Where do diminishing returns begin?

[softwateronly]

@CaughtMeABiggun I get what you're saying in the post above, but your title was much more open and I think that's why this post has the engagement level that it does.  This isn't an "enthusiast level" gear site, but it certainly is an enthusiast level or better bass fishing and catching site.  

  I find myself fortunate to live in the upper middle end of the cost spectrum and can add my perspective to that area.  Vanford, Curado, and Tatula with Exprides, Champions, Avids, and Phenix Feathers are all quality lineups that will last and keep you happy for years.  If you're in this category, you owe yourself a visit to digitaka, etc to look at a diawa alphas 800S and a major craft Days 2 piece.  Truly remarkable quality combo for just under $300.  

 

scott

[garroyo130]

IMO diminishing returns begin when you shop stupidly. As an example, I got carried away by the hype of the Curado K and purchased one without every handling it. I tried to convince myself I liked it but at the end of the day IMO its not a great reel. Had that same amount been spent on a Tatula SV, I have no doubt I would have been pleased. 

 

I think there's gems at every price point as long as you look hard enough. 

[Bigbox99]

15 minutes ago, garroyo130 said:

IMO diminishing returns begin when you shop stupidly. As an example, I got carried away by the hype of the Curado K and purchased one without every handling it. I tried to convince myself I liked it but at the end of the day IMO its not a great reel. Had that same amount been spent on a Tatula SV, I have no doubt I would have been pleased. 

 

I think there's gems at every price point as long as you look hard enough. 

Interesting.  Can you elaborate?  I don't even consider the two reels mentioned to be cross shopped since one is SVS centrifugal and the other an SV.  They are about as far apart in braking profile and associated use case as possible.  All of this could be understood without even handing each reel.  What about the reels in hand made the difference for you? 

[garroyo130]

16 minutes ago, Bigbox99 said:

Interesting.  Can you elaborate?  I don't even consider the two reels mentioned to be cross shopped since one is SVS centrifugal and the other an SV.  They are about as far apart in braking profile and associated use case as possible.  All of this could be understood without even handing each reel.  What about the reels in hand made the difference for you? 

 

Maybe I don't specialize to the level you do, but I don't associate braking profiles with techniques. 

 

The difference was after owning the Curado K and servicing it. The design is my biggest gripe. Having all screws screw into the graphite side plate vs the aluminum frame, the design and location of the worm gear (still not a fan of plastic here either), and the fact that somehow, someway water easily finds its way inside the reel through regular usage is what made me not a fan. I'm also not the biggest fan of the reels casting profile as even after cleaning, lubing, and oiling bearings with TSI 321 it doesn't perform well with lighter baits. 

 

Tatula SV can be had at a similar price point $180 - $200 and has a better design (minus T wing) and a better braking system. 

 

 

[Columbia Craw]

I’ve been buying rods and reel for 50 years. I built rods for 15 years.  I’ve seen like many of you, advancements in material, design and manufacturing capabilities I would have never imagined.  I think you can get phenomenal reels from a hundred bucks up and once you hit that two hundred or so PP you might start seeing a diminished return.  Rods are a bit different.  There’s some great products sub one hundred fifty but my experience has show me the two hundred fifty range will get you a top tier stick.  Shop hard, look for discounts and sales and you can get some upper tier rods at or near that ceiling.

 

[KP Duty]

With Daiwa casting reels, the Zillion was clearly the point where you would get diminishing returns on models above it.  However, with the release of the '24 Tatula SV TW (with SV Boost spool and Hyperdrive)...It is now after the Tatula that returns diminish.  

[Rockhopper]

$200 is my price point for budget vs expensive for both rods and reels.

[Choporoz]

Answering the question from personal experience would be admitting that I made a bad purchase and didn't get enough for the premium I paid.  Answering it without personally experiencing the point of diminishing returns, I'd just be regurgitating stuff I read on the interwebs.  

 

    I tend to recommend reels between 150-200, and rods over 200, but I fully admit that most will experience the exact same rod differently.... and reels, too to some degree

[LCG]

 

I have combos that cost $500 and other combos that cost $150, but they all have the "right feel" for what I am using them for.

 

Truth be told, if I can only bring one combo...it's my current cheapest and most used combo. 7' MH Daiwa Aird-X in a 2 piece model paired with a Lew's Speed Spool LFS in 6.8:1 with 10lb Yo Zuri Hybrid, it checks all the boxes for me. 

 

Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't mind trying out an NRX+ MBR with a Zillion or Metanium, but I just can't justify it. 

 

[The Baron]

On 7/20/2024 at 8:33 AM, A-Jay said:

In fact my most recent casting sticks I've purchased (7 of them)

came in at a whopping $85 bucks each.

And they are KIller !

 

 Curious what rods those are @A-Jay ?

 

I feel like there’s good value for money and very solid options at $150-$200ish CDN (probably $100-$150 USD) for any rod or reel.  For myself personally working in that price range, I’m gravitating strongly toward the Diawa line. I’ve been steadily growing my lineup over the last few years, getting a lot of my reels off FB marketplace to save money so been mostly buying what’s a good deal.  I’ve ended up with a Couple Curado DCs that I don’t love any more than the Diawa cc80 I just got, and I’ve got a Shimano Stradic and Ultegra that sit at home while I fish a Diawa Revros that is on the deck constantly and a pleasure to fish with.  So for me, I feel like Diawa gives me a lot more satisfaction than Shimano in the low-mid range pricing.  I’m a little less dialed in on my rods with my collection all over the map, but feel like Lews offers great value in their Speed Stick line.  I’ve got more St. Croix rods than any other brand (Bass-X and Mojo Bass) and like those a lot.  But I’ve also got Dobyn’s, Okuma,

Diawa and Halo rods that I’m very happy with.  

 

I’m getting close to filling all the slots of combos I “need” and may be phasing a few older things - likely with Diawa reels.  I’m sure as I gain more experience I’ll keep dialing in rods and reels for specific techniques, with the natural progression likely being more expensive options.

[A-Jay]

16 hours ago, The Baron said:

 Curious what rods those are @A-Jay ?

 

https://www.tacklewarehouse.com/Daiwa_DX_Type-H_Glass_Reaction_Casting_Rod/descpage-DXT.html

(military discount rules)

Btw, IMO this one fishes just a but under it's advertised specs,

So still close to H but not exactly.

More like MH plus.

A-Jay

[JackstrawIII]

On 7/20/2024 at 1:54 AM, casts_by_fly said:

I’d go with Toxic and say that $150 buys a whole lot of rod and reel right now.

 

That was going to be my answer as well. To me, the Tatula line (both rods and reels) is very hard to beat in the $150 range. Also a big fan of Dobyns Sierra casting rods and St Croix Premier spinning rods... both also in the $150-$170 range. 

 

I've used some very expensive reels and I don't really notice any difference as compared to the Tatulas that I use so much. Never tried very expensive rods, so I can't speak to that... but I'm quite happy with my Tatulas, Sierras, and Premiers. 

[RevoSEMIpro]

I tend to find something I like, preferably on sale and buy multiples...

 

Reels - $150 Lew's Tournament Pros for me. Couple BB1 Pros caught on sale as well.  If I was starting from scratch today JDM Diawas would probably get the nod.

 

Rods - For moving baits (cranks, squarebills, chatter, spinner, frogs, etc) I find it hard to justify rods over $150 ($100 is more better) and there are plenty of choices out there, shop sales.  Okuma TCS, Lew's XD series, TP1 Black, etc...

 

Bottom contact/finesse I'll stretch out the budget and take an Expride if I have to pick. 

[Brian11719]

For me $170-200ish but I usually try to wait for a good sale and then pick one up for $120-150.

[RB 77]

Around $200 for me for the rod or reel.  I have $200 setups and $1000 setups, but the bulk of my stuff is around $400 +/ - for a combo. Seems to be a good price point for me for what I do. 

[Randy Price]

As others have said it's a personal decision based on your pocketbook.  In the past 25 years of more serious fishing I have noticed major advances in quality of less expensive reels.  For example my '98 Shimano Stradic FG at the time was awesome. however, I recently bought a Daiwa Revros for my loaner rod and have been amazed with how good it is for $ 50.00!  Same is true with the Shimano SLX rods for $ 100.00.  I have $ 100.00 rods and I have a couple of $ 650.00 rods  For me around $ 200.00-250.00 for either rods or reels is where you get the best bang for the buck.  I've been a SC fan for years and have recommended AVID rods for guys wanting to get a quality rod w/o breaking the bank.  Same for a Stradic spinning reel or a Curado bc reel.