Lithium Batteries ??????

[Woody B]

There's a lithium mining company buying up land like crazy ~10 miles from me.  They're paying high prices for property, even with todays real estate prices for future mining.   One of the places they bought was an old granite quarry.  There's several granite quarries around here.  I wonder if lithium is normally found under granite, or if that's just a thing here.  

[Johnbt]

It is in the granite. It's found in different forms, but the concentrations are measured in parts per million.

 

Crushing and sifting granite is expensive and dirty. Lithium also is found in salt flats and is extracted with brine solutions.

[gim]

On 5/8/2023 at 7:36 AM, Johnbt said:

Lithium also is found in salt flats and is extracted with brine solutions.

That's what they're doing in southern Cali just east of the Salton Sea.  They've already nicknamed it "Lithium Valley."

[Johnbt]

It figures, you look into the goings on at Lithium Valley and you find Warren Buffett staring back at you. 

 

"Berkshire Hathaway Energy Renewables (BHE Renewables) owns 10 of the 11 geothermal plants in the Salton Sea area, which operate as CalEnergy. (Privately owned EnergySource owns the other plant.)  BHE Renewables, which has received federal and state funding, is developing two demonstration plants near its geothermal plants: one for extracting lithium chloride from geothermal brine, which just came on line, and the other for converting the lithium chloride into battery-grade lithium hydroxide."

[WRB]

Owens lake to Death Valley is one of the worlds largest lithium and other strategic mineral areas. It’s too environmentally sensitive to mine to date.

Tom

[volzfan59]

On 5/4/2023 at 9:30 AM, MN Fisher said:

Given how good my Mighty Max AGMs have been - when I go to Lithium, I'll keep with 'The Max'.

Ken, I'm very happy with my Mighty Max lithium battery!

[Siebert Outdoors]

On 5/7/2023 at 4:57 PM, casts_by_fly said:

that’s about what I would expect on the house battery. You ran down 50 ah is 7 hours. That about 7 amps drawn. A 9” graph draws about 2-2.5. Live imaging about the same. So 2 9” plus at2 should be about 7-7.5 amps.

 

that’s incredible on the ghost though. That’s 12 ah drawn at 36v. That would be 36 ah on 12v equivalent that’s next to nothing for a full day.

 

Its crazy how little that ghost uses.  I dont run it on high speeds usually.  With about 120lb I usually keep it at about 4-5 setting. 

[Dogface]

I just found another concern about lithium batteries and that is the potential for fire. Has anyone looked into the possibility that a lithium boat battery could catch fire while in a garage?

 

A ferry company in Norway just banned electric cars from its boats because of the possibility of fire. It seems that once a lithium battery starts to burn it is very hard to extinguish. 

 

Any thoughts? 

[Tennessee Boy]

Supposedly LiFePO4 batteries are much safer.   I’ve never experienced a lithium fire so I can’t comment on how hard they are to extinguish.  I have encountered a gasoline fire,  they’re pretty intense.  

[TnRiver46]

7 hours ago, Dogface said:

I just found another concern about lithium batteries and that is the potential for fire. Has anyone looked into the possibility that a lithium boat battery could catch fire while in a garage?

 

A ferry company in Norway just banned electric cars from its boats because of the possibility of fire. It seems that once a lithium battery starts to burn it is very hard to extinguish. 

 

Any thoughts? 

Fire on the middle of the ocean is the last thing you want 

[gim]

1 hour ago, TnRiver46 said:

Fire on the middle of the ocean is the last thing you want 

Or in space, according to NASA.

[12poundbass]

Just now, gimruis said:

Or in space, according to NASA.

I see what you did there. ?

[Dogface]

3 hours ago, TnRiver46 said:

Fire on the middle of the ocean is the last thing you want 

 

If I can find the article I'll post it. They mentioned the container ship that sunk a few months ago with all the high end European cars. They said that the fire started in an electric car and they could not extinguish it. 

[Dogface]

https://www.autoevolution.com/news/norwegian-ferry-company-bans-electrified-vehicles-from-transport-on-its-ships-208942.html

 

https://rairfoundation.com/fire-hazard-norweigen-shipping-company-first-to-ban-electric-cars-on-ferries/

[Tennessee Boy]

In this video they drill into a LiFePO4 and Li-ion battery with very different results.  The LiFePO4 batteries people are using in their boats are much safer.

 

 

[GaryH]

Wow

[pdxfisher]

I have not seen Amped Outdoors listed here but that is what I use in my kayak. They have a really wide selection of batteries. They seem to be high quality at a medium price. I am really happy with the battery and charger that I got from them.

[Glenn]

When I was at the Classic this year, 10-15 different lithium battery companies were represented.  The list keeps growing every month.

 

All make claims theirs is "the best".  But clearly, that's not the case.

 

I'm holding off on these batteries until the oil and water separate, and there's a clearer picture of who are truly the top dogs. 

 

I've even turned down 3 brands so far that have wanted to advertise because I can't confirm their claims, and I won't endorse a brand I don't have confidence in.

[Glenn]

Looks like there's another brand entering the arena.

https://www.bassresource.com/bass_fishing_123/norsk-lithium-71023.html

 

Thoughts?

[gim]

James Holst is the former host of In Depth Outsoors, a popular show here that used to air on Sunday mornings. I believe he recently left his position to pursue this venture with  Norsk Lithium. New Hope, MN is not far from me. Just a few miles to the east.

 

Way at the bottom I saw the cost. Holy Hannah that is an expensive battery. And I see it comes with an unseated and heated core version. Up here I would probably select the heated core version.

[casts_by_fly]

Its expensive, but not out of touch.  An amped 160 Ah is $1100, so this 180 AH for $1400 isn't out of line considering the increase in capacity and the extra starting battery features.  That said, before I'd go that route, I'd skip the starting battery features and use a lead acid starting battery at this time.  There are a lot of complications with using lithiums as starting batteries.  They talk to the challenges in the press release.  I want to see proven performance and ideally a recommendation/qualification from mercury that they have approved it for that purpose.  At that point then maybe its the right thing.

[Glenn]

Speaking of lithium charging batteries....here's another one...

 

https://www.bassresource.com/bass_fishing_123/lithium-pro-starting-71123.html

 

[Glenn]

Here's another starting lithium battery: https://www.bassresource.com/bass_fishing_123/lithium-pro-starting-71123.html

[jasonl549]

On 6/8/2023 at 10:47 AM, Glenn said:

When I was at the Classic this year, 10-15 different lithium battery companies were represented.  The list keeps growing every month.

 

All make claims theirs is "the best".  But clearly, that's not the case.

 

I'm holding off on these batteries until the oil and water separate, and there's a clearer picture of who are truly the top dogs. 

 

I've even turned down 3 brands so far that have wanted to advertise because I can't confirm their claims, and I won't endorse a brand I don't have confidence in.

 

This is smart.  There is too much misinformation out there and a ton of marketing smoke and mirrors.
 

I'm the one who made the video that the OP referenced to start the thread.  I just found this thread so I signed up for the site and hope to make myself available to answer some questions.

 

Full disclosure, I obviously sell one particular brand (MillerTech).  But there are many great brands out there.  And there are also many bad ones that are outright lying to you.  I won't bash any particular brands or mention any names.

 

I would shop a company as opposed to a battery.  Look for a company that has been around for a while and has an established reputation to uphold.  As was mentioned, new companies pop up every day.  And they may be backed by someone who knows their stuff.  But this is a VERY hard business with a ton of competition and, despite having a great product and their best efforts, they may not be in business in 2 years if you have a warranty issue.  I know this from personal experience as I had my own brand, Jericho Battery Company, fail to make a dent in the market.  But I have sold MillerTech since 2017 and they have already made great inroads into the bass fishing market so I just stick with them.

 

Be careful following a "pro" or "guide" or other expert.  And be super careful following any Youtuber.  I know because I am one.  Most of them are in the pockets of a manufacturer.  So you are not getting unbiased, objective information.  It is very easy to edit a Youtube video in such a way to deceive or leave out parts that would cast a bad light.  And when they stand to gain 5-10% commissions on your purchase, they will say almost anything to get more sales.  Not all of them, but enough of them that you need to take their word with a grain of salt.

 

Talk to amateur anglers that have nothing to gain by pushing a brand.  I know I sponsored a charity fishing tournament on the Susquehanna the last few years and talked to a ton of good, hard-working guys that love to fish.  They work hard for their money and some have converted to lithium at great expense.  Some were sorely disappointed in their purchases but most were amazed.  But the point is that these are people that put their money where their mouth is and will sing the praises of a good brand or rip into a bad one without any monetary incentive behind it.

 

If you want to do even more sleuthing, look up the shipping manifests for your favorite brand.  That is publicly available information.  It won't tell you whether their batteries are using Grade A or Grade B cells or if they cut corners with a junk BMS.  But it can tell you who their manufacturing partner is in China.  And you can go by their reputation and size and get a pretty good idea whether the quality is there.  Not a foolproof method but it is one more piece of information you can use to make a good decision on a brand.

 

Hope this helps!

 

 

[FishTax]

On 5/6/2023 at 11:35 PM, wdp said:

When I bought this battery at beginning of year, it was only $300. It’s gone up to $350 now. Last lead acid battery I looked at while in Academy Sports was $150. 
 

https://www.amazon.com/LiFePO4-Battery-Perfect-Applications-Warranty/dp/B084DB36KW/ref=mp_s_a_1_3?crid=202ZWL4666GOC&keywords=li+time+battery+12v+100ah&qid=1683430301&sprefix=li+time+%2Caps%2C112&sr=8-3

This is now $239 for Black Friday. Are you still happy with it? Seems like any awesome deal, I just happened to click your link and realized it was one I looked at earlier today when researching.