Can someone please explain why I would use the first hook versus the second hook?

[casts_by_fly]

The bobber stop is a neat trick.  I think I saw someone else' post about it a couple weeks ago here.  When my dad and I went 2 weeks ago I couldn't keep a bait up on the bend (with a thin wire EWG).  It was the right hook for the setup, the head of the bait was just worn.  Rather than grab a new one I threaded a stop up the hook and problem solved.  I didn't have to rerig it once more throughout the day- just reskin hook it after a fish.

[WRB]

The history of soft plastic worm hooks would a interesting read and Tean9nine is the ideal member to write this article.

Keep in mind plastic worm hooks are constantly evolving.

#1 is a round bend off set hook.

#2 is a Extra Wide Gap off set hook.

Missing on both hooks are barbs to hold the soft plastic worm head end to prevent the worm sliding down onto the hook shank.

The EWG hook adds space to accommodate the extra plastic that fills the #1 hook gap.

Anglers have been trying to resolve the worm sliding down the hook shank for decades, as it prevents a good hook set with plastic covering the hook point.

The 1st I recall was using a round wooden tooth pick inserted through the worm head passing through the hook eye then trimmed off. Using large diameter mono line in lieu of the wood tooth pick followed and rubber Peg-It’s are used.

Recently pins were added the the off set hook bend to hold the worm head in place. The off set bend shape has changed in an effort to help hold the worm head.

What gets over looked is the off set hook point being below the line pulling force. #1 you can see this particular hook point is slightly above the hook eye line of pull. The straight shank hook the entire hook bend and point is above the line pull force, therefor increasing successful hook sets. Straight shank hooks require skill to rig properly.

The hook bend is another consideration. Most popular is the round bend shown #1. The modified Sproat EWG bend #2 has 2 negative design flaws; weaker and the extended bail shape cams over flat when a bass crunches down during the strike.  Advantage of #2 is accommodates more soft plastic of equal hook size ie; 3/0 vs 3/0.

Over coming hook design flaws is ongoing with dozens available to the bass angler choose.

Tom

 

[Darth-Baiter]

i choose between those two hooks depending on the girth of my bait.  in general, the bass hate both.  they both catch fish, and gobs of them.  

 

oh, i am moving away from your EWG type.  i dont like how the hook point aims directly at the hook-eye.  the bass mouth has to drop between those points to get jabbed.  it happens all the time, sure.  but i want them not to be in the same plane to get that added clearance.  

 

 

for example:

Owner J-hook, and Owner Haymaker respectively

 

[TOXIC]

2 hours ago, scaleface said:

I have been using Yum Dingers predominately and use this hook . I add a bobber stop to prevent the worm from balling up on the shank . It has worked 100 percent. Yes, I know a pack of hooks can be ordered that comes equipped with a keeper, I  just refuse to order a pack of hooks. A thin wire hook with the worm staying in place allows me a very high hook-up percentage. Even in heavy brush. I'm not catching ten lbers so the hook is adequate.

If I may be so bold to use your rig as an example of why Senkos don’t last.  You have way too much of the Senko in front of the hook eye.  To get it to last longer you need the very tip of the hook eye to be extending from the Senko.  That keeps your worm weight and your line from slicing the Senko causing it to begin to tear or ball up on the offset.  

[Catt]

When fishing a Texas Rigged Gene Larew's 6" Hawg Craw or Ragetail's Lobster I use hook #1. 

[fin]

A lizard or craw can't lay on its belly with an EWG.

[Bazoo]

3 hours ago, TOXIC said:

If I may be so bold to use your rig as an example of why Senkos don’t last.  You have way too much of the Senko in front of the hook eye.  To get it to last longer you need the very tip of the hook eye to be extending from the Senko.  That keeps your worm weight and your line from slicing the Senko causing it to begin to tear or ball up on the offset.  

Thanks for the tip! 

[Big Hands]

I have gone to using the design of #1 up to 7/0 for lizards so they'll run flatter to the bottom and because they tend to be longer overall.

 

I also cut about 2/3 of the lizard head off  (right where it starts to taper down into the neck and effectively replace that section with the worm weight and sometimes a glass bead. The worm weight (and glass bead) look like the head instead of having something hanging there in front of the head. This also gets the hook point further back on the body of the worm.

[Team9nine]

It's always interesting to dig back and find out the history of bass fishing stuff that now days, most people just take for granted. For instance, can you name when Gamakatsu hooks were introduced in the U.S.?

 

Gamakatsu began in 1955 in Japan, then the countries smallest hook manufacturer. It wouldn't be until 1992 that they had grown enough to form a U.S. marketing division to introduce their hooks to American bass anglers, Gamakatsu USA, Inc.. So over 30 years ago is the first part of this story.

 

Another interesting and related concept is the EWG hook, another tackle item we take for granted these days. It morphed from the traditional Eagle Claw J-style hook used back in the original days of the Carolina rig. From there, companies like Owner and Gamakatsu created "wide gap offset worm hooks," similar in nature but a little deeper. Then Lucky Strike introduced the Shaw Grigsby HP hook, a modified version of a Kahle hook, commonly used with live bait.

 

This was all in the early 90s. Then, in 1994, we got the blend of the offset worm hook combined with the Kahle-style live bait HP hook, and the "extra wide gap (EWG)" style hook was born. This 1994 ad, featuring B.A.S.S. pro Charlie Ingram, was one of the first such ads introducing the hook. Charlie mentions playing a part in the development of the hook. The "fat-bodied" and "big bodied" baits referred to in the ad might be a reference to baits such as the Slug-Go, which was first "broken" to the public by Rich Zaleski back in 1990 via an In-Fisherman article. Baits like the modern paddletails (~1996) and the Sweet Beaver (~2002) that frequently get used with EWG-style hooks didn't come about until a little later.

 

[Swamp Girl]

19 minutes ago, Team9nine said:

It's always interesting to dig back and find out the history of bass fishing stuff that now days, most people just take for granted. For instance, can you name when Gamakatsu hooks were introduced in the U.S.?

 

Gamakatsu began in 1955 in Japan, then the countries smallest hook manufacturer. It wouldn't be until 1992 that they had grown enough to form a U.S. marketing division to introduce their hooks to American bass anglers, Gamakatsu USA, Inc.. So over 30 years ago is the first part of this story.

 

Another interesting and related concept is the EWG hook, another tackle item we take for granted these days. It morphed from the traditional Eagle Claw J-style hook used back in the original days of the Carolina rig. From there, companies like Owner and Gamakatsu created "wide gap offset worm hooks," similar in nature but a little deeper. Then Lucky Strike introduced the Shaw Grigsby HP hook, a modified version of a Kahle hook, commonly used with live bait.

 

This was all in the early 90s. Then, in 1994, we got the blend of the offset worm hook combined with the Kahle-style live bait HP hook, and the "extra wide gap (EWG)" style hook was born. This 1994 ad, featuring B.A.S.S. pro Charlie Ingram, was one of the first such ads introducing the hook. Charlie mentions playing a part in the development of the hook. The "fat-bodied" and "big bodied" baits referred to in the ad might be a reference to baits such as the Slug-Go, which was first "broken" to the public by Rich Zaleski back in 1990 via an In-Fisherman article. Baits like the modern paddletails (~1996) and the Sweet Beaver (~2002) that frequently get used with EWG-style hooks didn't come about until a little later.

 

 

I'm out of responses, so I'll have to say that ^this^ is a great post.

[AlabamaSpothunter]

23 minutes ago, Team9nine said:

It's always interesting to dig back and find out the history of bass fishing stuff that now days, most people just take for granted. For instance, can you name when Gamakatsu hooks were introduced in the U.S.?

 

Gamakatsu began in 1955 in Japan, then the countries smallest hook manufacturer. It wouldn't be until 1992 that they had grown enough to form a U.S. marketing division to introduce their hooks to American bass anglers, Gamakatsu USA, Inc.. So over 30 years ago is the first part of this story.

 

Another interesting and related concept is the EWG hook, another tackle item we take for granted these days. It morphed from the traditional Eagle Claw J-style hook used back in the original days of the Carolina rig. From there, companies like Owner and Gamakatsu created "wide gap offset worm hooks," similar in nature but a little deeper. Then Lucky Strike introduced the Shaw Grigsby HP hook, a modified version of a Kahle hook, commonly used with live bait.

 

This was all in the early 90s. Then, in 1994, we got the blend of the offset worm hook combined with the Kahle-style live bait HP hook, and the "extra wide gap (EWG)" style hook was born. This 1994 ad, featuring B.A.S.S. pro Charlie Ingram, was one of the first such ads introducing the hook. Charlie mentions playing a part in the development of the hook. The "fat-bodied" and "big bodied" baits referred to in the ad might be a reference to baits such as the Slug-Go, which was first "broken" to the public by Rich Zaleski back in 1990 via an In-Fisherman article. Baits like the modern paddletails (~1996) and the Sweet Beaver (~2002) that frequently get used with EWG-style hooks didn't come about until a little later.

 

Still my favorite hooks, been using them since the late 90s.   

 

I used more 4/0 and 5/0 Gama EWG hooks than any other by a huge margin.   To me there is something magical about the wire size, it's a very thin diameter hook for what it is, which really allows the bait to have better action imho.    Never had a fish bend one out, but perhaps have missed a few fish by not having a stiff enough hook.   The superline EWGs are massive compared to the standard EWGs for example.   

Great writeup and history lesson!  

[Munkin]

Those hooks I use based on bait thickness.

 

Allen

[Bazoo]

13 hours ago, Team9nine said:

It's always interesting to dig back and find out the history of bass fishing stuff that now days, most people just take for granted. For instance, can you name when Gamakatsu hooks were introduced in the U.S.?

 

Gamakatsu began in 1955 in Japan, then the countries smallest hook manufacturer. It wouldn't be until 1992 that they had grown enough to form a U.S. marketing division to introduce their hooks to American bass anglers, Gamakatsu USA, Inc.. So over 30 years ago is the first part of this story.

 

Another interesting and related concept is the EWG hook, another tackle item we take for granted these days. It morphed from the traditional Eagle Claw J-style hook used back in the original days of the Carolina rig. From there, companies like Owner and Gamakatsu created "wide gap offset worm hooks," similar in nature but a little deeper. Then Lucky Strike introduced the Shaw Grigsby HP hook, a modified version of a Kahle hook, commonly used with live bait.

 

This was all in the early 90s. Then, in 1994, we got the blend of the offset worm hook combined with the Kahle-style live bait HP hook, and the "extra wide gap (EWG)" style hook was born. This 1994 ad, featuring B.A.S.S. pro Charlie Ingram, was one of the first such ads introducing the hook. Charlie mentions playing a part in the development of the hook. The "fat-bodied" and "big bodied" baits referred to in the ad might be a reference to baits such as the Slug-Go, which was first "broken" to the public by Rich Zaleski back in 1990 via an In-Fisherman article. Baits like the modern paddletails (~1996) and the Sweet Beaver (~2002) that frequently get used with EWG-style hooks didn't come about until a little later.

 

Thank you for sharing all of that information, it was a great read.

 

I remember about 30 years ago, when I first met Gamakatsu hooks. I bought a package from somewhere, and opened them, and I remember thinking "These are the sharpest hooks I've ever seen!" I was reading fishing magazines in the 90s, and into the early 2000s. I don't subscribe to any of them anymore, but I still read a few occasionally, and have a small stack of old ones that I snagged out of the recycling center that need reading.

15 hours ago, Big Hands said:

I have gone to using the design of #1 up to 7/0 for lizards so they'll run flatter to the bottom and because they tend to be longer overall.

 

I also cut about 2/3 of the lizard head off  (right where it starts to taper down into the neck and effectively replace that section with the worm weight and sometimes a glass bead. The worm weight (and glass bead) look like the head instead of having something hanging there in front of the head. This also gets the hook point further back on the body of the worm.

Howdy, Thanks for sharing your technique with us, that's a nice trick. 

 

When you say you use a glass bead, I take it that you are using both a glass bead and a lead weight? Does this rigging have a name? compact carolina rig?  Do you peg the weight? if it wasn't pegged super tight, it'd still make some noise... sounds like it might be a cool rig to try.

 

Or are you saying that you sometimes only use the glass bead? If so, why?

[Bazoo]

21 hours ago, TOXIC said:

If I may be so bold to use your rig as an example of why Senkos don’t last.  You have way too much of the Senko in front of the hook eye.  To get it to last longer you need the very tip of the hook eye to be extending from the Senko.  That keeps your worm weight and your line from slicing the Senko causing it to begin to tear or ball up on the offset.  

One of the things I do, when the head of the senko gets torn from the line/eye, I remove the damaged part and re-rig it, turning the senko 90º to get a fresh place for the shank and point to go through.

[Pat Brown]

 

Case study on why I use the first hook.

 

I was using stretchy line and light tackle and these fish took forceps to unhook and were both hooked on the upper lips perfectly.

 

I reckon those bass that pull ya into the grass might not unhook themselves so easily were you to use these more often ???

[Choporoz]

Owner Twistlock hooks have replaced both styles for me in most applications. 

[Big Hands]

7 hours ago, Bazoo said:

Howdy, Thanks for sharing your technique with us, that's a nice trick. 

 

When you say you use a glass bead, I take it that you are using both a glass bead and a lead weight? Does this rigging have a name? compact carolina rig?  Do you peg the weight? if it wasn't pegged super tight, it'd still make some noise... sounds like it might be a cool rig to try.

 

Or are you saying that you sometimes only use the glass bead? If so, why?

 

I'd call it a Texas rig and the reason I do it is because a weight (and a bead) in front of the head on a plastic lizard looks . . . . weird, and because this rig moves the hook back, fits the body better, and lets it sit flatter on the lake bottom. I use either a tungsten worm weight or a lead worm weight weight in front of the glass bead (no glass bead by itself) and sometimes put a sinker stop in front of the weight with a small gap in front of the sinker to let it be flexible and room for the sinker to clack against the glass bead.

 

I generally peg my worm hooks through the hook eye with a flat toothpick, and I shave it down for smaller hook eyes. I like flat toothpicks because they will still hold in place on opposite sides of the eye and leave a little room for the line on the flat side of the toothpick in a round hook eye.

 

I haven't tried it yet, but I have been thinking about trying a lizard on a hook with a weight on the shaft or maybe a nail weight just to see if it sinks more horizontally. With the nail weight, I can still use an offset worm hook.

 

Sometimes details are important; other times, not so much.

[WRB]

Out in the west coast we had the advantage of Japanese fishing companies introducing new products via pro bass anglers using their state of the art products.

My 1st exposure to Gamakatsu hooks was a Phenix rod rep handing out samples at Action Tackle. The rep claimed Gary Klein developed his weapon jig hook with Gamakatsu and was coming out with a Ghost hook for finesse worm fishing. The hand out package was a “Rubber Worm” hook!  

The 1st Owner hooks Don Iovino was promoting back in the early 90’s. 

The Japanese hooks were incredibly sharp compared to Eagle Claw and Mustad we used prior to the early 90’s.

Game changers!

Tom

 

[papajoe222]

I prefer the offset worm hook for its intended use, worms. It has a better bite than an EWG and like a straight shank will give you solid hook-ups in the roof of the mouth.  The EWG was designed for thicker soft plastics and works well for them if you hook them in the lips. They tend to only catch the skin in the roof of the mouth and will tear and break free if care isn't taken.

My preference is a straight shank for most soft plastics. Snell it and forget it.

[thediscochef]

I can't rig plastic on a round bend worth a darn, so it's always been the gamakatsu offset worm ewg for me. Texposes super easy and has a way higher hookup than an inline ewg. 3/0 for a fluke, 4/0 for a z craw, 5/0 for an ol monster. I fish through thick thick invasive milfoil a lot and any exposed point will drag in a few pounds of it. I can't seem to rig a round bend properly to where the hook point stays buried in the plastic to save my life, it always pokes out the top and causes regrets 

[ironbjorn]

Gamakatsu EWG and Gamakatsu SuperLine EWG are what I use for most things. I've never had a problem with hooking up or staying hooked up. 

[RB 77]

On 9/20/2023 at 7:19 AM, ol'crickety said:

You guys are excellent at explaining. Thanks to all of you! I am so excited to try my new Zoom Trick worms with the offset round bend worm hooks.

 

Those are the two hook I use 90% of the time for soft plastics. I would 100% use that offset RB worm hook for Trick Worms.