I am venting

[thediscochef]

So I waited weeks to get a new clutch Lever for my tatula ct. As I go to replace it I'm also cleaning and greasing it. I go to take off the main gear, and one of the screws is hopelessly stuck. The head is basically destroyed at this point - I had the right screwdriver but it's like the metal in the screw just gave way. This was my first baitcaster. I'm honestly furious that one overtightened screw is gonna make me wait longer. I'm guessing I can maybe drill it out and take the other one somewhere to find a matching replacement. I was just really, really excited to get this reel working again today, fish with it tomorrow. Not gonna happen. Thanks I'll hang up and listen now 

[PhishLI]

Sorry to hear that. Those particular screws often have blue loctite applied, so you really do need a screwdriver with a near perfect fit. Holding the frame very tightly in one hand or firmly in place on a table while keeping the screwdriver perfectly perpendicular to the frame with the other hand is the key. If you did that and applied the correct amount of pressure and it still cam'd out, that's a tough one. Drilling it out will be just about impossible with a hand drill, so I'd avoid that.

[gim]

This is why I don't disassemble reels.

[thediscochef]

2 hours ago, PhishLI said:

Sorry to hear that. Those particular screws often have blue loctite applied, so you really do need a screwdriver with a near perfect fit. Holding the frame very tightly in one hand or firmly in place on a table while keeping the screwdriver perfectly perpendicular to the frame with the other hand is the key. If you did that and applied the correct amount of pressure and it still cam'd out, that's a tough one. Drilling it out will be just about impossible with a hand drill, so I'd avoid that.

I did everything the way I do with guitar repair - I don't think it was my technique. The other one and both the same screws on my other CT didn't have a problem with the same routine. people who strip out the head of a screw are the worst and yet here I am committing the same offense. I've seen it happen on guitar hardware screws before, where it all fits right, but for whatever reason that metal is just weak and gives. I wish I had taken a photo, I had four near-identical bits of metal come off on the indentations in the screwdriver. Just a weak screw or something, too much loctite. I have a damaged screw reverser thing that has a 1.3mm head on it...gonna try in the morning but if it doesn't work this reel is basically a parts reel now. Makes me sick 

[thediscochef]

i would have succeeded if it weren't for the fact that i failed

[PhishLI]

6 hours ago, thediscochef said:

.gonna try in the morning

Try warming up the frame first. Low heat if you have a heat gun. High heat if you have a blow dryer.

[TnRiver46]

Extractor ? Was it Phillips? 

[PhishLI]

5 minutes ago, TnRiver46 said:

Was it Phillips?

Yes.

[garroyo130]

Wiha or Wera or those screws aren't coming out ... I learned the Craftsman way 

[casts_by_fly]

13 hours ago, gimruis said:

This is why I don't disassemble reels.

 

same.  Its fine when it goes right but when it goes wrong...  the most I'll do is pull a side plate and spool out.  

[r83srock]

Order a vessel p1 screwdriver on Amazon for $10 and give it a shot. Extractors look promising also. The other think you could do is drill a small pilot hole in the center of bit. Then get a left handed drill and carefully pull the screw out. Or, drill the head with a bit the size of the screw and twist the head of the screw off.

[Bankc]

Yeah, I've run into that on one of my Tatula CT's as well.  It was the screws that hold down the shaft on the drag.  You had to access them through the holes in the gear above.  Two of those reels, they came out with a bit of torque.  On the third, I gave up and left it.  

 

Cycling heat and cold is a good way to break screws free, but with something like a reel with all of the plastic bits, I'm afraid to try that.  I usually rotate between a soldering iron placed on the screw head to heat it and canned air, held upside down to freeze it.  But I wouldn't trust either around plastic.  A little acetone allowed to seep down the threads also works stuff free, but again, with all of the painted metal and plastic, I wouldn't want to try that.  So I just called it good enough and moved on.  

 

I love those Tatula CT's.  They're so easy to use and really well made.  But they're not designed to be easily worked on.  I've never been able to get the spool bearing out on the side with the brakes either.  For all of that type of stuff, I just clean it in place and call it good.  

[WRB]

Most Japanese reels have JIS screws that look like Phipps but deeper. If your reel had JIS and you used a Phillips it will cam out and strip the recess.

Tom 

[thediscochef]

2 hours ago, Bankc said:

Yeah, I've run into that on one of my Tatula CT's as well.  It was the screws that hold down the shaft on the drag.  You had to access them through the holes in the gear above.  Two of those reels, they came out with a bit of torque.  On the third, I gave up and left it.  

 

Cycling heat and cold is a good way to break screws free, but with something like a reel with all of the plastic bits, I'm afraid to try that.  I usually rotate between a soldering iron placed on the screw head to heat it and canned air, held upside down to freeze it.  But I wouldn't trust either around plastic.  A little acetone allowed to seep down the threads also works stuff free, but again, with all of the painted metal and plastic, I wouldn't want to try that.  So I just called it good enough and moved on.  

 

I love those Tatula CT's.  They're so easy to use and really well made.  But they're not designed to be easily worked on.  I've never been able to get the spool bearing out on the side with the brakes either.  For all of that type of stuff, I just clean it in place and call it good.  

see this is the only issue I've run into with cleaning my CTs...the first one I did was so easy I wanted to sell some of my lews and get more CTs LOL. The star washer that holds the spool bearing in beneath the tension knob threw me at first but it's a pretty simple pry in/out. I really really like these reels and I find them easy to service...except this particular screw. I even have a salamandura 150 SV spool on the way for this thing. worst comes to worst I'll get a new one but I really don't want to do that just because of one small screw.
I haven't tried fiddling with it today yet but when I do I'll post results here. I ordered replacements already from daiwa so hopefully just another week or two and I'll be in business

 

45 minutes ago, WRB said:

Most Japanese reels have JIS screws that look like Phipps but deeper. If your reel had JIS and you used a Phillips it will cam out and strip the recess.

Tom 

I was using the right JIS for this, I prefer them to a standard phillips, generally harder to cam out than a phillips

[slowworm]

On 11/20/2023 at 7:36 AM, PhishLI said:

Yes.

You sure they are Philips? Could they be JIS, which looks a lot like a Philips but isnt?  A Philips will chew a JIS head out.  Ask me how I know.

 

Being Japanese, I would not be surprised at all if they are JIS screws.  I have a set of JIS screwdrivers for servicing my camera gear.

 

Edited to add, I appear to be late to the JIS screw party.  In future I should read to the end before replying.

 

[thediscochef]

4 hours ago, slowworm said:

You sure they are Philips? Could they be JIS, which looks a lot like a Philips but isnt?  A Philips will chew a JIS head out.  Ask me how I know.

 

Being Japanese, I would not be surprised at all if they are JIS screws.  I have a set of JIS screwdrivers for servicing my camera gear.

 

Edited to add, I appear to be late to the JIS screw party.  In future I should read to the end before replying.

 

We've all been there bud lol no worries 

[Delaware Valley Tackle]

Those screws aren’t deep at all.  It’s that darn loctite they insist on using. The red stuff on the older reels was a real PIA. I rather have a .25 oz heavier reel than deal with with the soft mini hardware used now. Truth be told it’s probably more about cost than weight. 

[T2DM]

On 11/20/2023 at 7:33 AM, garroyo130 said:

Wiha or Wera or those screws aren't coming out ... I learned the Craftsman way 

This is the only thing I use with my reels, never strip a screw.....ever!

 

Wera 3355 Pozidriv PZ 0

[Delaware Valley Tackle]

The fat handle is key too

[RipzLipz]

52 minutes ago, T2DM said:

This is the only thing I use with my reels, never strip a screw.....ever!

 

Wera 3355 Pozidriv PZ 0

Love those Wera tools!

 

[thediscochef]

success

[PhishLI]

14 minutes ago, thediscochef said:

success

No story? C'mon, man. Spill.

 

P.S. Daiwa Had the SV thumbar in stock?

[thediscochef]

25 minutes ago, PhishLI said:

No story? C'mon, man. Spill.

 

P.S. Daiwa Had the SV thumbar in stock?

I still suspect there was a weak patch of metal in the middle of the screw head...the first two extractor sizes just peeled metal out. But the third one grabbed right into it and it came out easily. Replacements shipped out this morning. 

 

Yes when I called I believe they said they had nine clutch levers in stock 

[postoak]

I read an article on the JIS vs Phillips issue recently.  Basically the Phillips standard has been modified to make it better.  You probably won't be able to find screwdrivers actually marked JIS, although the seller may refer to them that way. 

 

I can't find the original article, but here's part of an ongoing back and forth on them. 

Bike Gremlin

[MassYak85]

Usually the first time I service a reel is the riskiest. They are tight from the factory and sometimes have some loctite. Definitely gotta have the right screwdriver set and make sure you get a good bite before breaking them free that first time. I've stripped that same screw before.