Best Bass Boat out there now

[fishn hard]

Guys he said he had 70,000$ to spend and you guys are talking about Skeeters Champions doing 180s on the water Man that's a really good selling point and every boat you mentioned is A fiberglass boat built with a chopper gun mas produced that will be full of stress cracks in a few years And I would never own anther Skeeter as long as i live or a Yamaha any boat company that push the American public to buy a product that is built and owned over seas Ill keep my hard earned AMERICAN made money right hear in the good old USA and yes im partial to Allison's that's because Daris Allison builds about 30 a year and you bet your money when he hands you the keys it is the best built boat in the world his reputation depends on it

[Fishing Rhino]

OK now, let's see. We have three, with more to come I'm sure, criteria for which is the best bass boat out there.

In this corner, we have Allison, with its advanced design, no wood, and a foam core construction. More buoyant, lighter, and will give you double the gas mileage of any other bass boat on the market. (This is from their web site).

In another corner, we have Champion, or is it Skeeter, whose main claim to fame is that you can go full bore, spin the steering wheel 180 degrees, and the bass boat transforms into a Frisbee, skimming over the surface in a watery pirouette.

In the third corner we have Bass Cat a five time (successively) J. D. Powers winner of the most satisfied customers award.

Let's examine these arguments. First, the Allison. I have to tell you, I was impressed by their construction. They don't use polyester resin, opting for the more expensive vinylester. Polyester resin will absorb water. Vinylester won't. They lay up their hulls by hand, not chopper gun like Ranger. They don't use wood. Wood is ok as long as it's not a structural component. Balsa wood was the first core material. Fiberglass coated wood stringers are fine, provided the fiberglass "beam" formed by laminating on them is of sufficient strength. Sadly, it appears that is not always the case. Allison uses closed cell foam upon which to build the fiberglass beam. Lighter, and will not absorb water, while providing equal or greater stiffness.

Allison uses the same type of construction as Boston Whaler. Two thin skins of fiberglass separated by a foam core. Very light, very stiff. Also more susceptible to being punctured than a thick glass construction.

A 21 foot Allison weighs less than my Z7 Nitro, and thus, it sits higher in the water. They tout their "flotation pads" which prevent water from washing over the stern during deceleration or from waves.

Guess which boat will drift faster in the breeze/wind.

As for the Champion. The gymnastics or should I say ballet the boat can do are impressive. Sounds like something that should be on eXtreme boating, but it has nothing to do with fishing. I cannot see how that enters into the best bass boat consideration.

Then the Bass Catt. Customer satisfaction has to do with expectations. Unrealistic expectations will always end up in disappointment. What the Powers survey tells me is that Bass Cat may have the best customers, not necessarily the best boat.

I'm satisfied with my Z7. I paid 19,300 for it new last year. I did not expect it to be a Ranger, Bass Cat, Champion, or Allison, and it isn't. I got good value for my dollar, but the best boat is not the best value for the dollar, it's about the best boat.

After doing a tiny bit of research, my vote would go to Allison as the best boat. The best value? That's another topic.

[Chaz Hickcox]

Guys he said he had 70,000$ to spend and you guys are talking about Skeeters Champions doing 180s on the water Man that's a really good selling point and every boat you mentioned is A fiberglass boat built with a chopper gun mas produced that will be full of stress cracks in a few years And I would never own anther Skeeter as long as i live or a Yamaha any boat company that push the American public to buy a product that is built and owned over seas Ill keep my hard earned AMERICAN made money right hear in the good old USA and yes im partial to Allison's that's because Daris Allison builds about 30 a year and you bet your money when he hands you the keys it is the best built boat in the world his reputation depends on it

Hey, gotta argue the Cats man.  They are all hand built in Mountain Home, Arkansas.  Allison is nice, but I don't find them to have the same fishability.  However, the largest point is, BassCat or Allison - THEY BOTH ARE HAND MADE IN AMERICA!

[slonezp]

Here is the Legend demo ride video

I've heard great things about the Skeeter FX series. Also nothing but good about Basscat and Ranger. My next purchase will be a Legend, BC, or Ranger. As far as Allison, their boats are in a league of their own. Take a look at their website.

[Chaz Hickcox]

Then the Bass Catt. Customer satisfaction has to do with expectations. Unrealistic expectations will always end up in disappointment. What the Powers survey tells me is that Bass Cat may have the best customers, not necessarily the best boat.

So you're saying I have low expectations?  My 'low expectations' are the product has to be dependable, if I have an issue it is resolved to the highest degree possible, and my boat's performance will outlast any other boat I may have chosen to invest in.  If anyone knows anything about fiberglass then they would know that the resin and processes used by Ron and Rick Pierce make the finest ALL FIBERGLASS construction of any boat.  I do not have low expectations, sir, in fact many of my Marines and friends would complain that my expectations of everything is way to HIGH.  You should really think about what you are saying.

[Rangerphil]

I see a lot of guys talking about chopper guns being used. What is that and what does it mean and how important is it to use or not to use these?

Also I love my ranger but have never fished out of a allison or bass cat! Also, I have a 205 hull and it may not be the fastest but handles rough water extremely well.

That leads me to believe that maybe each company makes different hulls and one may be better than another. I do enjoy reading this thread because I am learning more about bass boats and how they are made!

[Fishing Rhino]

Then the Bass Catt. Customer satisfaction has to do with expectations. Unrealistic expectations will always end up in disappointment. What the Powers survey tells me is that Bass Cat may have the best customers, not necessarily the best boat.

So you're saying I have low expectations?

Not at all.  Realistic expectations is more like it.  It was intended as a compliment about Cat customers.  Some folks buy a Nitro and expect it to be like a Cat or a Skeeter.  Guess what?  They will not be satisfied, will they?

[Chaz Hickcox]

Then the Bass Catt. Customer satisfaction has to do with expectations. Unrealistic expectations will always end up in disappointment. What the Powers survey tells me is that Bass Cat may have the best customers, not necessarily the best boat.

So you're saying I have low expectations?

Not at all. Realistic expectations is more like it. It was intended as a compliment about Cat customers. Some folks buy a Nitro and expect it to be like a Cat or a Skeeter. Guess what? They will not be satisfied, will they?

Realistic expectations gets you the customer service of many of the other companies, Ranger has decent customer service (friends who own them) and so does Skeeter.  However, what about a company that literally goes out of the way to make sure their customers' well being is taken care of?  Treating customers like family is not a 'realistic expectation', but they do it.  Like I said before, one does not even have to buy a new boat or even from a dealer to be accepted into the 'family', just have a Cat.  1971 or 2011 models the BassCat owner is personally taken care of by the company staff for any situation.  It is not about realistic expectations, but surreal customer service.

[Fishing Rhino]

Then the Bass Catt. Customer satisfaction has to do with expectations. Unrealistic expectations will always end up in disappointment. What the Powers survey tells me is that Bass Cat may have the best customers, not necessarily the best boat.

So you're saying I have low expectations?

Not at all. Realistic expectations is more like it. It was intended as a compliment about Cat customers. Some folks buy a Nitro and expect it to be like a Cat or a Skeeter. Guess what? They will not be satisfied, will they?

Realistic expectations gets you the customer service of many of the other companies, Ranger has decent customer service (friends who own them) and so does Skeeter. However, what about a company that literally goes out of the way to make sure their customers' well being is taken care of? Treating customers like family is not a 'realistic expectation', but they do it. Like I said before, one does not even have to buy a new boat or even from a dealer to be accepted into the 'family', just have a Cat. 1971 or 2011 models the BassCat owner is personally taken care of by the company staff for any situation. It is not about realistic expectations, but surreal customer service.

God bless 'em at BassCat.  Sounds like they are in the running for the best company.  I'll agree with you on that customer service thing.

I'd never buy an Allison.  Too much money, even if it is good value for the product.  I could never justify spending that kind of dough for a boat that I would not catch one more fish from.

My Z7 will do close to 60.  Most of the time I cruise at 40 - 45.  If I don't use 60 mph, I'm certainly not going to use the 80 mph of an Allison.

Last year on the road trip Roadwarrior and I went with a guide.  He had a BassCat.  Nice boat, nice ride.  I can see why some guys swear by them.

For 19,300, this works just fine for me.

For the record, I initially had a few complaints about the rig.  Wiring running through bare holes in the trailer frame, a feeble license plate bracket that snapped off somewhere in PA on my way to the Pickwick road trip in TN last year, and a couple of other penny ante shortcuts that rubbed me the wrong way.

No complaints about the boat or motor, other than they installed the wrong prop and the boat had trouble getting on plane.  Took it in, and they asked me if I changed the prop, which I hadn't.  When they swapped the prop the problem was solved.

[Chaz Hickcox]

It's not new, but a 2004 model Pantera IV. For $18,000 this is an awesome ride. The only complaints I have are half of the electronics are old and the previous owner was a pain in the butt as far as getting the paperwork for the trailer taken care of, and there are some cosmetic issues (paint scratches) because of hard use by the previous owner in tournaments.

Good notes:

Trailer was built for the rig by BassCat (not FOR BassCat by another company). 

Smooth/Solid Ride.

Comfortable large seating area.  I am 6'1" and almost have too much room at the helm, almost.

[Fishing Rhino]

I see a lot of guys talking about chopper guns being used. What is that and what does it mean and how important is it to use or not to use these?

Also I love my ranger but have never fished out of a allison or bass cat! Also, I have a 205 hull and it may not be the fastest but handles rough water extremely well.

That leads me to believe that maybe each company makes different hulls and one may be better than another. I do enjoy reading this thread because I am learning more about bass boats and how they are made!

A chopper gun is used for making shower stalls, bath tubs, etc.

This is a photo of a chopper gun in use. Note the long "cord" going to the gun. It consists of a bundle of long glass filaments. The gun chops them, and they are fed into resin which is being sprayed onto or into the mold.

Typically they produce a resin rich mixture. Which makes for a weaker, more brittle product than a hand laid up piece. It's the necessary evil of a chopper gun. Mat is really just a filler, roving is what gives fiberglass construction greater strength. There are several types of roving, woven roving being the most common type. It looks like very coarse burlap, and is made up of continuous filaments that run the length and breadth of the roll.

The "fabrics" provide the strength, and the resin provides the shape. Thats it in a nutshell.

[Fishing Rhino]

For those who may wonder how I know about fiberglass, here are a couple of my products. They are not painted. The color is in the gel coat. The bodies, as I produce them weigh about sixty pounds.

And, just for the record, beginning in 1996, and for five successive years running, cars with my bodies took home the top prize in the race car division at the World of Wheels car show in Boston.

It included drag cars, circle track cars, etc., from all the major divisions.

[Chaz Hickcox]

Clearly you know your stuff.  Those look d@$# good.  Just curious, how do they hold up to the bumps and nudges during the races?

[flyboy]

That's called rubbing, and rubbing is racing.

Clearly you know your stuff. Those look d@$# good. Just curious, how do they hold up to the bumps and nudges during the races?

[Lund Explorer]

Then the Bass Catt. Customer satisfaction has to do with expectations. Unrealistic expectations will always end up in disappointment. What the Powers survey tells me is that Bass Cat may have the best customers, not necessarily the best boat.

So you're saying I have low expectations? My 'low expectations' are the product has to be dependable, if I have an issue it is resolved to the highest degree possible, and my boat's performance will outlast any other boat I may have chosen to invest in. If anyone knows anything about fiberglass then they would know that the resin and processes used by Ron and Rick Pierce make the finest ALL FIBERGLASS construction of any boat. I do not have low expectations, sir, in fact many of my Marines and friends would complain that my expectations of everything is way to HIGH. You should really think about what you are saying.

You should really talk to my insurance agent.  His 2010 Cat is going back to Mt Home because the cap in front of the battery compartment is split.  He can tell you all about how the dealership didn't want to stand behind it, or how the factory simply told him "We'll look at it".

[Chaz Hickcox]

Well they can't control the independently owned dealerships, but the whole 'we'll look at it' is strange.  However there is the whole fiberglass warranty thing that should probably kick in.  Something about a lifetime transferrable warranty that says they will likely take care of that, as long as they can determine your agent did not run into anything or hit it with anything.

[Fishing Rhino]

Clearly you know your stuff. Those look d@$# good. Just curious, how do they hold up to the bumps and nudges during the races?

They hold up better than any other fiberglass bodies on the market.  One layer of 3/4 ounce mat, and one layer of 1603 stitched roving.  They are very flexible, and the roving holds them together pretty well. 

All the others use just mat in their construction.  When the get smacked they sometimes explode like an egg shell.

The front fenders are the most vulnerable.  Very little material at the wheel opening.  The front end, by virtue of its suspension is weaker than the solid axle rear end, so the wheels provide little support.

Some of my customers have hit the wall and bent the rear clip over a foot, and the quarter panels were still fit to use.  The concrete wall ground off the gel coat, but they stayed in one piece.  The side by side bumping in the turns doesn't damage them at all.  It's when someone hooks into the wheel opening the front of the fender gets torn off.

I've had a guarantee from day one.  If any of my body panels shatter into several pieces I'll replace it free.  It just doesn't happen.

A customer in Maine told me his quarter panel  broke into several pieces.  I shipped him a new one.  Some of his fellow competitors were so impressed they began getting bodies from me.

Even if his story wasn't true, the public relations of giving him a fender paid off handsomely.

I used to go to the different tracks with a quarter panel, place it on the ground, good side up, and let them drive a truck over the length of the panel.  It would crack along the top, but when the truck got off it, it would pop back into shape.

Sometimes it would actually fold the other way.  I'd pick it up, give it a swift kick on the inside, above the wheel opening, and it would snap back into shape.

It didn't matter how many times that quarter got run over, the damage did not get worse.

[Chaz Hickcox]

I'm impressed.  I've had the fiberglass fenders break apart on HMMWVs (Hummers) at retarded times.  Of course that was just during regular use.  When they shatter because they get shot or shrapnel tear them up it's somewhat to be expected.

[Lund Explorer]

I see a lot of guys talking about chopper guns being used. What is that and what does it mean and how important is it to use or not to use these?

Also I love my ranger but have never fished out of a allison or bass cat! Also, I have a 205 hull and it may not be the fastest but handles rough water extremely well.

That leads me to believe that maybe each company makes different hulls and one may be better than another. I do enjoy reading this thread because I am learning more about bass boats and how they are made!

If you ever get down around the NW part of Arkansas, you should take a day or two and take the factory tours in the area.  For years, the area was called the fiberglass triangle for the number of boats built there.

Mt. Home is where BassCat is located, and Flippin just to the west is the home of Ranger Boats.  When I was there a few years ago, both of these companies offered guided tours right out on the factory floor.  It will give you the chance to see how these boats are built, from the minute they lay the hull down to the finish work.

Speaking of the hulls, every boat company has a different ones, by design.  Everyone I saw built though was basically the same.  Strange fact, the paint is the first thing that goes in the molds.  After that, they are pretty close between the two.  Large sheets of fiberglass material are laid into the mold which is then sprayed with a thin coat of chopped glass and resin.  This is then hand rolled to take out any bubbles, and then the next sheet of fiberglass is placed into the mold.  These steps are repeated until the hull's thickness is completed.  At the same time, other workers are busy building the "cap" or top half of the boat.  As it was explained to me, the cap is almost always built using a chopper gun.  The is due to the fact that the cap has too many angles to make it cost efficient to hand lay sheets of fiberglass.  The cap also doesn't take nearly as much of a pounding that the hull does.  If you're lucky, you will be in the factory when they pop a boat out of the molds.  Depending on a number of factors, it will take a day or so before the glass has cured in the mold and can be removed.

Once out of the molds, the two halfs ride along on carts where they go through installation of all the wiring, plumbing, gas/oil tanks, livewells, etc.  The cap is drilled for instrumentation, wiring, gas cap, and other things at this time.  After the inside work is complete, the two halves are finally tied together, and work on the outside of the hull can be done.

Finally, the gas motor is installed and it is placed with it's trailer.

Even though Ranger's factory is much larger than Cat's facility, each boat makes it way through the factory in the same steps.  I've seen clipboards in each facility that shows the customer's name, dealer's name, and every option that the customer has ordered.  As a boat moves through any stage of this process, they can track the exact boat to the exact customer.  And those records are saved at the factory.

Whether it is a Ranger or a Cat I know that you can call to the service/parts dept, give them your hull number, and the technician can look right at what was built into your boat.  If you need a new seat that matches the other ones, they can make it for you.  Need some paint that will match?  They've got it.

Me?  I've been lucky enough to own at least one of each.  I was impressed with both on many things, and learned to live with things that one had and the other didn't.  I also was lucky enough to meet both Ron Pierce and Forrest Wood, and they are both good quality folks.  So are their wives. 

Moral to this long winded story?  They're all good!  Nobody can stay in business as long as these guys have by building junk.  I'm sure Skeeter, Champion, and even Allison are good quality boats.  And at least the ones I saw being built, were all built by hand.

[Rangerphil]

Thank you for the detailed story. I was starting to think that ranger was not as good as I thought. Ever since I was 8-9 years of age I always wanted a ranger boat, when I got it I was in awe and still feel like a pro when I fish out of it! I guess that is what really matters, how you feel about what you love.

I have also met Forrest wood and his wife on several occasions and they are very nice people.

[Fishing Rhino]

Lund, you are correct about the little steps in the topside of the boat.  While fiberglass can be worked into large corners such as chines, it is only because there is sufficient surface resistance to prevent the material from lifting away at the corner.  You can work the material into corners with a step of an inch or more, but it's very time consuming.

Get down to less than three quarters of an inch and it's nigh impossible to get mat and roving to stay tucked into the corner.  You can do it, but it takes tearing mat and working the torn edge into the corner.  Can be done, but it's not practical.

You can also "flood" those corners, as you stated, with resin by using a chopper gun.  We use Aerosil which is powdered silica.  It is mixed with uncatalyzed resin to the consistancy of heavy grease.  When we make a piece with a step.  After the gel coat applied to the mold has cured sufficiently we will take an adequate amount of this paste and catalyze it.  Then using a bondo spreader we fill the corner with the minumum amount needed to support the glass.  Then the mat is put into place, and impregnated with resin.

Since I'm in the process of retiring, I'll let you in on my secret for working resin.  I use a paint roller.  A six pack of cheapo 9" rollers from Home Depot are cut in half.  The nine inch rollers are too long to fit into some of the hollow contours of the mold.  Four and a half inches will go anywhere except into sharp corners.

There are fiberglass rollers specifically made for production fiberglass work.  They have a perforated core.  They are mounted on a special handle.  Resin is forced through the tubular handle and out through the perforations.  The flow is controlled by a trigger on the handle.

The handles can be quite long, to allow laminating things such as a bass boat without having to get inside of the mold.

Most of the fabricators I've seen will wet the piece, then apply the material, and roll it with a grooved roller.  The problem with the rollers, though they do remove air bubbles, is that they also move the strands of the mat around, making them thicker in some areas and thinning them out in others.  Paint rollers don't do this.  After the mat is wet out, the stitched roving goes on, and is wet through.  The beauty of the roller is that you end up with very consistent pieces.  If too much resin is applied to a piece, you can pick up the excess with the roller, and move it to the next piece.

Once the mat has been wet out, we use the bubble busting rollers to get rid of any air pockets.  The material in the roving will not shift like mat does, so you end up with a very uniform piece.  The mat stays put beneath the roving.

To get perfect uniformity by getting rid of any excess resin you'd have to vacuum bag the piece.  The vanes on wind turbines are vacuum bagged in order to make them as strong as possible, and so they will all weigh the same, or very nearly the same, so they will be in balance when assembled.  Takes a pretty large bag.

As an aside, I also do some metalflake bodies.  I will match the finish of my product, right out of the mold to any bass boat on a showroom floor after it has been buffed and waxed, and my piece will have a better finish.  My pieces come out with a wet shine. 

By the way, black and other dark colors are the worst.  Every slight imperfection in a mold shows up.  Leave a finger print in the mold and it will be in the finished piece.  A quick wipe with cleaner/glaze or cleaner/wax will take care of it.  The same for the haze that naturally forms when a piece is made. 

When the haze starts to appear, we strip the haze from the molds with a cleaner, then apply six coats of hard carnuba wax.

White is the easiest color.  Haze does not show.

[flyboy]

This thread has ventured into many arenas and I have been lurking here absorbing all the great information that has been shared.  I am fasicinated with the discussion on fiberglass work; learning things that will really help in making a decision.

Getting back to the original topic, I know that all the top end boats are good so I think my main concern is customer service.  I got terrible customer service from the manufacturor of the boat I am replacing; unfortunately their top end boat is the one I like best.

Has anyone had any recent customer service experience with Ranger or Skeeter?  I am wondering how Ranger is performing since they are operationg in receivership and Skeeter since Yamaha bought them?

[Rangerphil]

I called ranger last spring because I made a mistake hooking my trolling batteries back up. They said hold on one second then put me right through to someone on the floor and he walked me right through it!

Also two years ago my on board charger was making a humming noise so I called them and without any hesitation they sent me a new one and....paid for the shipping for me to send the old one back!

I never call the place where I bought the boat I always call ranger direct, and they are some of the nicest people you will deal with!

[flyboy]

Rangerphil

Have you had any need to use customer service in the last couple of months?  Other manufacturors are saying bad things about Ranger's custormer service since the bankruptcy and the only way to know if they are true is hearing reports from people who are having contact.

[Rangerphil]

I called yesterday to sign up for ranger cup and everything seemed the same to me. Friendly lady answered and put through to a gentleman named Matt who got me signed up and told me that I would not get me new card by the time I was leaving for my tournament next week. He said not to worry that they would verify all the info to flw.

Now I know that has nothing to do with customer service for boat problems, but it seemed like all was still the way it always has been!

My recommendation would be to call ranger and talk to someone there with your concerns. If I was to spend that amount of money again I would talk to whoever will listen.

Tell them the problems you have had in the past and your future concerns about issues you may have and I bet you will be surprised at just how nice they are down there!