Megabass Spectrophotometer Test.......

[Crow Horse]

I've been fascinated (more like hypnotized) by the vast array of Megabass paint options. This interest had me curious about what and how bass actually see in the water. Before I go any further, I make no pretense of being any kind of expert (on any subject ) but I am perpetually curious about things.

 

Mr. Science mode on......

 

From my reading, we as humans have trichromatic vision (cones sensitive to red, blue, green) and bass are dichromatic (cones sensitive to red & green) yet the visual light spectrum for bass is wider than humans, extending into the UV & IR ranges.

 

If the above is true, I was curious about if any of the paint finishes touch in those areas (UV & IR) and if so, then how much?

 

What I do know is that the characteristics of the pigments used in paints do vary even from batch to batch comparisons of the same color.

 

With that in mind, I had my wife, who works for a major paint manufacturer and is responsible for quality control, run 2 different Megabass 110's, one a GG Perch OB & a Mat Perch. on a X-Rite vs450 spectrophotometer. The results were disappointing.

 

Unfortunately, this particular spectrophotometer (or it's software) is set up to plot only the visible light spectrum of humans (400-700nm) and I was hoping for a wider spread. Despite that, I though it was interesting to see the differences in the two similar but different finishes.

 

For the record, I'm not suggesting that a spectrophotometer should be in everyone's tackle box. It was available and I thought, "why not"?

 

Below is the resulting graph from the spectrophotometer....

 

[A-Jay]

Interesting ~

Wonder how all this plays out in the dark of night ?

A-Jay

[gim]

26 minutes ago, Crow Horse said:

I've been fascinated (more like hypnotized) by the vast array of Megabass paint options.

 

At one point I was also fascinated by them too.  I even splurged on a "limited release" version last winter that costed more than a standard one on ebay.  There are some vision 110 jerk baits that are up to 250 bucks on there.  I tried this one a day last fall when I was fishing for smallmouth and catching them on a perch colored one just to see if it would work.  I gave it 30 minutes, same cadence, retrieve, with known fish around.  Not a single strike.  Went back to the perch color and started catching fish again in 10 minutes.  I may need a bigger sample size, but at least for now, I'm sold on more natural colors, not limited release or bright eye-catching ones.

 

Their attention to detail is obviously better than the average lure, no denying that.  I think some of the colors they have (and other lures in general) are designed to catch angler's wallets, not fish.  Let's just use a frog for example.  They are always packaged so that the top of the frog is facing outward when you buy it.  But when was the last time a bass saw it from above?

 

BTW perch is one of my top producing colors so your information is useful.

[MIbassyaker]

My understanding of bass sensitivity to UV and IR is that the evidence is very mixed.

 

In any case, the reflectance ranges of these color patterns look to be right in line with the response of the two bass cone cells, which have been found to have average peak responses at 535nm and 614nm.

[Crow Horse]

Adding to the mix (or confusion).......

 

Trichromatic vs (simulated) Dichromatic (blue blind - Tritanopia)

 

Other variables to consider: water depth, water clarity, light source intensity, angle of light source......

[Crow Horse]

15 minutes ago, gimruis said:

I'm sold on more natural colors, not limited release or bright eye-catching ones.

I feel the same way but those wild colors don't always look as wild to a bass as they do to us. Chartreuse appears near white to a bass....

[Team9nine]

“A” for effort and love dragging scientific equipment in to analyze all things fishing - my old stomping grounds, but agree with @MIbassyaker in that the research data supporting IR/UV vision in adult bass is pretty weak. I’d actually go so far as to say outside of potential juvenile possibilities that get outgrown with age, it’s really not there at all.

[gim]

5 minutes ago, Crow Horse said:

I feel the same way but those wild colors don't always look as wild to a bass as they do to us. Chartreuse appears near white to a bass....

 

I'm sure there are "collectors" out there too that will buy them at inflated prices.  Otherwise they wouldn't be making and selling them.

 

I could see a brighter color working in stained water.  Jerk baits are mostly a visual lure IMO.  They don't give off much vibration or noise, so a really bright color like pink, orange, or chartreuse would help in murky water.  Maybe I will try mine this season in a stained-water lake.  I only tried it in clear water last season, which failed.

[Tennessee Boy]

Cool information.  I agree with others that there’s not much evidence that bass can see IR and even less that they can see UV as adults.  There’s good money to be made in lure colors.   You might consider buying lures and reselling them at twice the price with a spectrophotometer chart for that specific lure.

[JediAmoeba]

What about those bass that are near or far sighted? Who is going to be a bass optometrist? 

[A-Jay]

25 minutes ago, JediAmoeba said:

What about those bass that are near or far sighted? Who is going to be a bass optometrist? 

 

Why the Incredible Mr Limpet of course ~ 

🤓

A-Jay

[Crow Horse]

 

 

[Crow Horse]

What Bass Can See - Part 2 (science, speculation, & ancedotal evidence)

[MIbassyaker]

1 hour ago, Crow Horse said:

What Bass Can See - Part 2 (science, speculation, & ancedotal evidence)

 

Interesting contrast of opinions in those interviews.

 

This recent study from 2019 verifies dichromacy in Largemouth Bass from direct measurements of photoreceptor sensitivity, which is something prior studies didn't do -- they find two cones, and not more than two:

https://academic.oup.com/cz/article/65/1/43/4924236

 

Even the older Kawamura and Kishimoto (2002) study that is cited in the second interview at the link above, as evidence of more than two cones doesn't really show that.  Fortunately, that paper is also available:

https://www.jstage.jst.go.jp/article/fishsci1994/68/5/68_5_1041/_pdf/-char/ja

 

What that second study actually found was that bass vision is strongly "red" heavy. I don't know where second guy in the interview is getting the notion that this study definitely shows bass have 3 cones, but it doesn't do anything of the sort. The measurement of color sensitivity in this study comes from "C-Responses", which are electrical recordings of nerve cells in the retina that react to color stimulation, it's not a measure of the receptors themselves. And the main finding is that long wavelengths in the "red" range yield a much bigger response than anything else.

 

Unfortunately, the claims by the other interviewees about studies showing that bass respond selectively to UV lures do not seem to be accompanied by any peer-reviewed sources we can look at and evaluate.  Behavioral evidence is notoriously easily corrupted by poor controls, so without knowing more details of their methods, I can't have much confidence in their conclusions.

[Tennessee Boy]

Well I typed up a response to the evidence presented but@MIbassyaker posted his and said it all.  The 2019 study is the best science on the subject in my opinion and has been discussed at length on this forum.  I wouldn’t pay much attention to what the owner of a UV bait company has to say about bass UV vision.  

[Crow Horse]

I found this video interesting because it conflicts with the scientific studies that have been presented.

I'm not leaning that they are sensitive to UV & IR light until I see compelling evidence.

**Edit - However, I'm leaving the door open to that possibility....

 

 

[Bigbox99]

I buy colors I think look cool.  

[txchaser]

I like these high-effort threads. Always some nuggets in there.

[txchaser]

I like these high-effort threads. Always some nuggets in there.

 

Of particular note from the 2019 study:
We note that in both Experiments #1 and #2, group dynamics appeared to be important in these assays: 1 or 2 bold fish appeared to do the choosing.

 

The fish grew rapidly between September and November and were approximately 15 cm (6 inches) when we began training. By the end of our assays, the bass were subadults and ranged from 20 to 30 cm (8–12 inches) in standard length.

 

1) the leader behavior seems to match what we see with the idea of "firing a school up"

2) these are dinks! I wonder if adult bass would have different results.