Aluminum Gears

[bulldog1935]

This topic pops up in strange forms and context, such as zinc gears on spinning reels are better - NOT. 

Brass gears get repeatedly mentioned  as a security blanket for those who admit to being paranoid about aluminum gears - brass gears cost more simply because they're more expensive to make. 

While gear MOC and finishing treatment has made strides in the past decade, where they've really made strides in the last five years or so is in gear teeth design and manufacturing.  Finer gear teeth reduce contact stress, spreading the load over several engaged teeth, and better self-aligning. 

 

The fact remains, hard anodized aluminum alloy gears are Lighter, Harder, Tougher, and Stronger than brass gears. 

 

 

 

Microhardness of anodized gear teeth is comparable to quenched and tempered alloy steel, equivalent to 360 Brinnell

[Tatulatard]

I don't want hard gears.  That's a one way ticket to buzz town.  Give me soft gears with big teeth and grease.  

 

[Bankc]

The good thing about brass and nylon is they're self lubricating.  So if you don't keep up with your maintenance, they'll stay smoother longer.  

 

But you're right about aluminum.  Personally, I've found that what makes a smooth, long lasting reel is less about what the gears are made of, and more about how well it's taken care of and how tight the tolerances are in their production.  With these modern drag systems, you're unlikely to be able to put enough force on the gear to start stripping the teeth.  But if the gears aren't aligned properly to begin with, you'll wear out the teeth just using it normally.  

 

Personally, I don't care about what the reel is made of, so much as how it's made.  My Abu Zeta with a plastic composite body has held up to far more stress and has remained much smoother than my aluminum body BPS PQ2, just as an example.  

[bulldog1935]

@Bankc a note, if you've ever handled anything finished with deep Type III anodizing,

it's so polished and hard it feels soapy.  With asperities polished away, that reduces its lube requirement. 

And yes, you're right, brass contains lead (however, to get to those lead particles, you have to wear-away brass). 

 

I can't say much nice about nylon gears, because I fished through my Mitchell 300 gears in 4 years in high school. 

[Deleted account]

This reminds me of when folks thought titanium chains and cogs were a good idea in cycling...

#brassballsbrassgears

[bulldog1935]

You left out type-III anodized 7075-T6 chainrings.  B takes second Fiddle around here to S - in chorus, even.  And when the numbers are right in front of you. 

Of course cyclists are the most lemming-like for marketing - fly fishermen are only second.

[casts_by_fly]

41 minutes ago, bulldog1935 said:

You left out type-III anodized 7075-T6 chainrings.  B takes second Fiddle around here to S. 

And when the numbers are right in front of you. 

 

What the heck is that?  it looks like it has tubeless tires but no clips or cages.  Seems like a lot of contradiction in needs.

[bulldog1935]

Since I got on the bad side of zinc gears in the post I linked in my OP, and don't care about the peanut gallery, wrote this for a friend and decided to post it here to acknowledge zinc gears their just place in cost-effective spinning reels. 

Modern high-strength zinc die castings can reach 470 MPa UTS.
That's 80% of cold-worked brass or heat-treated 7075, and 30% stronger than heat-treated 6061.
Just about any $100 spinning reel will have a die-cast main gear. You can see the worm-gear rider below is also die-cast.

Zinc alloys and gears have engineering development and process control, and are the best choice for cost-effective manufacturing - there's no cast aluminum or bronze that would plug in here. You can get strength in thin, complex shapes and controlled surface microstructure for wear toughness.
The difference between wrought is the finest grains in the zinc controlled surface are still 100-times larger than wrought, and 2-phase structure with reduced grain cohesive strength, and lower fatigue strength.

 

TackleAdvisors has always been the best on take-down reviews of fishing reels. If you have the time (an hour) his $100 reel shoot out video at least brushes over important design issues. Shimano isn't the answer to every fishing niche, especially cost niche; likewise, neither is Penn, etc.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o-xN_kfjBTo

At some point in reel cost hierarchy, you want worm drive, quality wrought gears, and light weight. We like to push our tackle to extremes, have it come out of abuse just like it started, and last as long as we want to fish. You do get what you pay for, and when you're in the trade-off price zone, you're sacrificing something. You may be giving up line management and the ability to fish fine braid, make a trade-off for that Shimano smooth feel, instead for a reel that's not going to get crushed by a couple of large fish.

[garroyo130]

IMO for most bass fishing the strength of gears doesn't come into play. Maybe I don't fish em  hard enough, replace reels too often, or keep the drag too lose but I've yet to strip gears or wear them down to where they need replacement on a reel. 

[bulldog1935]

Of course the thesis and context of the thread was stated up front.  It's been argued on the forum that zinc gears are superior to aluminum gears, and repeatedly assumed that brass gears are superior to aluminum gears.  Generically, either was likely true at some time in the past. (I know of a very good planetary multiplier fly reel that came with type-II anodized 6061 gears, and the maker's upgrade was Delrin.) 

The math says the current technology of aluminum gears is superior to either zinc or brass. 

 

If you've had good results, it's exactly because the strength of the gears continued to play.  Each pinion gear tooth on a 7-geared reel makes 170 contacts on every cast you retrieve. 

 

I've fished through nylon gears, bronze rotor bushing, bronze A/R dogs, plated brass worm gears (but never wore through a 440 SS worm gear).  I've replaced badly worn brass gears on Ambassadeur, and fished reels until they were ready to retire and replace. 

 

I've never had an aluminum gear to worry about until recent Daiwa and Shimano reels, and I'm not even close to worried.  

[Tatulatard]

2 hours ago, garroyo130 said:

IMO for most bass fishing the strength of gears doesn't come into play. Maybe I don't fish em  hard enough, replace reels too often, or keep the drag too lose but I've yet to strip gears or wear them down to where they need replacement on a reel. 

Bass anglers are one of the more frequent anglers to complain of gears getting rough.  We wind under load and wind fish in as a normal thing instead of using the rod.  We also wind in high resistance baits on high gear ratios frequently.  Both contribute to a reel losing the smooth feeling it once had when new.  This loss of smoothness is what "gears going bad" means rather than reels locking up.

[WRB]

Type 111, hard anodize, requires allowance for .0008 build up thickness whereas Titanium Nitrite is harder without significant build up allowance.

Lead brass is self lubricating and significantly heavier metal then aluminum alloys.

There is aluminum beryllium alloys that are lighter weight and stronger them 7075-T6, to high of cost for commercial gears.

Zinc is a poor choice for reel gears, 7075-T6 is far better choice.

Tom