Illinois Weed Identification (Borrow Pits)

[AJ Hauser]

Hey fellas,
I'm hoping you can help me either identify or come close to identifying the following types of weeds. I have been fishing extremely clear borrow pits lately, and the bottom is a mixture of rock and sand and some mud. The shoreline is very steep, and that continues underwater in most places. In depths from 0 to about 12 feet, there are a lot of what look like "mounds" of weeds that only grow to 1-2 feet in terms of height. You can see areas where the bass have cleared away spots for beds, even where the bottom pitch is steeper than 45 degrees. It's pretty wild actually.

 

You can see the bass cruising above these underwater mats... but do you have any idea what they could be? I haven't seen a lot of this in Illinois - and they are loose enough that the bass swim straight into after the release. This stuff covers a lot of the bottom and creates really cool nooks & crannies where it would otherwise be boring flat bottom. 

 

(Pictures 1, 2 and 3 show them underwater from the kayak, and then above water you can see how they look, and that they grow right up to the shore. Sorry for the low quality.) 

 

Then, out about 15 feet or so, these other weeds are growing straight up - they have smaller leaves, but they sit right off the back side of the mats that I mentioned above. (See pic #4)

 

Do you have any idea what these are? I'm not having much luck identifying them... and to be honest, I've never paid all that much attention to cover like this - but if you get a big mound of this with tall grass on the shoreline, and the tall weeds behind them, it has been really productive. (Not sure why this is, but is was consistent yesterday.)

 

Any help is appreciated - thanks!

[Team9nine]

Snag some with a crankbait or blade bait and get pictures close up out of the water. I’m guessing some mixture of pondweed, chara, and maybe some cabbage from the pics, but very hard to tell from that perspective.

[MN Fisher]

^ What Team9nine said - trying to identify weed species through the surface is very difficult, even for those of us trained. Only way I'd be sure to get it right with them in the water was to snorkel or SCUBA down for an up-close/personal look-see.

[softwateronly]

I don't know what weeds they are, but I've fished around them often.  It's usually a less productive species for me on their own.  If you're throwing bottom contact, too often it drops in and any decent size bass can't get through that canopy or there's none to few voids under it.  I've had better success weightless resting on top with hops or topwater and swimming mid column.  But like you said, the line where they meet other species is definitely the best area to concentrate on imo, especially the deep side.

 

scott

[AJ Hauser]

2 hours ago, Team9nine said:

Snag some with a crankbait or blade bait and get pictures close up out of the water. I’m guessing some mixture of pondweed, chara, and maybe some cabbage from the pics, but very hard to tell from that perspective.

 

You just gave me an excuse to go back. Thank you

 

2 hours ago, MN Fisher said:

^ What Team9nine said - trying to identify weed species through the surface is very difficult, even for those of us trained. Only way I'd be sure to get it right with them in the water was to snorkel or SCUBA down for an up-close/personal look-see.

 

On it! I need to know! 

 

2 hours ago, softwateronly said:

I don't know what weeds they are, but I've fished around them often.  It's usually a less productive species for me on their own.  If you're throwing bottom contact, too often it drops in and any decent size bass can't get through that canopy or there's none to few voids under it.  I've had better success weightless resting on top with hops or topwater and swimming mid column.  But like you said, the line where they meet other species is definitely the best area to concentrate on imo, especially the deep side.

 

scott

 

Hey thanks Scott, I was hoping someone would chime in. I'm in central / northern IL and these were old borrow pits. The water has been beautiful, super clear, very difficult to fish but very rewarding. I was going to ask if anyone thought it would be worthwhile to drop a heavier weight INTO this stuff, but that would be completely random and take forever... I'm wondering though, because the bass retreat into this stuff after I release them. I have had good luck with a Neko weight slightly off center in a stickbait, and straight fluorocarbon to a small wacky hook. The minimal hardware seems to work well in the clear water, and the bait will rest on top of these clouds of weeds without sinking into them... let me know what you think. Thanks again guys! 

[casts_by_fly]

tough from the pictures, but a couple observations.  the last picture kinda looks like Niad.  Long thin strands with the occasional branch off and a tuft of weed.  We have them here.  They are more of a pain than they are worth.

 

https://mdc.mo.gov/discover-nature/field-guide/naiads-water-nymphs-waterweeds

 

the first could be a number of things.  My first thought was milfoil because it looks like its growing straight up with the regular puffs of branching out you can kinda see in the second picture.  Only way to know is to put your hands on some.

 

That said, I don't think it matters what it is.  1- you've said bass are there and that's all that matters.  2- I bet the mounds you're seeing in the first two pictures are actually bottom variation which the fish will be relating to as much or more than the weeds itself.  

[softwateronly]

22 minutes ago, AJ Hauser said:

 

You just gave me an excuse to go back. Thank you

 

 

On it! I need to know! 

 

 

Hey thanks Scott, I was hoping someone would chime in. I'm in central / northern IL and these were old borrow pits. The water has been beautiful, super clear, very difficult to fish but very rewarding. I was going to ask if anyone thought it would be worthwhile to drop a heavier weight INTO this stuff, but that would be completely random and take forever... I'm wondering though, because the bass retreat into this stuff after I release them. I have had good luck with a Neko weight slightly off center in a stickbait, and straight fluorocarbon to a small wacky hook. The minimal hardware seems to work well in the clear water, and the bait will rest on top of these clouds of weeds without sinking into them... let me know what you think. Thanks again guys! 

 

Well, I must be wrong that they can't get into it.  Maybe, I just haven't been able to fish through it, ie under the canopy, in any effective manner.  My experience with it has me fishing over it, and weightless soft plastics that don't drop all the way in or through the canopy, just like what you're explaining with your neko rig.  And I've had success.  Those weeds definitely hold life that bass feed on at times.  But my best success has been where those weeds meet anything else, particularly the tall cabbage, milfoil, etc on the deeper edge.

 

scott

 

edit; For clarity, the "cloud puff weeds" are some of my least favorite cover and I do search out other areas or the transitions out of them.

[Aquaftm45]

Pic 1 and 2  are almost certainly Chara. Pic 4 appears to be Southern Naiad. 

[AJ Hauser]

I appreciate the feedback fellas - I'm headed back today, I'll try to get some snags intentionally and pull up weeds for some better pics...

 

... ah... who am I kidding - I don't have to try for snags... they just kind of happen. Naturally. At the worst times  

[casts_by_fly]

enjoy.  Bring up a clump and get pictures of the stems, where and how the frills branch out from the stems, and any roots you can pull up.

[AJ Hauser]

Good morning fellas. Tough day yesterday - only caught 6 in a 4 hour session with nothing big enough to write home about. I was able to get some "up close" pics when a bass did a nosedive into the mats that line the bottom after I hooked him - I had to pull him up and he brought a bunch of this stuff with him. It smelled a little skunky: 

Pic 2 - I was surprised to see how far apart the little tufts are coming off of the main stem, because when you look down on this in the water, it looks like it's solid enough to step on. 

 

Any ideas?

[scaleface]

 

6 minutes ago, AJ Hauser said:

Any ideas?

Chara algae. I know it looks like grass but its a complex form of algae. I love fishing the stuff .

[AJ Hauser]

24 minutes ago, scaleface said:

 

Chara algae. I know it looks like grass but its a complex form of algae. I love fishing the stuff .

 

They do seem to like it - I see them over it - do you know if they get down in it? Here is the other kind of weed that seems to be growing deeper, probably in the 10-20 foot range with spaced out, small semi-curly leaves: 

 

[scaleface]

1 minute ago, AJ Hauser said:

do you know if they get down in it?

Bass will get deep inside it but lures will not because there is no root system .  

[Team9nine]

Chara is one of my favorites as it doesn’t grow very long/tall, and tends to hug bottom, so it’s easy to fish around and over. Crayfish like it, which probably helps attract bass to it, and its pretty brittle due to all the calcium, so its often easy to snap baits cleanly from it. I posted this pic about a week back of the Chara I’m finding and fishing here:

 

 

The other plant in your last pic is likely curlyleaf pondweed, sometimes called “cabbage” or “curly cabbage” depending on region. One of the first to grow up in spring, but also one of the first to die back in summer. Grows much taller, usually not in as heavy clumps as other vegetation. Great pre-spawn and early summer cover.

[casts_by_fly]

2 hours ago, AJ Hauser said:

 

They do seem to like it - I see them over it - do you know if they get down in it? Here is the other kind of weed that seems to be growing deeper, probably in the 10-20 foot range with spaced out, small semi-curly leaves: 

 

 

Definitely curly leaf pondweed.  We get it in droves here.  It is my least favorite weed to try and motor through in my autopilot because it clumps up on the front of my motor and I can't hardly get the motor high enough to clean it.  team9nine is spot on with it being an early growth plant.  By April its pretty full here, far faster than the milfoil.  We also get broad leaf pondweed which has a 3" wide blade and a thicker stem.

 

Around here, if you find where the pondweed, milfoil, and pads meet you find bass.  Depending how thick things are (aka time of year) you can bring things through it, pitch to holes, punch it, or bring a frog over it.  The pondweed doesn't matt on the surface like milfoil does but it does grow thick in the top inch of the water column.  Topwater spoons and buzzbaits are a good choice because the pondweed doesn't have the thin strands of junk that gum them up.  

 

My favorite type/thickness on curly:

 

 

my not so favorite on broad leaf. This was end of April and 50 degree water 8’ deep. 
 

[AJ Hauser]

Nice - thank you guys! So @Team9nine you throw a jig in there?! That is very interesting, and you are right these green guys sure seem to like the stuff. @casts_by_fly thanks for the feedback as well - I guess I'm lucky because the curly-leaf pondweed seems to be correct as well, but in my lake it's down deep at the moment. Now, everything from 8 feet and shallower is COVERED with that chara. Maybe that is preventing the pondweed from growing up close? 

 

Thanks again fellas - this has been very helpful!

[Team9nine]

Snapped this pic of one of my ponds that is covered in Chara, mostly from the shoreline out to a depth of about 4’-6’, though it often grows deeper depending on lake…and yes, jigs and Neds are great in this stuff! Caught 4 on jig today out of it (pic below).

 

 

[AJ Hauser]

6 minutes ago, Team9nine said:

Caught 4 on jig today out of it (pic below).

 

 

Oh wow - nice!!