2024 Livescope/FFS prediction

[txchaser]

I think this year is going to be the year a shallow water fisherman drops the hammer in a tournament, using perspective mode. I'm watching all the guys that are heavy on vertical livescope start to fiddle with horizontal, add an extra transducer, etc. 

 

Imagine you are running down a 45 degree bank, boat sitting in 10fow, casting shallow. Unless they are dead still and in the dirt, you're going to be able to see whether there's a fish there or not. And if you are good or have the right color combo you'll still see a bounce from the fish vs the bottom. 

 

[Tennessee Boy]

The big problem with the horizontal mode is the limited width of the beam.   The beam is 20 degrees wide when vertical so it’s only 20 degrees top to bottom when horizontal.  That’s a very limited slice of the water in front of you.  You’ve got 90 degrees from the surface to directly below you.  20 degrees covers less than a 1/4 of that.  I’m not saying it’s not useful but it’s a big limitation that the marketing folks don’t talk much about.  360 shows you a lot more with higher resolution but it’s not live.

[12poundbass]

My prediction is John Cox hammers them with no electronics and a Fortrex. 😎

[AlabamaSpothunter]

Over half the events will be won a spinning rod, and some sort of 3-5" swimbait (FFS exclusively)

 

Another 1/4th of he events will be won on a whacky/senko worm ( spawning sight fish, but some will still be caught on FFS with this technique)

 

Last 1/4th of the events will be won on a combo of a C-Rig, Dropshot, Deep crank, Glide, and Beaver style bait. (most of which will be caught using FFS)

 

Interesting thought though as I noticed what you have with Zaldains and Millikens boat walk through videos.     

 

14 minutes ago, 12poundbass said:

My prediction is John Cox hammers them with no electronics and a Fortrex. 😎

Bass fishing would be a vastly better thing if this happens, nobody is easier to root for than Cox.   

 

Guys like Welcher would likely abandon FFS, many of these topflight pro's savant level technique skills have been rendered relatively useless in the face of FFS which in of itself is the king of techniques imho.  

[Susky River Rat]

Miliken made a video how pretty much the top guys before FFS are the top guys after it and now much has changed. There is only a select few that couldn’t keep up with the change or started blowing people away with it. 
 

I think the true shallow water experts will shine without the use of FFS. I think we will soon come to a point where people rely to much on it and won’t abandon it for their instincts 

[Woody B]

We need to try and have at least 1 new FFS thread every day.

[Tennessee Boy]

I predict 100% will be won with trolling motors.

They should be band.

You can’t win without one.

Paddling is becoming a lost art.

 

[gim]

[Catt]

34 minutes ago, Tennessee Boy said:

I predict 100% will be won with trolling motors.

 

The latest "thing" is brakes for your boat. Two trolling motors, one on each shallow water anchor.

 

Google it 😉

 

[FryDog62]

I agree 360 imaging is better in the shallows than Perspective mode (too grainy to be very effective IMO).  

 

In terms of the flak FFS is getting - If there isn't enough criticism towards Livescope already - wait until people see the 22 inch NBT screens on the bow of a bass boat (see video below at 1:50 mark). That's when the common person (and avid fishermen too) look at it and say things like "excessive," or "overkill," etc.  

 

That'll lead to the death of FFS as fast as anything ~

 

https://www.omniafishing.com/omnia-videos/seth-feider-2024-boat-walkthrough

[Logan S]

I think you're going to see a lot of pro boats with over-the-top electronics setups and it'll continue to be a hot topic.  I also think this will be the season that illustrates just how excessive some of the electronics setups can be and the big tournament organizations will use it to evaluate what types of rules they want to put in place.  

 

I'm not for outright bans, but at some point I think there has to be some type of limitation on electronic equipment...Whether it's the # of screens, # of transducers, total screen area, or whatever.

 

(Disclaimer so I don't get lumped in with RandyB...I have FFS on my boat)

[WRB]

Jordan Lee returning to B.A.S.S. knows how to catch with and without FFS-Live Scope, deep, medium and shallow water.

Can’t count out old school flipping-pitching if it’s a shallow cover bite.

Tom

[gim]

11 hours ago, FryDog62 said:

wait until people see the 22 inch NBT screens on the bow of a bass boat

Haha. I posted this exact video about a week ago in the tournament thread. That screen alone is $4,000 MSRP. And it’s only a plug n play with Garmin. It’s not even a standalone piece of equipment.

[TriStateBassin106]

BASS and MLF would be fun to watch again IMO if they had no livescope/FFS tournaments. Livescope is here to stay and won't be going away anytime soon and some people need to accept that. but the option to watch people fish without it would be entertaining. 

[TnRiver46]

@TriStateBassin106, just watch the Florida tourneys…….

 

i watch a whole bunch of BASS live and people easily forget about the entire season because they always finish up north in deep clear water using electronics. The season started with Scott Martin catching big ones on a devils horse and nobody remembers. Hunter shryock nearly won Murray on a berkley choppo right against the bank. They remember the last tournament which is st Lawrence and FFS 

 

it’s a strange phenomenon that happens nowadays, nobody remembers anything except the last thing 

[AlabamaSpothunter]

2 hours ago, TnRiver46 said:

@TriStateBassin106, just watch the Florida tourneys…….

 

i watch a whole bunch of BASS live and people easily forget about the entire season because they always finish up north in deep clear water using electronics. The season started with Scott Martin catching big ones on a devils horse and nobody remembers. Hunter shryock nearly won Murray on a berkley choppo right against the bank. They remember the last tournament which is st Lawrence and FFS 

 

it’s a strange phenomenon that happens nowadays, nobody remembers anything except the last thing 

Every event was won in part with the usage of FFS including the Sabine River

Rivet used FFS almost exlusively on his big O win.  Caught over 80% of his weighed fish on a Jerbait that he watched live.   

 

Same deal happened the next event at a fishery where FFS shouldn't play.....Cowboy won Seminole using a dropshot and FFS.

 

With all due respect, everybody remembers FFS wins because every single win can largely be attributed to FFS usage, or at least that's the winning "technique".

[A-Jay]

2 hours ago, TnRiver46 said:

@TriStateBassin106, just watch the Florida tourneys…….

 

i watch a whole bunch of BASS live and people easily forget about the entire season because they always finish up north in deep clear water using electronics. The season started with Scott Martin catching big ones on a devils horse and nobody remembers. Hunter shryock nearly won Murray on a berkley choppo right against the bank. They remember the last tournament which is st Lawrence and FFS 

 

it’s a strange phenomenon that happens nowadays, nobody remembers anything except the last thing 

So do you watch a bunch of BASS LIVE ?

😋

A-Jay

[TnRiver46]

40 minutes ago, AlabamaSpothunter said:

Every event was won in part with the usage of FFS including the Sabine River

Rivet used FFS almost exlusively on his big O win.  Caught over 80% of his weighed fish on a Jerbait that he watched live.   

 

Same deal happened the next event at a fishery where FFS shouldn't play.....Cowboy won Seminole using a dropshot and FFS.

 

With all due respect, everybody remembers FFS wins because every single win can largely be attributed to FFS usage, or at least that's the winning "technique".

Yeah but they show more than just the person that wins, biggest bass of the year caught with a wacky in a foot of water. John cox beat 75-80 scopers in AOY without the unit 

 

it’s the hot topic 

[AlabamaSpothunter]

Oh I'm not arguing that some guys refuse to let it lead the cart, especially stud hammers like Christie and Cox, I mean two of the best pre FFS pros to ever do it.  

 

I just listened to a podcast with Hackney or some other pro, and they went down the list of last year's winners, all the winners relied heavily on FFS.  The Sabine River with Mosley winning with FFS and Bubba Shotting was the most telling imho.

 

The problem I have now is that some folks like Milliken really, really try to downplay the success and amount they relied on FFS.   I watched all of Milliken's weighed in fish this year because he posts the Open videos, and 9/10 fish were caught using FFS, yet when interviewed about the % of fish caught using it, he said something VASTLY lower.   Some folks hate the idea of being known as scopers and thusly act like it's not the absolute game changing tech our eyes tell us it is.   

 

I've come to terms with the fact FFS is the future, its completely reinvented fishing, not just for Bass guys.    I just want folks to accept and admit the mind boggling way in which it changes the game.    Every catch, every win, every DD fish should be viewed whether it was caught with or without FFS imho......one's not worse than the other, but they're very different.     

 

The guy out there in a tin boat with no electronics catching a 10.6 is a world away from a guy out there with two LVS 34s on the TM, one at the cockpit, and Crappie Brakes on poles in the back who catches a similar 10.6 IMHO.   

[gim]

5 hours ago, TnRiver46 said:

They remember the last tournament which is st Lawrence and FFS 

It wasn't just that event though.  It's essentially every northern smallmouth water they have because of the time of year.

 

I've been saying this for a while now, but if they would schedule some of those northern smallmouth events at a different time of year other than midsummer, the tactics would most definitely change.

[Catt]

Yep that's what it looks like – trolling motors mounted on "shallow-water anchors." They're made by a MS company called Magnolia Tooling owned by crappie fisherman named Jonathan Johns, who made them for Scoping crappie. Bass Blaster.

 

[AlabamaSpothunter]

This company makes them too, they just buy 30 and 40lb Minn Kota Endura motors and re tool the housings.    SeeBrakes – SeeLite (seeliteleds.com)

 

Last year when Fujita was running 4 transducers the fishing world's head exploded......this year over 50% of the anglers will be running 2+ transducers, 22" screens are being utilized, and now 10-20 guys will be running Crappie Brakes.  

 

Eventually BASS is going to realize the vast majority of the audience can't relate to $100k+ bare boned glitter rockets with 25-50k of tech shoved on them imho.   Even Garmin has realized this, recently when the Johnston brothers were interviewed about FFS and this upcoming season, they brought up how some guys are even using the saltwater FFS transducers that shoot 600ft lol.    When asked if Garmin pushes that stuff on the pros, they said no because Garmin wants them to showcase their mainstream/non niche product which is the LVS 34 transducer.    This was very telling to me.   

 

Nascars were anything but stock, but there's a reason why they use the term stockcar and they make them to look more like a normal car than an F1 cart.    There's also a reason why every major pro sport standardizes the equipment the competitors use.

 

Lastly, I doubt this was Ray Scott's vision considering how he appreciated seeing a level playing field.   

[Woody B]

I don't "get" the "brakes".   My Active Target (the same brand some of the brakers use) is not good, at least for me going over 2 or 3 mph.   How fast are they going, while looking at the live screen?   I have, and will idle around with my trolling motor and transducer down looking at a screen.   When I see something I want to cast to I put the (big) motor in reverse for a couple seconds and hit anchor on my trolling motor.   When chasing "wolfpacks" like this the biggest I normally catch are 15 inch Spots.   I suspect other bodies of water are different though.     I suppose the "brakes" may help in the wind.  

 

I don't have shallow water anchors for a few reasons.  I suspect they wouldn't work that great on my light boat.  Also, even if I'm fishing shallow my boat is usually in water too deep to use them.   The exception would be putting the boat on the shallow part of a point and working a bait up the slope toward the boat.  

[AlabamaSpothunter]

Woody, the Crappie Brakes are to stop the boat's forward momentum without having to do it with the front TM.....hints the name "brakes".

 

Still kind of silly, but then again I'm not a FFS user.   

 

 

[Tennessee Boy]

I watched Millken's video of his first time out in his new boat.  It was interesting to watch.  He had vertical FFS on one screen and was using it constantly.  He had perspective mode on the other screen and it looked terrible from what I could tell.  Didn't seem to be dialed in at all.   He had the map on his Humminbird screen and not 360 which he has added.  It will be interesting to see how the pros utilize prospective mode this year and if the OP's prediction comes true.  I've had FFS for almost 2 years and I've had the transducer flipped on it's side for maybe 30 minutes just to check it out.