Diawa 150 tatula yearly service. Come on man

[garroyo130]

24 minutes ago, ska4fun said:

No. We are talking about people making excuses for companies lowering quality on fishing gear. Liking don't equate to downplay bad quality control pratices.

 

This isn't bad quality control. Its part of the design. And nothing has demonstrated that it is an inferior design. 

 

Even the Shimano Anteres has bushings on the worm gear. 

[ska4fun]

3 minutes ago, waymont said:

I don’t know of people doing this.

I do know people on BR complain about everything. 

Are you still mad about the post with ''pathetic''? Sorry! You were hit unintentionally.

2 minutes ago, garroyo130 said:

 

This isn't bad quality control. Its part of the design. And nothing has demonstrated that it is an inferior design. 

 

Even the Shimano Anteres has bushings on the worm gear. 

Why not? How it could be compared to the riveted one?

[Deleted account]

4 hours ago, garroyo130 said:

As for the drag, I would say its adequate. Is carbon better? Possibly at the extreme ranges but the standard drag is fairly linear and I have never seen the need for a smoother drag at extremely low or high settings. 

I gave my brother a Fuego CT as a Christmas present (hoping to use it in local ponds when I'm up there  ) He promptly proceeded to put it to daily use in the salt catching everything and anything, I don't think he has as much as lubed anything, much less opened it up, it's been 4 seasons, and besides looking like a Mike Tyson opponent, still going strong, yeah, crappy reel...

[garroyo130]

29 minutes ago, ska4fun said:

Are you still mad about the post with ''pathetic''? Sorry! You were hit unintentionally.

Why not? How it could be compared to the riveted one?

 

I was referring to the OP, drag washers and bushings.

 

No argument on the riveted part I agree, a fixed support is better. But we cant just say that makes it a crap reel or crap design. By that logic the Calcutta Conquest is a crap reel ... 

[ska4fun]

2 minutes ago, garroyo130 said:

 

I was referring to the OP, drag washers and bushings.

 

No argument on the riveted part I agree, a fixed support is better. But we cant just say that makes it a crap reel or crap design. By that logic the Calcutta Conquest is a crap reel ... 

Good, I was surprised since I tend to agree with you, and now over the drag washer too. Would love to know about the material of the carbon-like one.

[garroyo130]

No idea about the material its just Daiwa's secret sauce Ultimate Tournament Drag or whatever its called. For what its worth, its one of the few drags that the people over on the salt forum don't regularly swap out on the Coastal SVs. 

[MickD]

How does it cast?  I don't care what's in a reel as long as it works.  And all my Tatulas work very well. 

[Jrob78]

If you used a reel for a year and didn't realize it had these horrible shortcomings until you disassembled the reel, are they really shortcomings?

[waymont]

1 hour ago, ska4fun said:

Are you still mad about the post with ''pathetic''? Sorry! You were hit unintentionally.

I don’t ever get mad about drag washers or bushings ever. I like to fish for bass more than what drag washer is in my reel as long as it works well.

man’s my 150 is solid as a rock in every way.

[ska4fun]

9 minutes ago, waymont said:

I don’t ever get mad about drag washers or bushings ever. I like to fish for bass more than what drag washer is in my reel as long as it works well.

man’s my 150 is solid as a rock in every way.

Ok. Just a tip: act in accordance with your words...

[waymont]

1 minute ago, ska4fun said:

Ok. Just a tip: act in accordance with your words...

Just a tip. Don’t get mad about drag washers

[ska4fun]

1 minute ago, waymont said:

Just a tip. Don’t get mad about drag washers

Ok. Thanks. Sorry again for unintentionally hitting you before.

[newapti5]

4 hours ago, garroyo130 said:

 

The part is still made out of metal, but I agree it would be better if it were rivetted or had less play. 

 

Yes, it's made of some sort of metal, but I don't think the material is as strong as it used to be since it would flex a bit under load. Anyway, when I assemble my Tatula after a deep-clean, this part is the one I pay most attention to, making sure it is lined up straight and tightly secured. 

[garroyo130]

11 minutes ago, newapti5 said:

 

Yes, it's made of some sort of metal, but I don't think the material is as strong as it used to be since it would flex a bit under load. Anyway, when I assemble my Tatula after a deep-clean, this part is the one I pay most attention to, making sure it is lined up straight and tightly secured. 

 

Its definitely a softer metal, I realized that after overtightening the screws that hold it down. 

[newapti5]

6 minutes ago, garroyo130 said:

 

Its definitely a softer metal, I realized that after overtightening the screws that hold it down. 

 

Yes I noticed that as well.  Anyway, I guess smoothness is just one aspect of reels. I still secretly love using my old hard-grinding Daiwa Exceler BC reel, because its casting is so effortless and accurate. 

[PhishLI]

13 hours ago, ska4fun said:

Do you know the red drag washer material?

It looks like phenolic impregnated fiber/cloth.

7 hours ago, newapti5 said:

What I'd like to see improvement is this little part in Tatula reels (and some other reels), the support for pinion yoke. The material it uses, the small size of it, and the tiny screws that fix it to the frame, all make that part not secure enough. Once it moves a little, the alignment of the pinion gear will be affected since the pinion gear is not supported by dual bearings. 

This part is both the yoke posts and bearing retainer. The screws which fasten it to the frame often come installed with Loctite Blue. I've never encountered loose screws here.  Besides that, this part has nothing whatsoever to do with the pinions' alignment to the main gear. That's done by the O.D. of the spool's shaft and the frame mounted pinion bearing only. If the screws somehow became loose, this could be problematic obviously, but not because it would affect the pinion to main gear meshing.

4 hours ago, waymont said:

What ever the design or parts used in a Tatula 150 they are rock solid and super smooth and powerful reels. I have very well  used with big baits 150 that’s from the year they came out that is as smooth as it was when new.

that’s the important stuff.

I'm with you on that.

2 hours ago, MickD said:

How does it cast?  I don't care what's in a reel as long as it works.  And all my Tatulas work very well. 

IMO, this reel is the sleeper of the series. I don't care if it's a 2013 design either. It's a good one.

11 hours ago, Tatulatard said:

Also the tatula 150 is an older daiwa reel design. It's a 2013 reel that is pretty much unchanged today.  The only thing I find disappointing is that in 10 years they only managed to add a longer handle and new paint.  I would like a double supported pinion in what they call an "HD tatula" these days.

Then it becomes a $269-$300 reel. For $159, before the recent price increase, not many quality reels gave you a metal handle side side-plate. I just got another one for $119 during the sales.

[PhishLI]

7 hours ago, newapti5 said:

Yep. IMO level bearings may improve smoothness a little bit in heavy duty situation, but in most cases, that small improvement is almost negligible in daily fishing.  

Agreed. I typically lube the worm gear and its bushings every 3rd trip. I'm not worried about bushings in this position.

[newapti5]

14 minutes ago, PhishLI said:

I've never encountered loose screws here

 

I actually did, on my first gen Tatula. The screws were not totally loose, but this part was misaligned when I opened the reel after a year of usage. 

 

14 minutes ago, PhishLI said:

this part has nothing whatsoever to do with the pinions' alignment to the main gear

 

I respectfully disagree.  Without dual support, the pinion gear is supported by one bearing on one end, and spool shaft for the rest. But the inside of pinion gear is not tightly against the spool shaft. There's some wiggle room there for sure. I mean, this is why dual bearing support is tighter and better, because the pinion gear won't become misaligned, even under load. 

 

When this little part becomes misaligned, the pinion yoke will be as well, and then the yoke will press against the pinion gear, making it misaligned a bit, even when the pinion is still on the spool shaft.  Like I said, this is why dual bearing support pinion gear is better, because the "wiggle room" between pinion inside and spool shaft won't matter anymore.  Of course, not every manufacturer can make a decent dual support pinion gear structure.  I have a $10 unknown brand reel that has dual support pinion gear; doesn't make it any smoother than an ABU Black Max.  

[PhishLI]

1 hour ago, newapti5 said:

I respectfully disagree. 

It holds down the pinion bearing into the frame and guides the yoke from and back to its resting position. Look at the spool shaft on any Tatula. There are larger and smaller diameters present in the length of the shaft.

 

 

The pinion is supported in its resting position by the bearing and the larger diameter section of the shaft shown in the pic. Not ideally, but that has nothing to do with the post assembly if it's tightened down correctly. It nor the yoke is part of the pinion support system while the gears are under load or not. The yoke's only function is to move the pinion away from the spool's pin and back to it whether it's in a FFS Daiwa or a Tatula.

1 hour ago, newapti5 said:

When this little part becomes misaligned, the pinion yoke will be as well, and then the yoke will press against the pinion gear, making it misaligned a bit, even when the pinion is still on the spool shaft.

You may have been unlucky with yours. I've serviced a bunch of these reels and have never encountered loose screws or a misaligned post assembly. As a matter of fact, the screws are often scary tight from the factory. I'm praying I don't cam them out they've always been that tight.

 

1 hour ago, newapti5 said:

I mean, this is why dual bearing support is tighter and better, because the pinion gear won't become misaligned, even under load. 

You'll get no argument from me on this matter. I've babbled on about fully supported pinions on this forum plenty. However, the post/retainer is a different issue altogether.

[newapti5]

3 hours ago, PhishLI said:

Not ideally, but that has nothing to do with the post assembly if it's tightened down correctly.

 

Yes, if the yoke is aligned ideally, it has nothing to do with the pinion gear alignment. It behaves, just like you said, as a tool to push in and out the pinion. But when the yoke is misaligned, it is constantly pressing against the pinion. So the pinion is just as under load all the time.

 

When that happens, whatever tight tolerance between the pinion inside and spool shaft is, this constant load will affect the pinion and main gear meshing and shorten the smooth winding period. Also, since the pinion is "under load" even during casting position, the casting performance will be affected as well because now there's extra friction on the spool shaft.

 

I didn't service many Tatula reels, but judging from mine and my friend's, I would argue this may happen more often than you think. Sometimes this happens after some usage, but I would say it happens more often when we put the reel back together after a deep cleaning and didn't pay much attention to that small piece's alignment.

 

Thanks for the pics BTW.

[Mbirdsley]

10 hours ago, waymont said:

 

 

.

 

[Mbirdsley]

The slx is all metal with the exception of the cam plate, worm gear ( I was shocked by this when I first broke it down), and has plastic that hold the tabs on breaking system.  The slx also has a supported pinion with a bearing around.  It  had a bushing that I replaced underneath the drive shaft. I’m also replacing the bushing in the worm gear. The slx originally only had 3 bearings. It will now have 5  

 

the tatula does have a better breaking system.  They key washer is thicker and has a coating on it along, with the clutch wheel. The tatula had 5 bearings it will now have 6.  Don’t get me wrong I do like the reel it fishes well as a crank reel. 
 

the slx is $90-100 and tatula $150-$180.  I expect the plastic in a $100 and under reel.  The $180 reel not so much. 
 

I guess this is more about expectations vs reality. What I thought was in mid priced reels to what’s actually in them.  Like I said I’m sure diawa isn’t the only one doing this. Not about brand bashing.  
 

In the slx how they decided to keep the cost down was they went with the plastic worm gear.  I know from my last job dealing with gear/ spline cutting and production machining. that a metal worm gear probably cost shimano less than a .50 cent part to make. 

[PhishLI]

2 minutes ago, Mbirdsley said:

The slx is all metal with the exception of the cam plate, worm gear, and has plastic that hold the tabs on breaking system.

Unless they snuck one in somewhere, Shimano doesn't give you a metal handle-side side plate in a USDM freshwater reel until you get up to a Bantam. The SLX's is injected molded plastic, so it would cost much more if it were metal. Be careful cycling in the two bottom coarse threaded screws into the plastic sideplate. The top two screws coming in from the outside are machine screws which anchor into the metal main frame, so no problemo there.

 

It's also missing the second larger bearing on the crankshaft above the roller clutch. The Tat 150 and all Daiwas starting with the Fuego have this bearing, so the cranking load isn't on the roller clutch. None of this makes the SLX bad necessarily. It's built to a price point after all, and if it were built to the standards of the Tat 150 it would cost far more than it does. With that said, my brother's SLX, SLX XT, and SLX MGL have all gotten geary where the Fuegos and Tat 150s haven't, but we fish extremely choked out water with nowhere to hide. It tests reels.

 

He likes his MGL the most out of the three, but he's frustrated because even after multiple services per year and new pinion bearings, they still went geary on him, so he's moving away from them. It's just a quibble though. They're totally fishable. His Chronarch E7 is still like butter, so the SLXs bother him. He's like that.

[ska4fun]

I like Doyo drag washers too:

 

 

This is the Doyo reel I reported before. This is after it fought and won against a smaller Tarpon.