Big vs regular size lures?

[garroyo130]

1 hour ago, Deleted account said:

Smart fish concept exists only between the ears of (poor) anglers...

 

I agree with things being misinterpreted as intelligence but wonder if there is any pattern in the behavior of bigger bass. For example are they more aggressive or less aggressive than average bass, do they migrate as much, do they gorge or graze? Would be interesting to find out ... 

[DitchPanda]

So I don't throw big baits enough to know. There are several baits that consistently catch my biggest bass...namely spinnerbaits and jigs. Most important thing in catching the biggest bass in your body of water in my mind is timing...colder water and cruddy conditions i.e. prespawn and fall...rainy or overcast and breezy have produced probably 90% of my biggest bass. All that said my PB of 8.75lbs came on a 2in crappie twister.

[Team9nine]

 

 

@WRB has summed it up best, IMO. In today’s “fact check” world, I’d say the big bait = big bass equation is ‘partly true,’ but also ‘missing context.’ In short, it seems the closer you can put yourself (really, your ‘bait’) next to a big bass, via timing, location, and/or luck, the less important bait size becomes, generally speaking. FFS has helped put some of these final puzzle pieces into place in that regard.

[Craigholland]

1 hour ago, Team9nine said:

 

 

@WRB has summed it up best, IMO. In today’s “fact check” world, I’d say the big bait = big bass equation is ‘partly true,’ but also ‘missing context.’ In short, it seems the closer you can put yourself (really, your ‘bait’) next to a big bass, via timing, location, and/or luck, the less important bait size becomes, generally speaking. FFS has helped put some of these final puzzle pieces into place in that regard.

I agree ffs is the cats meow. Josh jones catches most of his bigs with a jig. Butch brown and oliver nguyen mostly swim baits. I'm upgrading now but haven't made my mind up in 10 inch screen vs 12.

[WRB]

16 hours ago, RDB said:

I’m reading Sowbelly now.  It sounds like that was a pretty special time for bass fishing after those Florida’s grew up.  I saw that something like 5 of the top 10 bass ever caught came from Castaic & Casitas between ‘80-‘91 and in the 32 years since, only 2 in the top 25.  Four of the 5 were caught in ‘90 & ‘91 alone.  Did something happen at those lakes after ‘91 that caused such an abrupt drop?

Main lake Castiac suffered from a perfect storm of negative events.

1. Basin Magazine offers $1,000,000 reward for new world record LMB in around 1990. This brought tremendous fishing pressure on both Castaic and Casitas for several years.

2. 1995 Castaic lake draw 150’ down to repair the fore bay lake Elderberry dam. Elderberry receives water from lake Pyramid, both lakes have big stripe bass populations to 40 lbs. The draw down created too much pressure on the Elderberry dam during repairs and fearing the dam failure.

All the Elderberry water, including the Stripe bass was released into Castaic. The result was devastating to the trout population from the big Stripers depleting a prime food source for the big FLMB population already under attack by bounty hunters.

3. The DFG gets sued for planting non-native hatchery Rainbow trout in SoCal lakes and streams haulting the weekly trout plants in 2010.

The lake Castiac main lake stops producing giant FLMB by 2012. The after bay known as the Lagoon is unaffected by the Stripe bass and still has a population of giant FLMB, trout, shad and crappie. The lagoon is a small deep electric boat only lake. few bass anglers are fishing regularly except Butch Brown who knows every pebble in this lake.

Casitas,

1. The trout plants stop in 2010 and the high pressure by guides looking for trophy bass after Castiac crashed increases. 

2. Quagga mussels are discovered in SoCal lakes and Casitas fearing infestation stops planting crawdads, the State stopped planting trout. By 2015 the giant FLMB population starts to crash and 2016 the no more giant bass 15+ lbs will be caught to this date.

3. The drought starts and Casitas doesn’t receive any Ventura Rivers water run off for fear of invasive species entering the lake and local environmental pressure. 2019 the lake drops 60’ and remains at 30% pool to this day.

Tom

[the reel ess]

I'm all for the big baits until I don't get a bite three straight trips. This is my philosophy. Big bass will bite small baits or large baits if you present them an they're hungry. My 2nd biggest bass, and very close to my biggest, came on a 5" SK Ocho. My big bass baits are jig, T-rigged worms and craws, spinnerbaits, bigger topwaters.

[RDB]

2 hours ago, WRB said:

Main lake Castiac suffered from a perfect storm of negative events.

1. Basin Magazine offers $1,000,000 reward for new world record LMB in around 1990. This brought tremendous fishing pressure on both Castaic and Casitas for several years.

2. 1995 Castaic lake draw 150’ down to repair the fore bay lake Elderberry dam. Elderberry receives water from lake Pyramid, both lakes have big stripe bass populations to 40 lbs. The draw down created too much pressure on the Elderberry dam during repairs and fearing the dam failure.

All the Elderberry water, including the Stripe bass was released into Castaic. The result was devastating to the trout population from the big Stripers depleting a prime food source for the big FLMB population already under attack by bounty hunters.

3. The DFG gets sued for planting non-native hatchery Rainbow trout in SoCal lakes and streams haulting the weekly trout plants in 2010.

The lake Castiac main lake stops producing giant FLMB by 2012. The after bay known as the Lagoon is unaffected by the Stripe bass and still has a population of giant FLMB, trout, shad and crappie. The lagoon is a small deep electric boat only lake. few bass anglers are fishing regularly except Butch Brown who knows every pebble in this lake.

Casitas,

1. The trout plants stop in 2010 and the high pressure by guides looking for trophy bass after Castiac crashed increases. 

2. Quagga mussels are discovered in SoCal lakes and Casitas fearing infestation stops planting crawdads, the State stopped planting trout. By 2015 the giant FLMB population starts to crash and 2016 the no more giant bass 15+ lbs will be caught to this date.

3. The drought starts and Casitas doesn’t receive any Ventura Rivers water run off for fear of invasive species entering the lake and local environmental pressure. 2019 the lake drops 60’ and remains at 30% pool to this day.

Tom

Wow…that is such a shame.  It seems like it was just a matter of time before the record fell.  I didn’t realize how small the lakes are, so I can see how they would be really susceptible to heavy fishing pressure.  I can’t imagine the notoriety from the ‘80’s & ‘90’s was a bad thing for the economy.  It’s hard to believe they haven’t tried to scale the program at a larger lake unless those were unicorns.

[WRB]

Hard to imagine that California doesn’t have a bass stocking program. We do have or had fresh water rainbow trout stocking programs.

All out Florida strain LMB came from the original transfer of FLMB by Oriville Ball in 1959 for San Diego city lakes raised from fingerlings in Upper Otay lake. Bass are stocked 1 time into a lake then on their own.

Texas has a excellent FLMB stocking and hatchery program using Share A Lunker 13+ lb as brood stock.   

Unicorns are more common then giant bass in California.

Tom

[Derek1]

4 hours ago, WRB said:

Main lake Castiac suffered from a perfect storm of negative events.

1. Basin Magazine offers $1,000,000 reward for new world record LMB in around 1990. This brought tremendous fishing pressure on both Castaic and Casitas for several years.

2. 1995 Castaic lake draw 150’ down to repair the fore bay lake Elderberry dam. Elderberry receives water from lake Pyramid, both lakes have big stripe bass populations to 40 lbs. The draw down created too much pressure on the Elderberry dam during repairs and fearing the dam failure.

All the Elderberry water, including the Stripe bass was released into Castaic. The result was devastating to the trout population from the big Stripers depleting a prime food source for the big FLMB population already under attack by bounty hunters.

3. The DFG gets sued for planting non-native hatchery Rainbow trout in SoCal lakes and streams haulting the weekly trout plants in 2010.

The lake Castiac main lake stops producing giant FLMB by 2012. The after bay known as the Lagoon is unaffected by the Stripe bass and still has a population of giant FLMB, trout, shad and crappie. The lagoon is a small deep electric boat only lake. few bass anglers are fishing regularly except Butch Brown who knows every pebble in this lake.

Casitas,

1. The trout plants stop in 2010 and the high pressure by guides looking for trophy bass after Castiac crashed increases. 

2. Quagga mussels are discovered in SoCal lakes and Casitas fearing infestation stops planting crawdads, the State stopped planting trout. By 2015 the giant FLMB population starts to crash and 2016 the no more giant bass 15+ lbs will be caught to this date.

3. The drought starts and Casitas doesn’t receive any Ventura Rivers water run off for fear of invasive species entering the lake and local environmental pressure. 2019 the lake drops 60’ and remains at 30% pool to this day.

Tom

You are a huge wealth of information. Thanks for sharing all the time. 

[Woody B]

I'm certainly not a big bass expert, or any kind of bass expert but I believe the big lure big bass thing is mostly a myth.  (when speaking of artificial lures)   I believe water clarity to be very important in choosing lure size and presentation for any size bass, but especially when targeting big ones.   

[Bankbeater]

There have been years here when the bass have keyed in on larger baits.  This usually happens in the fall.  They would ignore a 1/4 size moving bait, but go after a larger 1/2 or 3/4 ounce version.  Larger trailers and fuller skirts on jigs would get bites over the standard size.  This was for all bass not just the large ones.  I'm not sure if this is because of the forage being larger or some other reason.

[Catt]

In the hands of an experienced swimbait fisherman a 8-10" swimbait is deadly. Not so much in the hands of a inexperienced angler.

 

In the hands of an experienced Jig fisherman a Jig-n-Craw is deadly. Not so much in the hands of an inexperienced angler.

 

Throw what you have confidence in!

 

I would be willing to bet Tom @WRB caught those big bass on a Jig-n-Chunk because he has total confidence in that jig.

[AlabamaSpothunter]

19 hours ago, WRB said:

Main lake Castiac suffered from a perfect storm of negative events.

1. Basin Magazine offers $1,000,000 reward for new world record LMB in around 1990. This brought tremendous fishing pressure on both Castaic and Casitas for several years.

2. 1995 Castaic lake draw 150’ down to repair the fore bay lake Elderberry dam. Elderberry receives water from lake Pyramid, both lakes have big stripe bass populations to 40 lbs. The draw down created too much pressure on the Elderberry dam during repairs and fearing the dam failure.

All the Elderberry water, including the Stripe bass was released into Castaic. The result was devastating to the trout population from the big Stripers depleting a prime food source for the big FLMB population already under attack by bounty hunters.

3. The DFG gets sued for planting non-native hatchery Rainbow trout in SoCal lakes and streams haulting the weekly trout plants in 2010.

The lake Castiac main lake stops producing giant FLMB by 2012. The after bay known as the Lagoon is unaffected by the Stripe bass and still has a population of giant FLMB, trout, shad and crappie. The lagoon is a small deep electric boat only lake. few bass anglers are fishing regularly except Butch Brown who knows every pebble in this lake.

Casitas,

1. The trout plants stop in 2010 and the high pressure by guides looking for trophy bass after Castiac crashed increases. 

2. Quagga mussels are discovered in SoCal lakes and Casitas fearing infestation stops planting crawdads, the State stopped planting trout. By 2015 the giant FLMB population starts to crash and 2016 the no more giant bass 15+ lbs will be caught to this date.

3. The drought starts and Casitas doesn’t receive any Ventura Rivers water run off for fear of invasive species entering the lake and local environmental pressure. 2019 the lake drops 60’ and remains at 30% pool to this day.

Tom

Amazing post, and very sad.  

 

I have started to really, really hate Stripe Bass the more I learn about their effect on fisheries.

 

What a cluster all that was, the State seems responsible for destroying 75% of those once amazing fisheries.   

3 hours ago, Catt said:

In the hands of an experienced swimbait fisherman a 8-10" swimbait is deadly. Not so much in the hands of a inexperienced angler.

 

In the hands of an experienced Jig fisherman a Jig-n-Craw is deadly. Not so much in the hands of an inexperienced angler.

 

Throw what you have confidence in!

 

I would be willing to bet Tom @WRB caught those big bass on a Jig-n-Chunk because he has total confidence in that jig.

My Bass mentor who fished a lifetime like WRB for trophy caliber Bass always said a Hair Jig with real pork trailers was the best big Bass bait you could throw.

 

Ironically enough I hardly ever throw a jig, let alone a hair one with real pork.

[WRB]

Size matters. The 2 lakes Castaic and Casitas are about 40 miles apart, Casitas is close to the Ocean near Ventura, Castiac inland north of the San Fernando Valley.

2 very different climate, cool vs hot.

Both were excellent trout swimbait lakes, Casitas bass preferred soft 8” deeper and slower lures where Castiac main lake faster jointed 10” lures.

Jigs Casitas Bass preferred 4” trailers, Castiac 2 1/2 to 3” trailers, smaller crawdads in Castiac.

Details are important it’s not a 1 size fits all.

Tom

[GreenPig]

Depends. 

[LrgmouthShad]

2 hours ago, WRB said:

Size matters. The 2 lakes Castaic and Casitas are about 40 miles apart, Casitas is close to the Ocean near Ventura, Castiac inland north of the San Fernando Valley.

2 very different climate, cool vs hot.

Both were excellent trout swimbait lakes, Casitas bass preferred soft 8” deeper and slower lures where Castiac main lake faster jointed 10” lures.

Jigs Casitas Bass preferred 4” trailers, Castiac 2 1/2 to 3” trailers, smaller crawdads in Castiac.

Details are important it’s not a 1 size fits all.

Tom

You are a wealth of information sir

[Craigholland]

5 hours ago, AlabamaSpothunter said:

Amazing post, and very sad.  

 

I have started to really, really hate Stripe Bass the more I learn about their effect on fisheries.

 

What a cluster all that was, the State seems responsible for destroying 75% of those once amazing fisheries.   

My Bass mentor who fished a lifetime like WRB for trophy caliber Bass always said a Hair Jig with real pork trailers was the best big Bass bait you could throw.

 

Ironically enough I hardly ever throw a jig, let alone a hair one with real pork.

Anyone have a pic of a hair jig w trailer? Not sure I've seen one before.

[AlabamaSpothunter]

4 minutes ago, Craigholland said:

Anyone have a pic of a hair jig w trailer? Not sure I've seen one before.

Something like this, and then a real critical piece I'm told is using actual pork trailers.   Big Daddy Baits Hair Jigs - Tackle Warehouse

[WRB]

22 minutes ago, AlabamaSpothunter said:

Something like this, and then a real critical piece I'm told is using actual pork trailers.   Big Daddy Baits Hair Jigs - Tackle Warehouse

Take a look at DTH Punisher Hair Jigs, casting, 3/8 & 1/2 oz PBJ with Uncle Josh #11 pork frog in crawdad brown.

Tom

[softwateronly]

  

23 minutes ago, WRB said:

Take a look at DTH Punisher Hair Jigs, casting, 3/8 & 1/2 oz PBJ with Uncle Josh #11 pork frog in crawdad brown.

Tom

 

 

50 minutes ago, Craigholland said:

Anyone have a pic of a hair jig w trailer? Not sure I've seen one before.

 

The punisher hair jigs have become a favorite thanks to @WRB and @A-Jay.  

Blue craw, PB&J, and hot mustard catch for me.

 

When it comes to big baits, moonless nights seems to be the best time for me to consistently upsize.

 

scott

[A-Jay]

1 hour ago, Craigholland said:

Anyone have a pic of a hair jig w trailer? Not sure I've seen one before.

A-Jay

[Team9nine]

1 hour ago, Craigholland said:

Anyone have a pic of a hair jig w trailer? Not sure I've seen one before.

You can also go finesse with your hair setup like this 1/8 oz. ‘Midwest Finesse’ version I’ve been throwing for over a dozen years. About half the time I don’t even use a trailer with these little jigs.

 

[Mbirdsley]

Match the hatch.  I tend to use smaller lures in the spring as the bait fish are generally younger and smaller in the spring.  As things warm up I get bigger as the bait fish grow.  Fall is basically as big as the bait fish grow. I would throw bigger lures even with cooler water temp.

 

by winter most baitfish have spawned and a lot of the older ones die.  The next spring the cycle continues. 

[Deleted account]

On 9/5/2022 at 2:35 AM, Mbirdsley said:

Match the hatch.  I tend to use smaller lures in the spring as the bait fish are generally younger and smaller in the spring.  As things warm up I get bigger as the bait fish grow.  Fall is basically as big as the bait fish grow. I would throw bigger lures even with cooler water temp.

 

by winter most baitfish have spawned and a lot of the older ones die.  The next spring the cycle continues. 

Depends on the body of water and the distribution of forage, the opposite can be true, and often is in some places.