Milikin on Private Equity

[rangerjockey]

53 minutes ago, Bandersnatch said:

Why are we mad at Milikin and not the giant corporations that buy out our small companies destroying the innovation, diversity & cost effectiveness to the customer? 
 

I'm not mad at him I just don't like him. He acts like he has uncovered some giant conspiracy.

Hell, I'm still mad at Rapala for buying storm and jacking up the wiggle wart and that's been close to 20 years. Ranger has had what? 4 different ownerships. Lews has absolutely nothing to do with the late Lew Childre but Lynn Reeves bought the name from the Childre family and then it gets sold to strike Kings parent company whoever they are.

Things get bought because they are for sale

 

[PhishLI]

13 hours ago, Bandersnatch said:

I’m not a milkin fan boy

Yeesh. Any time I hear actual men defending themselves by claiming not to be a fanboy...Defending yourself with a slur? Just don't. That word is so weak. 

 

I'm not offended by Milliken in the least. Not enough to throw out the baby with the bathwater.

 

He wasn't calling out PE. He was addressing the current trend on some YT channels spreading negativity about the fishing industry. Gerald Swindle has addressed this trend too. He was also explaining something specific to the Jacob Fs of the industry, and that is that individual companies aren't sitting on a pile of cash and are unwilling to part with it to sponsor anglers. Instead, it's ownership entities who now control these staple brands who suck out surplus dollars and distribute them as they see fit.

 

This situation leaves guys like Foutz out of the $ equation who was unaware that being a Bassmaster Elite isn't enough these days. Googan Owner Rob Terkla called Foutz on the Zaldaingerous podcast and promised him Bass Mafia would consider him for sponsorship if he would ramp up is YT output greatly. In other words, get a strong social media presence and you'll get paid. Chris Zaldain recently mentioned that a honcho from Megabass claimed Randy was moving tons of product for them once he began uploading YT content, and that started 3 years ago. Obviously, this is measurable where ROI from logos on a jersey is nebulous at best. Here there aren't affiliate links to prove something or nothing.

 

 

[livin2fish]

Others have probably said this before me, but anyone who thinks this has not been happening in all types of business has had his head in the sand.  

[AlabamaSpothunter]

When the right opportunity arises, you better believe Milliken, or really the actual majority owners of 6th Sense like Casey will sell out.

 

It's the American dream, start a company, grow a company, turn a company into a success, then sell the company out.      

 

As far as Milliken goes, it's getting tough to watch his content as I find it to be increasingly a big sales ad for 6th Sense.   If he catches fish on baits besides 6th Sense you'll be lucky if he names them.   

 

The problem with fishing personalities has always been the wares they're shilling.   You have to weed through all the sales pitches to glean a little information.  

[Glenn]

Milliken used to be a member here: @FishnBen  He hasn't been here in a long time.  Take out of that what you will.  

[PhishLI]

1 hour ago, AlabamaSpothunter said:

As far as Milliken goes, it's getting tough to watch his content as I find it to be increasingly a big sales ad for 6th Sense. 

You gettin' the new line-thru?😆

[Bandersnatch]

That line through seems to not be the easiest to fish. 

[Eric 26]

@AlabamaSpothunter I will say I agree with your statement above mostly but it’s not always the case. I work for a small one owner concrete company here in Illinois, we are a union shop and we’re not the only small concrete company in our area. In the same area we have 2 giant concrete companies 1 family owned and 1 corporate owned, and every so often we hear that we’ve been bought out but it turns out not to be true thankfully for us. The point I’m trying to make is although I don’t know if my owner has a price that would make him or any of the other owners sell but I’m thankful every day he hasn’t done it yet.

[PhishLI]

6 minutes ago, Bandersnatch said:

That line through seems to not be the easiest to fish. 

He dropped a long vid on it the other day with lots of details. Every bait I own, big or small, needs to be observed in clear water to see how it behaves regarding retrieve, then adjusted to. I saw no difference with this one.

[Mike L]

4 hours ago, Eric 26 said:

. I work for a small one owner concrete company here in Illinois, we are a union shop and we’re not the only small concrete company in our area. In the same area we have 2 giant concrete companies 1 family owned and 1 corporate owned, and every so often we hear that we’ve been bought out but it turns out not to be true thankfully for us. The point I’m trying to make is although I don’t know if my owner has a price that would make him or any of the other owners sell but I’m thankful every day he hasn’t done it yet.

I was in the concrete industry for 33 yrs. 
During that time I went through 3 corporate buy outs after being originally hired by a family owned one. 
 

Each time salary and benefits went up while hourly drivers, QC, credit and maintenance personnel’s benefits either stayed the same or was restructured. 
 

When I lived up there, the biggest ones were Praire and Ozinga and now I understand Vulcan which I’m sure are union shops where down here we weren’t. 
That was the biggest difference for the rank and file. 
 

Point is, each buyout was met with anger, frustration and anxiety. 
A lot of employees threatened to leave but in the end it didn’t matter. 
The owners really didn’t care, they knew thier business would go on with or without them. 
 

 

 

Mike

[mcipinkie]

Who cares about what MIlliken thinks about finances and private equity?  He's just counting clicks and views.

 

This is a bass fishing forum. 

 

If you are hunting Warren Buffett, I doubt he frequents this site..

[Bandersnatch]

29 minutes ago, mcipinkie said:

Who cares about what MIlliken thinks about finances and private equity?  He's just counting clicks and views.

 

This is a bass fishing forum. 

 

If you are hunting Warren Buffett, I doubt he frequents this site..

Enlightening 

[PhishLI]

11 hours ago, Glenn said:

Milliken used to be a member here: @FishnBen 

Ah. So that's why he got the blue trophy.

[GReb]

M&A isn’t inherently bad. The problem the bass fishing industry has is these companies aren’t being acquired by big money PEs or corps who see benefit in investing back into the industry. If they were you wouldn’t hear any complaints because then money would be pouring into the tournament scene. Professional bass fishing is cash crippled. The current M&As aren’t increasing industry cash flow. That’s the issue. 

[Bandersnatch]

Correct. Which is also what Milikin is saying. They aren’t putting it back in, we all just pay more and the sport doesn’t grow. It doesn’t grow because they keep the profits .

5 hours ago, Bandersnatch said:

Correct. Which is also what Milikin is saying. They aren’t putting it back in, we all just pay more and the sport doesn’t grow. It doesn’t grow because they keep the profits .ill do you one better. If athletes didn’t get paid more the sport wouldn’t grow right? Most athletes are unique in how it takes decades to hone their craft. For that, they demand compensation. Enter forward facing sonar, sure, ffs requires skill, let’s not get our panties in a bunch but it certainly doesn’t require the skill that say it took a rick clun or other anglers the number of years it took to hone their craft. These anglers could break down water, any water but it took decades of knowledge & experince. No, with FFS we’ve significantly decreased the knowledge gap. To a degree they won’t have to worry about having to compensate the next lebronn james of bass fishing because there’s a million other guys that can watch and fish FFS almost as good as him… 

 

[Susky River Rat]

Ben is basically getting at you shop at lowes or you support your mom and pop hardware store. 
 

imagine if Microsoft bought bass resource. Do you think we would still have this family feeling we have now? It would just be about algorithms to increase profits. There would be more trouble, more personal attacks and more ads. Not a community built around bass fishing and its anglers. 
 

on a side note I currently work for a publicly traded company vs a family owned like I did before. I would never go back to a family owned one to work for. It’s great not feeling like a number but, finically I wouldnt be as well off.

[Bandersnatch]

 

Correct. Which is also what Milikin is saying. They aren’t putting it back in, we all just pay more and the sport doesn’t grow. It doesn’t grow because they keep the profits .ill do you one better. If athletes didn’t get paid more the sport wouldn’t grow right? Most athletes are unique in how it takes decades to hone their craft. For that, they demand compensation. Enter forward facing sonar, sure, ffs requires skill, let’s not get our panties in a bunch but it certainly doesn’t require the skill that say it took a rick clun or other anglers the number of years it took to hone their craft. These anglers could break down water, any water but it took decades of knowledge & experince. No, with FFS we’ve significantly decreased the knowledge gap. To a degree they won’t have to worry about having to compensate the next lebronn james of bass fishing because there’s a million other guys that can watch and fish FFS almost as good as him… 

[Tennessee Boy]

I think you guys are oversimplifying the fishing industry.   Pure Fishing is not keeping all the profits.  They don’t have any profits.  Also companies have never cared if the pros they sponsor could catch fish,  they just want them to sell products.

[TnRiver46]

@Tennessee Boy, yeah but you can’t sell product if you don’t catch them and re qualify 

[Tennessee Boy]

Just now, TnRiver46 said:

@Tennessee Boy, yeah but you can’t sell product if you don’t catch them and re qualify 

Bill Dance still sells products and he hasn’t caught a fish in a tournament in a long time.

[TnRiver46]

Yes and how much product has Kevin Langill moved since 2009………

 

Both things can be true 

[Tennessee Boy]

Obviously the guy standing on the stage with the trophy has a better opportunity to sell products than the guy driving home because he didn’t make the cut.  But catching fish doesn’t guarantee that sponsors will love you.  I knew a guy many years ago who made a run at a pro career.  He was a great fisherman,  and a nice guy but anyone that talked to him would quickly realize that his fishing rod was smarter than he was.  One tournament he was on stage showing off the big fish of the day and Ray Scott ask him what he caught it on.  He refused to answer.  Ray prodded him some more but he would not say what he caught the fish on.   No one is going to sponsor someone like that. 

[Susky River Rat]

@Tennessee Boythis is very true. In motocross Suzuki hired Ricky Carmichael “the goat” ask anyone that isn’t an opinion. The slogan was what wins Sunday sells on Monday. That never happened with them despite him killing it. It wasn’t his personality either. People just didn’t want them.

[PhishLI]

1 hour ago, Tennessee Boy said:

Obviously the guy standing on the stage with the trophy has a better opportunity to sell products than the guy driving home because he didn’t make the cut.

True, but how much does this really matter? Milliken argues that it barely matters at all and so does Swindle who claimed he makes most of his revenue from FB if I'm recalling correctly. At the very least it's hard to prove ROI without affiliate links or codes linked to the endorser. But that's in-the-weeds stuff.

 

Here's the bigger picture. I watch fishing tournaments, but nobody in my circle watches pro fishing tournaments, not even my brother. Nobody I know of outside of my immediate circle, and I know a lot of people who bass fish, watch pro fishing or even follow it with the exception of one kid. He actually chose a college because it has a fishing program. All of these guys are obsessed, like really obsessed, but they could care less about the pros other than the kid. They know a name or two, but that's it.  Also, I know of none who are regulars on any fishing forums. They get their info from YT and perhaps from some specialty forums on FB or local FB groups. Few are regular participants in any group. They get whatever info they need, and they're gone. Very few are active.

 

Regardless of how many fishing licenses are sold each year, the audience for pro tournament bass fishing is clearly very small outside of the people who do it, their families, and perhaps some of their friends. Look at the weigh-in audiences, when they happen to show them. The Classic is an outlier.

 

That's why pro bass fishing is cash poor. Most people just don't care about it. Some will care more with someone like Milliken coming in, or the next Milliken-esque YT star who's up to scratch and can qualify because they'll bring their audiences with them. Their audiences will buy the stuff they promote, and those sales will be measurable as will the watch time for tournaments. I'd bet nothing drove last year's Open's numbers more than Milliken's audience. The site crashes during weigh-ins were ridiculous and annoying.

 

 

[Bandersnatch]

Well it’s January first and I’m going to say there’s a lot to “unpack here”.

 

reading through this I can’t help but think, why do I care if tournament bass fishing has a major audience? In fact, I believe we’ve all heard that bass fisheries and the tools themselves haven’t been able to support the explosion of the industry. Even if tournament bass fishing were to turn into the next big thing and even scratch the surface at the audience of major sports the fisheries and its resources would likely be decimated. I haven’t thought too much about this. 
 

as for the anglers, I do agree most people don’t follow names but also agree that is only going to get worse with FFS. There used to be something for a guy who fished for 30 years was regularly at the top because he learned everything. No. I’m, not saying they jump in the boat but what I am saying is that a kid (18 and above) with resources and two years of fishing constantly can become a major competitor in tournament fishing just by mastering FFS & off shore bass fishing. You couldn’t do that before, you’d be laughed out of the tournaments that even qualify you for the tournaments that. qualify you for the next ones. That’s my FFS rant. 
 

but anyways, you’re right, tournament fishing isn’t all that popular and I’m not sure I really want it to be. I’m not sure I want the costs to come significantly down to where every household is fishing simply for the fact that we don’t have enough natural resources to support it.