Is Enough Enough?

[T-Billy]

Come fish Ohio for a year. It'll make you feel much better about your home lakes. 1-2k acre impoundments that get pounded from April till October. You either learn to catch pressured fish, or take up golf round here.

[TnRiver46]

2 hours ago, T-Billy said:

Come fish Ohio for a year. It'll make you feel much better about your home lakes. 1-2k acre impoundments that get pounded from April till October. You either learn to catch pressured fish, or take up golf round here.

Oh booo hooo, you’re always stuck having to catch those 5 lb largemouth, stovepipe saugeye and 4 foot muskies . Poor sap…….

[Tackleholic]

Multiple tournaments every week from different locations on the same lake, often 2-3 out of the same marina on the same day.  Black bass state and lake records have not been broken for 40-50 years.  I have even witnessed tournament anglers, after a weigh in, put their fish back in the boat and head for the fillet table.  Catch rates this year for myself and ALL my friends were the lowest in the past 12 years.  Water conditions and forage remain very consistent.

[dickenscpa]

23 hours ago, TnRiver46 said:

What’s to keep someone from submitting the same fish multiple times thru photos? 
 

also I posted in another thread, it’s nearly impossible to photograph a smallmouth with its mouth closed. Every time I’ve tried it flops all over the boat, not great for the fish either. I think the fish would be dead before I got the correct photo 

 

that brings up another point, you could spend enough time trying to get your photo that the fish is dead but probably still counts 

The judges for most CPR tourneys are pretty slick. You'd be very surprised at just how different markings are on very similar fish and they'll pick it out almost every time.

 

As far as carrying a "tail" with you they remedied that by where you can put your hand on the fish when you photo. There are some that don't allow a hand on the fish and you just hope it doesn't flop. Some allow two fingers but most say hand behind the gill and so far up the tail. On some 12' fish you can only get 1 or 2 fingers on it to be within the approved area.

 

Someone else already commented on bending the board but that was when we only had Hawg Troughs. I don't think any of the local tourneys around me allow them any more, but you're not bending a Ketch board poly or aluminum. I'm SO glad Ketch came out with their board. I can't tell you how many Hawg Toughs I broke every 15 minutes of a tournament. 

 

Bass fishing is just like drug testing in MMA or sports in general. You have one group over here working tirelessly trying to beat the system and another group trying to fend it off. The ebb flows in favor of the cheaters to the non cheaters and every so often we'll have a small window of even playing field.

[Choporoz]

1 hour ago, dickenscpa said:

The judges for most CPR tourneys are pretty slick. You'd be very surprised at just how different markings are on very similar fish and they'll pick it out almost every time.

One or two years ago there was a guy who had a fish DQ'd during a multi-day CPR tournament.  He caught the same fish 2 or 3 days apart and even he didn't realize it was the same fish.  But TD did.  Fortunately,  the angler was totally cool about it.

[dickenscpa]

2 hours ago, Choporoz said:

One or two years ago there was a guy who had a fish DQ'd during a multi-day CPR tournament.  He caught the same fish 2 or 3 days apart and even he didn't realize it was the same fish.  But TD did.  Fortunately,  the angler was totally cool about it.

Every multi day tourney I've fished had a different identifier for each day. They don't use the one TourneyX generates they publish it 15 minutes before lines in. As a matter of fact, I have a place I like to put in that has ZERO cell coverage for Spring and mid Fall. I have to pull over on the side of the road about a mile and a half before the ramp and wait on the identifier before launching.

 

By mid day I'm usually out far enough to get a signal and upload my fish. If I'm finishing up and heading back for check in there's a possibility I could catch a decent one and cull back in no cell zone. When I fish there I have to always make sure I got time to get back and get loaded and a mile or two down the road to upload fish before the deadline.

 

You know that had to really suck for that guy, he didn't do anything wrong. I wonder how many times MLF'ers have caught the same fish in a day, but when you got an official in the boat doing the weighing and watch you put it back it's easy to defend compared to a kayaker out by himself.

[T-Billy]

9 hours ago, TnRiver46 said:

Oh booo hooo, you’re always stuck having to catch those 5 lb largemouth, stovepipe saugeye and 4 foot muskies . Poor sap…….

? I've learnt to catch pressured fish. ? 

[N Florida Mike]

On 11/15/2022 at 10:45 AM, Darth-Baiter said:

asking because i dont know.

 

while i dont typically fish beds, i have taken a fish from them.   usually blind casting.  when i release the fish, they go right back.  in a tourney, you put the fish in a livewell, and cruise off.   there is  no way the fish can get back to the bed right?  they arent homing pigeons.  the nest is unguarded in whatever stage it happens to be in.    that has to be detrimental right?  

The way I understand it, the female visits various beds, not just one.  If you leave the buck bass , he’ll guard the nest. And they are generally much smaller and less desirable to keep in a tournament anyway. 

 

[Chris Catignani]

The fish are gonna be OK. Those large expanses of grass flats will have fish that will never even see a lure. Same goes for all that shallow water in the backs of coves and creeks. When you spend $$$ for a boat...you get scared to scratch the gel coat.?

[roadwarrior]

Toledo Bend gets a lot of pressure, but I read somewhere that 85% of the bass in

that lake die naturally from old age.

[Junk Fisherman]

I'm conflicted with this one.  On one hand, more tournaments results in more people being outdoors and using our natural resources which is great.  Naturally, the DNR is going to to accommodate groups of fishermen but more tournaments and a lot of boats on the water negatively impacts non-tournament fishermen, recreational boaters, and lakeside homeowners.  Seems like the best solution is to limit tournament numbers and sizes, make some lakes Saturday or Sunday-only tournaments, or simply prohibit tournaments on some lakes.  This could satisfy everyone.  Well, not the people who think they should be allowed to do whatever they want, whenever they want but if people had more of a mindset of sharing our resources then it could help alleviate this too-many-tournaments problem. 

 

I think we've all experienced the difference between weekend fishing with and without a large tournament being held.  There is a huge difference here in northern Illinois.  I keep a document of all the local tournaments and rarely fish a body of water if a big tournament is being held.  A new DNR rule came out this year that required a usage fee for tournaments at state-run launches.  Several circuits stopped fishing certain bodies of water.  While the tournament community was up in arms, I loved it.  One popular body of water by me used to be completely packed on the weekends in the fall.  I went there once this fall on a nice Saturday and it was beautiful with a relatively low number of fishermen on the water.  And now with all the HS and college tournaments adding even more events and boaters on our waters, this problem will only get worse.  

 

 

[Bankc]

Instead of approaching it from the perspective of how tournaments and fishing pressure effect a body of water, think of it from the perspective of a body of water effects tournaments and fishing pressure.  

If a lake becomes overfished and no one ever catches fish on it, eventually, most people will stop fishing it and go somewhere else.  If the best lakes experience so much fishing pressure that no one manages to catch many fish, then they'll quit having tournaments on them.  

 

So, in the short term and lake specific view, fishing pressure and tournaments can indeed ruin a body of water for future generations.  However, in the long term and world view, they won't matter.  Once a lake gets a solid reputation of being a bad fishery, it'll be allowed to rebound just due to human nature.  People don't like wasting their time, after all.  The real threat to the sport comes in the form of pollution, drought, invasive species, etc.  With catch and release being so common, you can understand how fishing pressure won't affect the actual fish population so much as the fish behavior, and thus the angler's behavior.  It's the things that directly affect the fish population that are most concerning.  

[TOXIC]

Science has proven bed fishing does not damage fish populations.  All the other arguments have been beat to death and there never will be total agreement.  For those that feel catch and weigh tournaments are so damaging, even though I don’t fish them anymore, why are you not as enraged at meat fishermen who bag a limit every time they fish and take them home to lake crisco?  Maybe because science also says the population has to be controlled?  I dunno, I do know tough lakes/rivers will always be tough and bodies of water go through phases that make them productive or tough depending on the age, but I feel fishing/tournament pressure isn’t a factor unless it’s pond size.  

[J Francho]

Are we talking about a man made impoundment?

[PhishLI]

On 11/16/2022 at 5:31 AM, T-Billy said:

You either learn to catch pressured fish, or take up golf round here.

Yup. You're either built for it or you're not. My spots are mostly 40 acres and under which are heavily poached. Our newly arrived friends from the east are smart, and take advantage of fishing apps and local FB fishing groups where idiots post their catch locations. I know this for a fact because a few of my crew are native born to both countries, speak the lingo, and got the scoop firsthand. These poachers are systematic, sneaky, and merciless. It isn't tournament pressure. It's worse.

 

The old timers here are always crying about how they can't catch a bass anymore, sometimes for weeks at a time these days, when 10 years ago they could knock off 15 in an afternoon without even trying. They're not that good at fishing, obviously, but that hasn't changed, so... The population density certainly has.

 

However, if you have a clue and are mentally conditioned for the grind you'll usually catch some, and we have a nice gene pool here for size, so it's worth the work for me. I get bored quickly when things come too easily anyway, so I'm made for this.

[WIGuide]

Todd Castledine just did a video on this subject recently. He lives on Sam Rayburn which is one of the most heavily pressured bodies of water in the US when it comes to tournament fishing. He shares some very interesting insights to what he sees.

 

[gim]

On 11/23/2022 at 10:15 AM, TOXIC said:

why are you not as enraged at meat fishermen who bag a limit every time they fish and take them home to lake crisco?

I don't think this was necessarily directed at me, but I am one of those guys that thinks tournaments should go to immediate catch and release format.  Do I think it causes a lot of mortality?  No, I don't.  But immediate catch and release would be far less, especially in the warm summer months when mortality is high.  If walleye tournaments can do it, so can bass tournaments.

 

As for the meat hunters, around here at least, most bass anglers are not seeking their quarry to keep them.  In fact, very few are.  The walleye is the king here, and they are targeted almost exclusively for harvest, with panfish being a close second.  The issue right now with these two species is ice fishing.  Come up here in January and take a look see on how many houses you see out there on a popular lake.  You will be amazed.  There's literally hundreds.  Its 100% non-stop angling pressure for months on end...and very few of them are out there to release their catch.  The only limiting factor is the condition of the ice.  And luckily, so far its been crappy.  There's slush and deep snow limiting the amount of pressure.  And I hope it stays that way all winter.

[TOXIC]

On 12/27/2022 at 3:27 PM, gimruis said:

I don't think this was necessarily directed at me, 

No it wasn’t directed at anyone in particular but I will tell you that the “meat” fishermen I have seen take everything they catch as food.  Doesn’t matter the species.  Those who target walleye, perch etc., are not the meat fishermen I am referring to.  I’ve seen many, many limits of smallmouth and largemouth harvested regardless of size.  I’m not criticizing the fact they catch and eat the fish we consider sport.  There are thousands that do.  As long as it’s within the regulations for size and number, they are good to go.  My point is that we all have that option when we purchase our licenses so zeroing in on tournaments is fairly myopic.  

[WRB]

We have city water storage lakes that have never been open to the public for fishing, zero fishing pressure. These are unmanaged lakes for fishing purposes yet have phenomenal fishing if you get a chance to fish them. Self sustaining fish populations, most over 50 years old.

Open these lakes to public fishing with State regulated harvest limits and the fishery will change and become like every other public lake. The question is if these lakes were only open to tournament fishing would they change?

Imo the answer is yes. The fish being caught about 3% of the catch population don’t survive. The most aggressive fish are among those being caught and slowly eliminated from the gene pool.

In public lakes the fishing population is both intentionally harvested and unintentionally loosing fish from the population by post mortality from tournaments and food.

Catch, photo and immediately released the post mortality would reduced but not eliminated. Lots better then livewell mortality.

Tom

[detroit1]

On 11/14/2022 at 5:51 PM, Deleted account said:

Nope, the fishing is going to be whatever the fishing is going to be because of man made reasons and otherwise. I show up and catch what's there to catch.

You show up and catch what YOU can, not what's there to catch. You can't catch them all.. 

[Deleted account]

6 hours ago, detroit1 said:

You show up and catch what YOU can, not what's there to catch. You can't catch them all.. 

Recreational anglers be funny...

[detroit1]

"Pro" fisherman seem funny too. ?

[casts_by_fly]

On 11/16/2022 at 5:31 AM, T-Billy said:

Come fish Ohio for a year. It'll make you feel much better about your home lakes. 1-2k acre impoundments that get pounded from April till October. You either learn to catch pressured fish, or take up golf round here.

 

When you want a break from Ohio, pop over to NJ.  You'll feel right at home.  Golf is popular here.

[Cdn Angler]

I have to agree with Tom and the other poster concerning the impact of so much pressure on lakes. It makes the fishing far worse for everyone the more pressure there is. In order of harm you have the meat eaters, bed-fishing/livewells, then C&R. But the sheer volume of people fishing will make fish less likely to bite, increase mortality, reduce the size of the biggest fish, reduce aggressive fish etc. It's all well and good that you can still catch fish, usually with $20,000+ of gear, but it becomes increasingly impossible for the kid with one rod, the old guy in a jon boat etc. I also don't know how it is more enjoyable to grind harder to catch fewer and smaller fish on fewer possible lures. 

 

I've fished a few lakes up here that took time and effort to access, but barely see a lure all year. It's fantastic and enjoyable fishing. 

 

Personally I think the number of tournaments should be restricted, for this reason and also just for public enjoyment of the lake. It's like trying to enjoy a nature walk when there's a trail running marathon with 2,000 people on the same trail. Once and awhile is fine, but it shouldn't be every day. 

 

The more I look at it fishing is better off as a pastime than a sport/competition. 

[dickenscpa]

On 1/16/2023 at 1:40 PM, Cdn Angler said:

 

 

Personally I think the number of tournaments should be restricted, for this reason and also just for public enjoyment of the lake. It's like trying to enjoy a nature walk when there's a trail running marathon with 2,000 people on the same trail. Once and awhile is fine, but it shouldn't be every day. 

 

The more I look at it fishing is better off as a pastime than a sport/competition. 

I highlighted the above because it reminded me of a funny story. Me, my wife and our two kids are just outdoors people. We LOVE to go hiking. I work horrible hours most of the year but try to preserve my weekends for us four to be together and have fun. Our kids have these passports and we get them stamped at state and federal parks, etc

 

Anyways we spent half a day driving to a park to go hiking and obviously would have a half day drive back. We get there and they are having some type of trail run going on and the public wasn't allowed on the course.