has caused a lot of its current issues, issues like run-off, leaking septic tanks, algae blooms... Some places fare well, others don't. Just gotta hunt down the decent places and fish them else just do the best ya can in the mudholes. 

[WRB]

All lakes go through eutrophication aging.

Natural lakes Oligotrophic, Mesotrophic and Eutrophic eventually disappearing.

People introduce organic materials that accelerate  the aging process.

man made impoundments age in the same manner except have the added siltation filling the lake runoff debris.

Killing off aquatic vegetation and letting it sink to the bottom uses up oxygen to decay accelerating aging and often creating massive algae blooms. 
We (people) are the worst enemy aging lakes.

Boom and Bust cycles are part of big bass populations usually generational depending on recruitment and the ecosystem health.

Tom

[MickD]

17 hours ago, ol'crickety said:

northern Michigan, has the same advantages as Maine, with its relatively cool inland seas and a bounty of land. 

You might have a different opinion if you priced some MI lakefront property or housing.  Unbelievable.

[Swamp Girl]

44 minutes ago, MickD said:

You might have a different opinion if you priced some MI lakefront property or housing.  Unbelievable.

 

I'm guessing it's similar to Maine. As I wrote in another post, this is a property twenty minutes from my waterfront:

 

$2,400,000

53 Marriners Brook Drive, Lincolnville, ME 04849

 

Look at the property above and you'll see a small, old camp. However, my five acres on the water cost me $75,000.

 

Location, location, location. 

 

I did shop Lake Michigan waterfront and it was far above my pay grade. However, oceanfront here now begins at seven figures too, which it didn't just three years ago. 

 

If I could afford Michigan waterfront, I'd buy on the U.P. and purchase a whole lake.

[MickD]

2 hours ago, ol'crickety said:

and purchase a whole lake.

better get right at it. . .

[Susky River Rat]

@MediumMouthBass the fishing is back to being very good after about 10-12 years of it being terrible. They took lots of measures to fix this. No tournaments, no target bass at all during spawn, catch and release only, installing new fish ladders, investigating and finding companies polluting the river, river run off. I’m sure most of this only came around because of the pressure to save the Chesapeake bay.  The fish and boat commission denied the problem for years before action was taken.  This is all on the main branch from sunbury down. I fish the Harrisburg stretch a lot. I can tell you I have never personally seen diapers go down the river. Now when the river does get to a certain level raw sewage does end up in the river from the city of Harrisburg. 

 

Brunner island every year is good for doing something to cause a fish kill. You can bet spring time they screw something up and kill thousands of fish. 

[MassBass]

Believe it or not, the Northeast Atlantic drainage rivers are far better now than they were in recent history. The older folks will tell you, there was a time when the river smelled terrible when you drove over the bridge, and the water would run different colors depending on what they were making at the paper mills. Today there are still problems, but the rivers are reliably fishable. The Atlantic Sturgeons are showing up in more noticeable numbers, by God's grace they didn't go extinct during the more reckless industrial eras. I think Atlantic salmon could bounce back with more dam removals. But it's not just dams with them, also climate can make the streams too warm.

 

The cod fish will likely never come back like it was, these big huge monsters of the deep. They think all the big cod genetics have likely been fished out. You can go out and catch cod, but you will not see the size fish that made the fishery what it was. The population that remains don't have the big fish genetics. Harvest induced selection; only the smaller, faster sexual maturity genes survived the harvests. 

 

I agree I could see that in Maine you have a problem. But there will always be bass. I think you will have big problems with your native trout fishery. Like when they put in a carwash and a home Depot next to a timeless cold water stream. 

[BucksBasser]

My home lake actually has better water quality than it did 30 years ago.

The government forced a town treatment plant to adhere to pollution laws and that went a long way towards improving things.

 

The Susquehanna is a different story with much degraded water quality from 20 years ago.

Just when the mine acid started to decline a mass of pig and chicken farms were built in much of central PA.  Very few of these follow the law in handling the mass amounts of manure.