Casting inconsistency from rod to rod

[Dash Riprock]

I have one rod and reel combo (a Daiwa Tatula SV TW103 with a 6'6" St. Croix Triumph, MF) that naturally throws long, elegant effortless arcs almost exactly where I aim. The same casting motion with most of my other combos throw short, jerky "dart-like" casts that tend to pull to one side, usually to the left. I can make the other rods work but I really have to focus on it, and change my casting motion and the timing of my release. The Tatula/St. Croix I don't even have to think about.

 

Is this a function of rod length or stiffness? My other rods are mostly a bit longer, but none more than 7', and most are rated MH instead of M. I've tried switching them around on different reels and different baits, but nothing seems to work. I still fight the "darts". 

 

Does this make any sense to anybody? I'm just an occasional bank fisher who really doesn't need all this fancy stuff but I blame you guys for bringing the bait monkey into my house. 

 

 

[Mobasser]

Does your med rod flex a little in the tip when you cast? Sometimes with different rod makes, there's a good amount of difference between med, and med hvy.

[dodgeguy]

a stiff fast tip will cause this. your triumph has a tip that you obviously can relate to. the question is did you buy the other rods for there tip actions and would it benefit you to replace them.

[Dash Riprock]

23 minutes ago, Mobasser said:

Does your med rod flex a little in the tip when you cast? Sometimes with different rod makes, there's a good amount of difference between med, and med hvy.

I'm not sure, I'm not really sophisticated enough to be able to tell. But maybe. Next time I go out I'll look for that. 

4 minutes ago, dodgeguy said:

a stiff fast tip will cause this. your triumph has a tip that you obviously can relate to. the question is did you buy the other rods for there tip actions and would it benefit you to replace them.

 

That's kinda what I'm thinking, it's got to be either stiffness or length [that's what she said], or some combination thereof. I lucked out with the St. Croix that for whatever reason fits my "swing", so to speak. I guess I'm trying to figure out what that is so I can apply it to future purchases.

 

Or just stick with St. Croix rods, but that's boring...

[WRB]

Rods cast lures not reels. 

Triumph MF has a lower modulus, less stiff, blank that is loading properly with your casting motion. Bottom line it’s easier to cast slower action rods.

Slow down your casting motion and use heavier lures using the MHF rods and practice until your release point becomes a natural motion. Distance improves with practice.

Tom 

PS, are right or left eye dominate?

[newapti5]

Have you tried to put that Tatula SV on similar rods for a try? Besides rods, reels could cause that casting issue as well. When you're used to a reel with a certain spool, a different heavier spool could cause the cast to go left, and a lighter spool could cause it to go right.

 

Actually I wouldn't call it an "issue," as you could fix it by matching the lure weight to each setup - if it goes left, try using a heavier lure; if it goes right, try using a lighter lure.

[T-Billy]

WRB nailed it. It's all about how the bait loads the rod. Heavier baits will get your MH rods casting like that medium. We tend to be a bit more accurate with shorter rods, but having the bait weight matched to the rods power matters more IMO.

[Dash Riprock]

5 minutes ago, WRB said:

Rods cast lures not reels. 

Triumph MF has a lower modulus, less stiff, blank that is loading properly with your casting motion. Bottom line it’s easier to cast slower action rods.

Slow down your casting motion and use heavier lures using the MHF rods and practice until your release point becomes a natural motion. Distance improves with practice.

Tom 

PS, are right or left eye dominate?

Right dominate.

 

I agree that this isn't an issue with the reel. That Tatula is my favorite reel for many reasons, but I don't think the reel has anything to do with this problem. 

 

What you say makes sense but I've tried various lures on various rods and can't ever get it dialed in like I can on that St. Croix. I have noticed that throwing "harder" (i.e. faster), which I thought might help load up a stiffer rod, doesn't really help and often makes it worse. I have to really focus on aiming a long, looping cast at the sky to get the same arc as a flick of that St. Croix produces. 

 

 

 

[dodgeguy]

24 minutes ago, Dash Riprock said:

I'm not sure, I'm not really sophisticated enough to be able to tell. But maybe. Next time I go out I'll look for that. 

 

That's kinda what I'm thinking, it's got to be either stiffness or length [that's what she said], or some combination thereof. I lucked out with the St. Croix that for whatever reason fits my "swing", so to speak. I guess I'm trying to figure out what that is so I can apply it to future purchases.

 

Or just stick with St. Croix rods, but that's boring...

Actually I think your better off sticking to one brand. Less adaptation on your part. Rods with softer fast tips cast better than extra fast tips and are more accurate.Shorter rods are also .more accurate.

[Dash Riprock]

8 minutes ago, newapti5 said:

Have you tried to put that Tatula SV on similar rods for a try? Besides rods, reels could cause that casting issue as well. When you're used to a reel with a certain spool, a different heavier spool could cause the cast to go left, and a lighter spool could cause it to go right.

 

Actually I wouldn't call it an "issue," as you could fix it by matching the lure weight to each setup - if it goes left, try using a heavier lure; if it goes right, try using a lighter lure.

No, I haven't moved the Tatula to anything else. Kinda scared to break up that combo even as a test.

 

Lure weights do play a role but I don't think any of this has to do with the reels. 

3 minutes ago, dodgeguy said:

Actually I think your better off sticking to one brand. Less adaptation on your part. Rods with softer fast tips cast better than extra fast tips and are more accurate.Shorter rods are also .more accurate.

Good advice. What started me down this path was a BPS CarbonLite 6'6" MHF that I just couldn't cast worth a squat no matter what I tried. I started moving some things around to see if I could find a combo that would work for it and then everything else I was putting together kinda went sour. 

[newapti5]

1 minute ago, Dash Riprock said:

Lure weights do play a role but I don't think any of this has to do with the reels. 

 

It could be just the rods and matching lures, but reels could be a factor as well. I don't know what lures you're using, but heavy spools are designed for heavy lures. When you use a reel with heavy spool to cast light lures, it tends to go left. For example, I wouldn't use a Lew's BB1 to cast a 1/4oz lure.

 

Also, brake force plays a role in it as well. Too strong a brake force for a certain lure could cause it to go left, besides killing the distance.

 

You could give it a try next time, matching the same rod with different reels. Maybe you'll see some difference.

[new2BC4bass]

OP:  Your post reminds me that I need to take out my old 7' MHF Cumara.  It wasn't very accurate for me at the time I bought it.  Now that I have a few more years experience with baitcasters, I need to see if I can do better with it.

 

It's getting close to that time of the year when I can stop at a local boat ramp on the Lehigh River and practice hitting leaves as they float by.  Adds a bit of challenge to my casting.

[Bankc]

Try turning your wrist so the reel handles are facing up when you cast.  That's assuming you're using a right hand reel and casting right handed.  

 

The problem is likely coming from, as others have noted, the rod not loading properly.  By rotating your wrist, your wrist will want to move more straight up and down, as opposed to sweeping across at a slight angle.  That should help correct the leftward hook you're getting in your casts.  It won't cure everything, but it might help a bit.  Plus, I find it a bit easier to get more wrist snap and more distance this way, with a bit less arm effort.  And that increases accuracy for long casts.  

 

The rest just comes with practice and feel.  Learning to get the timing right.  Eventually, you'll pick up on how to feel the rod load and learn how to adjust your cast to that.  You won't even have to think about it, just like you do now with your St. Croix.  The transition for that rod was just quicker for you because it's naturally loading properly with your current casting style and baits.  

[GetFishorDieTryin]

Action and balance play a big part for sure.  A rod that loads and unloads smooth and fast is more enjoyable to fish.  However, if the rod is not splined it doesn't matter how well it loads it just not going to feel right casting or fighting a fish, because the blank will want to twist.  You would be surprised at how many rods you can find on the rack at any given store that weren't splined correctly Irregardless of the price.  Some companies are better than others.  Dobyns makes it a priority to get it right.  SC does a good with the US made rods.  The mexican made rods aren't as consistent, but the quality of the mexican builds has gotten much better since the 1st gen Mojos.  

[Dash Riprock]

2 hours ago, Bankc said:

Try turning your wrist so the reel handles are facing up when you cast.  That's assuming you're using a right hand reel and casting right handed.  

 

The problem is likely coming from, as others have noted, the rod not loading properly.  By rotating your wrist, your wrist will want to move more straight up and down, as opposed to sweeping across at a slight angle.  That should help correct the leftward hook you're getting in your casts.  It won't cure everything, but it might help a bit.  Plus, I find it a bit easier to get more wrist snap and more distance this way, with a bit less arm effort.  And that increases accuracy for long casts.  

 

The rest just comes with practice and feel.  Learning to get the timing right.  Eventually, you'll pick up on how to feel the rod load and learn how to adjust your cast to that.  You won't even have to think about it, just like you do now with your St. Croix.  The transition for that rod was just quicker for you because it's naturally loading properly with your current casting style and baits.  

This reminds me of my attempt to take up golf a few years ago. That sport has its own version of a bait monkey. I tinkered around with different clubs trying to keep up with the latest and greatest and ultimately realized that some clubs just fit your swing, and some just don't. There's a science behind it and oddly enough, it's also mostly a combination of club length and flex.

 

I just need to quit fighting it and move everything over to St. Croix I guess. 

[diehardbassfishing]

You can't cast well with a broomstick or a wet noodle.

 

The two rods you mention fall between. Good!

 

I also have the bait monkey acting on me to try different brands of rods. I've found that I can

find rods that fit what I'm looking for.

It's not too hard to compare two rods for "equivalent rod loading ability".

Hold your trusted rod by the grip, and extend the rod out and place the tip against the seat of a chair. Something that is kinda neutral in height. Get a feel for how the rod flexes using little force. Small bounce is helpful. Now switch to the rod you're considering to purchase. If it feels and looks VERY different when loading, it's going to cast very different.

 

Try this test using your rods - see if you can see the differences and similarities.

 

Karl

 

[Woody B]

How far do you have the lure hanging from the end of the rod when you're casting?  

 

If the lure is hanging a long way from the rod the release point is more critical.  I see a BUNCH of people casting with the lure a foot or more from the end of the rod.  That doesn't work for me.  

[JackstrawIII]

My favorite rod to use (obviously can't use it for everything) is that exact same rod, 6.6" medium fast St. Croix Triumph casting rod. It's super accurate, which I believe is a mix of shorter length and more bend towards the tip. Stiffer, longer rods are harder to cast accurately. 

[Columbia Craw]

Yes and yes. Anytime you change one the three factors, rod length,  rod action or lure weight, you’ll have to make some adjustments in your casting technique.

[dodgeguy]

I love the tips on my Dobyns Sierra Micro guide rods . They have just enough give to load up properly and cast accurately.

[RDB]

It could be multiple things and despite what you might hear from others, casting consistency and accuracy is not only a rod issue.  The reel settings can absolutely have an impact on accuracy, consistency, and release points.  If you are missing from side to side, I would bet there are also some issues with your technique.  With a proper roll cast, you shouldn’t have a lot of side to side miss issues with a properly set up rod and reel.

[Jrob78]

9 hours ago, T-Billy said:

WRB nailed it. It's all about how the bait loads the rod. Heavier baits will get your MH rods casting like that medium. We tend to be a bit more accurate with shorter rods, but having the bait weight matched to the rods power matters more IMO.

This is the correct answer, if your bait doesn't load your rod properly it isn't going to cast well. All of that other stuff does play a role in casting but if whatever you're trying to cast doesn't load the tip well you're going to have a bad time.

[Dash Riprock]

23 hours ago, Bankc said:

Try turning your wrist so the reel handles are facing up when you cast.  That's assuming you're using a right hand reel and casting right handed.  

 

The problem is likely coming from, as others have noted, the rod not loading properly.  By rotating your wrist, your wrist will want to move more straight up and down, as opposed to sweeping across at a slight angle.  That should help correct the leftward hook you're getting in your casts.  It won't cure everything, but it might help a bit.  Plus, I find it a bit easier to get more wrist snap and more distance this way, with a bit less arm effort.  And that increases accuracy for long casts.  

 

Oh wow, I had a chance to try this briefly this morning and it seemed to help a lot. It was rather windy so I was fighting that but yeah, it did cut down noticeably on the tendency to the lure to "dive" and seemed to improve distance considerably even with the wind. Not sure about accuracy, I'll have to work on it some more under better conditions and get used to rotating my wrist but yes, this might be a game changer. Thank you. 

[Dash Riprock]

18 hours ago, JackstrawIII said:

My favorite rod to use (obviously can't use it for everything) is that exact same rod, 6.6" medium fast St. Croix Triumph casting rod. It's super accurate, which I believe is a mix of shorter length and more bend towards the tip. Stiffer, longer rods are harder to cast accurately. 

Do you have any experience with other St. Croix models? I guess the Triumph is pretty much the entry level, if I moved up the line would the settings stay consistent? If there's something even better than this one I'd love to try it because this rod is kinda the Holy Grail for what I fish.

 

[JackstrawIII]

5 hours ago, Dash Riprock said:

Do you have any experience with other St. Croix models?

Yes, I also have 3 of their Premier spinning rods. They're amazing, not gonna lie. But, I believe the Triumph model uses the same blank and if that's true, it is arguably a better value. 

 

I also have two of their BassX casting rods. They're good and I use the 7'1" MHF to throw heavy spinnerbaits, but they're heavier power rods, and I always gravitate to lighter rods when I can get away with it, so I honestly use my 6'6" MF Triumph way more often. As far as quality between the two... I can't tell a difference honestly.