Chinesse LifePo Batteries Question

[clc48301]

I'm in the middle of a boat rebuild and my AGMs need to be replaced.  So I'm looking for some feedback on these Lithium LifePo on amazon.  I bet all these are built in china in the same factory, so i don't know if its worth buying more expensive batteries.  Has anyone tried the LiPuls brand they are pretty cheap, they have a 3 pack for $680 and only weigh 20lbs each. They also have LiTime minis that weigh 19lbs but are $920 for a 3 pack

[MN Fisher]

Only batteries for the boat I'll buy off of Amazon is Mighty Max...their AGMs have been rock steady for me, I'm sure their LiFePo4s would be just as good.

[Junger]

To me, batteries are fungible. I've never had a battery go bad in the warranty period for my lead acid and AGM's. They always seem to go bad just outside the warranty period. So, I'd rather look for the specs I want and buy cheap, but reliable batteries and if one goes bad, I don't have to worry about any warranty's and getting authorizations, etc. I just go buy another. That'll be my approach to LiFePO4 batteries as well. You can pay 3x the price from "US" branded lithiums, but what are you getting? A 10 year warranty, maybe some better customer service? But if your battery goes bad, you're gonna have to send it back after getting authorization, then wait for one to get to you. That may be a week, or more. I'll just buy a cheapo Amazon battery and it'll be at my house in 2 days.

 

3 of these will be cheaper than what you listed.

 

https://a.co/d/5TkwR9E

[gim]

There are a lot of knock off and junk Chinese made batteries out there that no one has really used long enough to determine if they last as long as advertised.

 

I personally prefer to buy my batteries in person, locally. Not online. That way if they go bad under warranty, I simply return them and deal with a real body in person. Not some online bot in China.

[Tennessee Boy]

I agree with @Junger.  I have one LifePo4 battery and it’s a Battleborn American battery.  I have no complaints but in the end 12 volts from a $1000 battery is the same as 12 volts from a $300 battery.   On Amazon, Battleborn batteries get 85% five stars reviews.  LiTime batteries get 81% five star reviews and cost about 1/3 as much as the Battleborn.   Battleborns have other features that make them better but not 3 times better.  I’m confident that LiTime will be gone in 5 years and the warranty will be worthless but sometimes it makes sense to take the risk.    You have to decide for yourself if you’re willing to take that risk.

[Jig Man]

I also like buying from a person.  I bought my lithium from my electronics guys.  My core was out of warranty but the same brand.  They contacted the company and got me 90% credit for my core.

[clc48301]

Thanks for all the feedback.  I do like the idea of buying them from a person but budget is a factor.  I ended up going with three LiTime minis.  They were the lightest that i saw at 100AH. 19lbs, so even with 3 batteries its still half the weight of the 2 AGMs that just died on me.  So at half the cost of an ionic brand and 5 lbs lighter i think its worth the gamble.

[WRB]

1st all lithium marine 12 batteries use cells made in China. A few domestic lithium batteries have cases made and assemble the batteries in America. Iconic assembles assembles the battery and controls the end product.

Why do you need 3 100AH batteries? 
Some OB’s warn not using lithium for cranking battery and older onboard chargers are compatible, look into it.

2 50 AH in series will run you boat all day.

Tom

 

[Junger]

Probably a 36v trolling motor set up. All the cheapo Amazon lithiums aren’t made for cranking. There are only a few US assembled dual purpose lithiums available, and they are not cheap.

[volzfan59]

I'm with Ken @MN Fisher, he suggested Mighty Max batteries to me. I checked them out and got one of their 12 volt 100 a/h lithiums. Seems like I paid around $650.00, shipping and taxes included. I don't remember the exact price. It's been a great battery, no problem what do ever. I use an AGM for my starting battery.

[clc48301]

1 hour ago, WRB said:

1st all lithium marine 12 batteries use cells made in China. A few domestic lithium batteries have cases made and assemble the batteries in America. Iconic assembles assembles the battery and controls the end product.

Why do you need 3 100AH batteries? 
Some OB’s warn not using lithium for cranking battery and older onboard chargers are compatible, look into it.

2 50 AH in series will run you boat all day.

Tom

 

I have a small AGM for cranking, and plan on using 1 battery for house and 2 for trolling motor.

[MN Fisher]

38 minutes ago, clc48301 said:

I have a small AGM for cranking

Is that AGM rated for cranking? Quite a few aren't, and you can damage it if it isn't and you use it as such.

 

Look for a CCA or MCA rating on the label...if it has one, it's ok to use for cranking.

[WRB]

47 minutes ago, clc48301 said:

I have a small AGM for cranking, and plan on using 1 battery for house and 2 for trolling motor.

Look at iconic via Lithium Hub site.

2 ea 50AH 12V in series for the TM and a 30 AH 12V for a house battery.

Several brands of marine deep cycle AGM cranking batteries are available gr 24 is popular.

Tom

[T-Billy]

I have a couple years on my Ampere Time 200AH. 100% happy with it.

[gim]

10 hours ago, MN Fisher said:

Is that AGM rated for cranking? Quite a few aren't, and you can damage it if it isn't and you use it as such.

 

Look for a CCA or MCA rating on the label...if it has one, it's ok to use for cranking.

 

I couldn't find an AGM battery specifically rated as a cranking/starting battery locally about a month ago.  They were all labeled as deep cycle.  Had to just buy another lead acid version instead.

[MN Fisher]

5 minutes ago, gimruis said:

Had to just buy another lead acid version instead.

Ya - I got AGMs for the TM and House batteries...an a Wet-Cell for cranking.

 

(AGMs and Gels are Lead-Acid too...just a different method for keeping the solution stable.)

[Bankc]

Look up Will Prowse's YouTube channel, DIY Solar.  He tears down and reviews tons of LiFePo4 batteries.  Between all of the brands he's reviewed, you'll surely find something that's decent and at a decent price.  He's more geared towards solar powered backup batteries, but it's the same batteries we use for trolling motors and such.  So all of his information transfers over nicely.  

 

As the idea of "cheap Chinese" LiFePo4 batteries... well they're all Chinese.  China is the only one making the cells for these batteries.  Technically, there are a few US companies that make lithium battery cells, but they specialize in custom installs for industrial applications.  So a regular deep cycle would be a one-off custom job for them, which would be insanely expensive!  The brands that say "Made in the USA" are actually just assembled in the US with Chinese parts.  However, the US made brands probably have better quality control and customer support, so you're not paying more for nothing.  There is an advantage to them.  Whether it's worth the extra money for quality control and customer service, is up to you.  

 

Lots of people are happy with their cheap, Chinese brand LiFePo4 batteries.  Lots of people are happy with their USA assembled LiFePo4 batteries.  It's up to you which direction you want to go.  But if you do go with the Chinese assembled ones, do your research.  Some brands have been known to reuse old cells and resell them as new batteries.  And some brands are made better than others.  They're definitely not all made in the same factory from the same parts and rebranded with different labels (though many are).  So a bit of research on your part is well worth the time.  And if you can't find any information on the brand, there are plenty of others out there that do have information available, so go with one of them.

[WRB]

VMAX Tank  MR series are dual purpose deep cycle marine AGM is various sizes and used them for over 10 years before selling my boat.

Optima 34 is a dual purpose AGM.

Tom

[Koz]

I have a couple of Weise 100Ah LifePo batteries that I use on my kayak. One is for the trolling motor and the second is for lights, my FFS setup, and my Helix setup. That second will also be an emergency backup for the trolling motor just in case I need it.

 

I bought these on Amazon for about $299 each and they have been great. Absolutely no issues.

[gim]

1 hour ago, Koz said:

I bought these on Amazon for about $299 each and they have been great. Absolutely no issues.

 

Just wondering how long you've had these.

[Koz]

4 hours ago, gimruis said:

 

Just wondering how long you've had these.

The first one for about a year and 6 months for the second one.

[gim]

Thanks.

 

I wouldn’t expect to experience a problem that quickly. Even cheap Chinese batteries should be lasting that long.

[Tennessee Boy]

Everyone seems to want to express the life expectancy of batteries in years.   Time doesn’t kill batteries,  cycles and lack of maintenance do.

[Bankc]

21 hours ago, gimruis said:

Thanks.

 

I wouldn’t expect to experience a problem that quickly. Even cheap Chinese batteries should be lasting that long.

With most electronics, their rate of failure over time follows the bathtub curve.  That means most electronics that make it past the initial 25% of their expected lifespan, are highly likely to make it past 75% of their expected lifespan.  Most electronics either fail early or late in their expected lifecycle, with very few failing in the middle periods.  And lithium batteries, with their BMS circuits, are a lot like electronics in this regard.   

 

So if you get a year or two out of a lithium battery without problems, you'll likely get 7 or 8 years, or even more, barring abuse or neglect.  Of course, likely isn't a guarantee or even a warranty.  

[Jimmy Wallhanger]

They are ALL built in China. My Power Queen battery is JUST as good as a DL that costs 3x as much