Braid on Baitcaster Question

[Scud_Muffin]

Heard on the YouTube an interesting idea. The presenter suggested that heavier braid actually casts further than lighter braid on a baitcaster.  Obviously it’s less prone to digging in but have you seen evidence to that statement? Said nothing below 50 lbs belongs on a baitcaster because that and up casts further. I’ve cast 40 and thought it did fine with distance without being afraid of digging. I believe he proposed that there was a physics reason but didn’t explain further.
 

Seems paradoxical to me, but I haven’t really tried bombing lighter lures on bigger braid for example. More of a fluoro/mono guy for most baitcast stuff so not a lot of experience with it. Thoughts? 

[bulldog1935]

Heavier braid has more surface tension and friction leaving the spool, so hokey.  

There would be no reason to use threadline braid if it didn't improve cast distance.  With a baitcaster, you can reduce spool mass and inertia, needing less brake.  

People knew this 100 years ago.  

 

One difference could be on a deep spool, 80 yds of 60-lb braid weighs less than 650 yards of 10-lb braid.  

[gulfcaptain]

Most use heavy braid I think because smaller braid becomes problematic for them. Cast 20 and 30# braid just fine. The light 4 carrier braid may be more problematic  then the 8 carrier lines. But have had zero issue with them digging into my spool. 

[QUAKEnSHAKE]

Not in my experience. Ive thrown fat ikas with 10# braid power pro and 60# braid ygk g-soul on same curado 70/ quantum smoke rod. Can really feel weight of the 60# line pulling down the ika while the 10# feels effortless soaring in the air. 

On a side note. I have a bfs shallow spool on a T3 with 8# Nanobraid and throwing an Ika farther than any other reel I have. On the stock T3 spool I have 40# Smackdown nope wont cast farter.

[Scud_Muffin]

I really didn’t think it made sense, sounded paradoxical to me when I heard it. 

[ska4fun]

I never ever had digging problems with baitcasters. Heavier braid absorbs more water, the increase in weight, decrease casting distance.

[JediAmoeba]

If you spool up your reel incorrectly you will have digging...do it right, with a lot of tension, and you won't have those problems.

[Deleted account]

11 hours ago, Scud_Muffin said:

Heard on the YouTube an interesting idea. 

 

Yeah, and there is a guy on there who thinks the surface or the sun is 142 degrees Fahrenheit because that's what his IR thermometer read when he pointed it at it, of course he also thinks the sun is closer than the clouds, so maybe he's into BFS...  

[MN Fisher]

3 minutes ago, Deleted account said:

 

Yeah, and there is a guy on there who thinks the surface or the sun is 142 degrees Fahrenheit because that's what his IR thermometer read when he pointed it at it, of course he also thinks the sun is closer than the clouds, so maybe he's into BFS...  

To that guy....

[Bankc]

If you heard it on YouTube, it has to be true.  They won't let just anybody put videos up on that thing.  It's for certified experts only.  I heard that on YouTube.  

 

Though, my personal experience tells me that it doesn't really matter with braid.  Braid is limp and come off the spool pretty easily.  And the diameter difference between 65# and 10# isn't really all that much.  Plus braid is so slippery, hence the knot issues, that I can't imagine it would get much drag from the line guides.  Whatever distance you gain or lose, can't be more than a yard or two at the extremes. 

[Deleted account]

9 minutes ago, Bankc said:

If you heard it on YouTube, it has to be true.  They won't let just anybody put videos up on that thing.  It's for certified experts only.  I heard that on YouTube.  

 

Though, my personal experience tells me that it doesn't really matter with braid.  Braid is limp and come off the spool pretty easily.  And the diameter difference between 65# and 10# isn't really all that much.  Plus braid is so slippery, hence the knot issues, that I can't imagine it would get much drag from the line guides.  Whatever distance you gain or lose, can't be more than a yard or two at the extremes. 

 

 

[casts_by_fly]

3 hours ago, Bankc said:

If you heard it on YouTube, it has to be true.  They won't let just anybody put videos up on that thing.  It's for certified experts only.  I heard that on YouTube.  

 

Though, my personal experience tells me that it doesn't really matter with braid.  Braid is limp and come off the spool pretty easily.  And the diameter difference between 65# and 10# isn't really all that much.  Plus braid is so slippery, hence the knot issues, that I can't imagine it would get much drag from the line guides.  Whatever distance you gain or lose, can't be more than a yard or two at the extremes. 

for me, I can feel a significant difference between 30 and 50 lb braid (832 suffix). Same reels, same rods.  If you’re throwing a half ounce 15-20 yards to bank targets the difference is immaterial. When you start bombing casts the thinner 30 jumps off the reel better. I can’t wait to try 10 lb on the light rig for another comparison (albeit different rod and reel). 

[Bankc]

10 minutes ago, casts_by_fly said:

for me, I can feel a significant difference between 30 and 50 lb braid (832 suffix). Same reels, same rods.  If you’re throwing a half ounce 15-20 yards to bank targets the difference is immaterial. When you start bombing casts the thinner 30 jumps off the reel better. I can’t wait to try 10 lb on the light rig for another comparison (albeit different rod and reel). 

You might be right.  Common sense tells me you should be.  I have never done a side-by-side comparison.  I just don't feel the same difference in casting distance with braid when I change diameters that I feel with mono or fluoro.  

 

I remember when I was a kid and constantly losing my expensive (to me at that time) lures in the slop at the local pond.  I tried loading my baitcaster up with 60# mono, thinking that would fix my problem, but I couldn't cast worth a darn with that stuff.  

[jejenkyns]

21 hours ago, gulfcaptain said:

Most use heavy braid I think because smaller braid becomes problematic for them. Cast 20 and 30# braid just fine. The light 4 carrier braid may be more problematic  then the 8 carrier lines. But have had zero issue with them digging into my spool. 

This is my experience as well. I fished a whole season without one instance of the braid digging in after switching to 8 carrier. Wasn't a huge deal with 4 carrier, it's a complete none issue for me with 8. I'm generally using 15-30lbs.

[Darth-Baiter]

i have two reels with Braid.  one is 30, the other is 50.  both cast very similar.  very.

 

i can fling 65 like a wild man as well.  when i first started, i did a reel with 20 and it was a hard reel to cast.  it's all good.  as far as listening to the Y-tube, i think i know exactly where you heard it.  but that same dude also says to try it for yourself as well.  and if it works, keep at it. 

[WRB]

Not all bait casting reels are equal in spool capacity and level wind speed. Deeper spool with slower level wind worm gear results in loose braid that can dig into itself. Shallow spool with faster worm gear eliminates braid digging into itself and can perform good using smaller diameter braid. Shallow spool weighs less.

My 1940’s era Langley 330 & 340 had light weight drilled aluminum shallow spools and cast equally well as today’s reels. BFS reels take full advantage of known casting technology using small diameter braid.

Tom

[dodgeguy]

10 hours ago, Bankc said:

If you heard it on YouTube, it has to be true.  They won't let just anybody put videos up on that thing.  It's for certified experts only.  I heard that on YouTube.  

 

Though, my personal experience tells me that it doesn't really matter with braid.  Braid is limp and come off the spool pretty easily.  And the diameter difference between 65# and 10# isn't really all that much.  Plus braid is so slippery, hence the knot issues, that I can't imagine it would get much drag from the line guides.  Whatever distance you gain or lose, can't be more than a yard or two at the extremes. 

Right on.

[Scud_Muffin]

13 hours ago, Darth-Baiter said:

i have two reels with Braid.  one is 30, the other is 50.  both cast very similar.  very.

 

i can fling 65 like a wild man as well.  when i first started, i did a reel with 20 and it was a hard reel to cast.  it's all good.  as far as listening to the Y-tube, i think i know exactly where you heard it.  but that same dude also says to try it for yourself as well.  and if it works, keep at it. 

The video where he says he picked the info up from Japanese angler Kenta Kimura? I just wish he gave more specifics than “he explained to me the physics of it”. Either way, I wanted to hear some second opinions but I’m probably going to just buy some heavy and see what I think personally too. 

[garroyo130]

On 3/8/2023 at 8:10 PM, Scud_Muffin said:

Heard on the YouTube an interesting idea. The presenter suggested that heavier braid actually casts further than lighter braid on a baitcaster.  Obviously it’s less prone to digging in but have you seen evidence to that statement? Said nothing below 50 lbs belongs on a baitcaster because that and up casts further. I’ve cast 40 and thought it did fine with distance without being afraid of digging. I believe he proposed that there was a physics reason but didn’t explain further.
 

Seems paradoxical to me, but I haven’t really tried bombing lighter lures on bigger braid for example. More of a fluoro/mono guy for most baitcast stuff so not a lot of experience with it. Thoughts? 

 

So if heavier is better, what's he using? 100lb? 

[Susky River Rat]

I had 50lb on a bait caster and did not like it. I also did not like the way it affected the action of the baits. I like to run around 20#. This is just my preference. I’m a weekend warrior river rat. Not a pro. So I do what feels “right”

[bulldog1935]

Having a preference is a good thing.    

Uninventing physics to justify a preference is hokey.  

Maybe the problem was google translate.  

 

[Scud_Muffin]

40 minutes ago, garroyo130 said:

 

So if heavier is better, what's he using? 100lb? 

60-70 lb for everything including moving baits. I listened again, I think the idea is that the minor dig-in from the lighter <55 lb braid causes loss of distance or influences the casting even if you don’t see it catching and causing the bait to stop midair. Since the heavier lays better on the spool, maybe he feels like it comes off the spool more easily. That’s what I think he’s getting at but not sure. 

[Darth-Baiter]

1 hour ago, Scud_Muffin said:

The video where he says he picked the info up from Japanese angler Kenta Kimura? I just wish he gave more specifics than “he explained to me the physics of it”. Either way, I wanted to hear some second opinions but I’m probably going to just buy some heavy and see what I think personally too. 

Yea. Same guy. I do love his spiel. 
 

he also cast 20lb flouro. I can’t be sure but I would imagine the 65 braid is thinner?  Overall the dude is a fishing gear hype-man do I keep that in mind.  He sells stuff. 
 

my friend is 90% 65 lb Braid and he casts/ skips like a pro.  My friends superpower is not overthinking things. He just does his own thing. 

[MN Fisher]

44 minutes ago, Darth-Baiter said:

he also cast 20lb flouro. I can’t be sure but I would imagine the 65 braid is thinner?

Nope - about the same

 

65# Sufix 832/Seaguar Smackdown = .016"

20# Seaguar InvizX = .016"

20# Seaguar Tatsu = .015"

[Darth-Baiter]

33 minutes ago, MN Fisher said:

Nope - about the same

 

65# Sufix 832/Seaguar Smackdown = .016"

20# Seaguar InvizX = .016"

20# Seaguar Tatsu = .015"

yea.  i wasnt going to look it up, because unlike my bud, i over think things.