St. Lawrence River Live-Mix blues

[PhishLI]

This morning on Live BP stated that pro bass fishing is the "most losingest pro sport" by contrasting KVD's 29 wins against so many losses over the course of decades. Not a knock at all, as he explained, but noted that there is so much losing in the process, even for the great KVD.

 

Later on, Steve Bowman noted that "yesterday's weigh-in line had the look and feel of a funeral." There were some guys who choked up on the stage yesterday afternoon because they didn't re-qualify for the Elites, and well-known names who missed the Classic cut. Bobby Lane and Ish are struggling to requalify in the Opens. It's a shark tank now.

 

It isn't working in a coal mine, but Pro fishing is a rough gig. Anyone who makes it to the big leagues and can hold their spot earns it, big time.

[A-Jay]

Not sure if I agree with the 'most losingest sport' designation.

Looking at the thousands and thousands of athletes from other 'Pro Sports'

have to believe the numbers pale in comparison.

If Pro Bass fishing is supposed to be the best of the best,

compare that to the number of minor league 'players' in the other major pro sports

that never 'make it'.

Then add the number of players that do but never 'win it all'.

We can all go hit a ball, or shoot a puck, sink a basket, and throw a spiral,

and even catch a bass, but how many of us are going to win a championship ?

Previous few unfortunately.

Someone should ask Bowman if the wants some cheese with that wine. 

A-Jay

 

 

[AlabamaSpothunter]

This was instilled into by my fishing mentor who was a great friend of Ray Scott and Tom Mann.    

 

According to Swindle and Hackney, making money professional Bass fishing is harder today than ever before.  

 

It's a game for turbo optimists and gamblers 

[Kirtley Howe]

I would agree that making good money as a pro bass fisherman has definitely gotten tougher. The top anglers make more than ever, but many are barely making it. Part of the problem is that both the quantity and quality of angler has increased greatly over the years. It used to be that a pro could master one or two techniques and be a very successful pro, but today you have to be really good at many techniques to even have a chance of placing in the top 50. Now days there are high school team, college teams, and many levels of pro fishing that are training the new generation of anglers to be so proficient that it is amazing. Then add in all the advancements in electronics that are used today that have opened up whole new fishing techniques and locations that fishermen never even knew about before.....Now, consider the costs involved. Pros used to spend $25,000 for a fully (and I do mean FULLY, for the time) equipped boat. Now days, that cost is much closer, if not over. $100,000 for a top of the line boat. Gas and hotel costs are up between 100% and 300%. Food costs on the road are up around 50%. Repair cost for the boat and their trucks are out of sight....and so on. Sure, payouts for winning have gone up a lot, but so have all the costs.  Sponsors only cover so much, and the rest is out of pocket expense for the pro. Most pros these days make far more money working for their sponsors at shows, doing social media, getting endorsement deals and things like that then they make from actual winnings on the pro circuit.  Sure, they have to be successful enough to be seen on tv during tournaments to attract those outside income sources, and the better they do the more they make from outside sources....but a top 100 pro could not even begin to live on just his winnings, but a top 10 pro could live on just his winnings, but would be stupid to just do that.  Pros now days have to be far more than "just" a great fisherman. It is not an easy job, and you would really have to love it, and be willing to sacrifice so many other things in order to be successful. I used to think that I would have loved to be a pro fisherman for a living, and in the 60's 70's and 80's I think I would have. Today? Not so much. 

[WRB]

I considered becoming a B.A.S.S. Tournament fisherman in 1968 and learned quickly back then it was a good ole boy sport where outsiders from the west were handicapped.

My hat is off to the few western pro’s who made a living relocating to the heartland a very difficult choice.

My engineering career was very rewarding.

Tom

[AlabamaSpothunter]

8 minutes ago, WRB said:

I considered becoming a B.A.S.S. Tournament fisherman in 1968 and learned quickly back then it was a good ole boy sport where outsiders from the west were handicapped.

My hat is off to the few western pro’s who made a living relocating to the heartland a very difficult choice.

My engineering career was very rewarding.

Tom

Imagine how handicapped those outsiders from Japan are compared to the good ole boys ?

 

Aaron Martens is considered one of the greatest of all time, may he RIP.  

[WRB]

Aaron Martens, Jay Yelps and Gary Klein moved from California to the heartland and became household names along with Hall of Fame bass anglers. Ish Monroe didn't relocate and overcame a lot of doubters, it can be done but it’s not easy.  

I believe the Japanese’s anglers have less prejudices to overcome today then the early anglers, their tackle is revered and people are a lot more open minded.

KVD an outsider from the North simply over powered everyone with his skills and personality.

Everyone loves Ray Scott but the truth be known he wasn’t supportive of bass anglers outside the heartland states. Tom Mann on the other hand was a pioneer and everyone’s champion.

Tom

[AlabamaSpothunter]

4 minutes ago, WRB said:

Aaron Martens, Jay Yelps and Gary Klein moved from California to the heartland and became household names along with Hall of Fame bass anglers. Ish Monroe didn't relocate and overcame a lot of doubters, it can be done but it’s not easy.  

I believe the Japanese’s anglers have less prejudices to overcome today then the early anglers, their tackle is revered and people are a lot more open minded.

Everyone loves Ray Scott but the truth be known he wasn’t supportive of bass anglers outside the heartland states. Tom Mann on the other hand was a pioneer and everyone’s champion.

Tom

At the top of the sport there is two categories imho:

 

1. Dedicated trophy Bass hunters

 

2. Elite Series anglers at the top of their games who care more about 4-6lb fish than 10-20lb fish.  

 

I'm neither, but you were in category 1.    I've not sure there has been anybody that has been at the top of the game in both categories.    

 

I'm sure A-Mart caught his share of DDs, but nobody remembers him for monster Bass, rather being razor edge innovative, a finesse guru, and top tier derby angler. 

 

Both types are at the top of the sport, just different pursuits.   I'd rather chase a fish of a lifetime than a check, but I'm sure the high of chasing a check while catching Bass is a high of itself.  

 

 

[PhishLI]

7 minutes ago, AlabamaSpothunter said:

I'm sure the high of chasing a check while catching Bass is a high of itself.  

In my mind it's a form of gambling, and people who play it are gamblers at heart. There's even a pot. I kicked in on a super bowl pool and a world series pool when I was 18, both of which I won. There was definitely a high, but I realized quite quickly that I didn't enjoy the games as I did without the gambling aspect, so I never did it again. Just spoiled it for me. I suppose the tenor of today's Live-mix reinforced my perception that the fun part of fishing seems to be heavily outweighed by the realities of the pro circuit. Fishing where I do locally, I'm conditioned for a grind every time out, and most wouldn't consider it fun or pleasant, but I've come to prefer the challenge. However, I'm not away from family and bleeding out cash on the regular to do this.

[TnRiver46]

On 8/26/2023 at 2:09 PM, Kirtley Howe said:

I would agree that making good money as a pro bass fisherman has definitely gotten tougher. The top anglers make more than ever, but many are barely making it. Part of the problem is that both the quantity and quality of angler has increased greatly over the years. It used to be that a pro could master one or two techniques and be a very successful pro, but today you have to be really good at many techniques to even have a chance of placing in the top 50. Now days there are high school team, college teams, and many levels of pro fishing that are training the new generation of anglers to be so proficient that it is amazing. Then add in all the advancements in electronics that are used today that have opened up whole new fishing techniques and locations that fishermen never even knew about before.....Now, consider the costs involved. Pros used to spend $25,000 for a fully (and I do mean FULLY, for the time) equipped boat. Now days, that cost is much closer, if not over. $100,000 for a top of the line boat. Gas and hotel costs are up between 100% and 300%. Food costs on the road are up around 50%. Repair cost for the boat and their trucks are out of sight....and so on. Sure, payouts for winning have gone up a lot, but so have all the costs.  Sponsors only cover so much, and the rest is out of pocket expense for the pro. Most pros these days make far more money working for their sponsors at shows, doing social media, getting endorsement deals and things like that then they make from actual winnings on the pro circuit.  Sure, they have to be successful enough to be seen on tv during tournaments to attract those outside income sources, and the better they do the more they make from outside sources....but a top 100 pro could not even begin to live on just his winnings, but a top 10 pro could live on just his winnings, but would be stupid to just do that.  Pros now days have to be far more than "just" a great fisherman. It is not an easy job, and you would really have to love it, and be willing to sacrifice so many other things in order to be successful. I used to think that I would have loved to be a pro fisherman for a living, and in the 60's 70's and 80's I think I would have. Today? Not so much. 

Payouts and winnings have actually gone down since early 2000s. Forrest wood cup used to be $1 million dollar first prize 

[Kirtley Howe]

You make a very valid point. First place payouts have gone down, but at least in MLF the payout for lower places and the total number of places receiving a check has increased, so over-all the total payout has increased, but is more spread out. I am not sure if Bassmaster followed that trend. Even if all the prizes paid out at higher levels, when you figure in inflation the prize money has indeed gone down.