Captain Phil Posted August 31, 2022 Posted August 31, 2022 A neighbor of mine has a 2012 Chevrolet Volt with 70,000 miles showing on the odometer. He took it to our local Chevy dealer and was told he needed a new battery. The quote was $29,842 including $1,700 to install it. He didn't have to buy gas for ten years, now he owns a ten year old car that is basically worthless. My wife drives a ten year old Toyota Avalon that gets about 30 miles per gallon. If she drives the same amount at an average of $3.50 a gallon, she pays about $8,000 for gas. Her Avalon is currently worth about $10K and she will most likely drive it for the rest of her life. 6 1
NavyToad Posted August 31, 2022 Posted August 31, 2022 IMO we’re 100 years away from whatever it is they’re trying to achieve. That’s IF it’s achievable. 8
Global Moderator TnRiver46 Posted August 31, 2022 Global Moderator Posted August 31, 2022 This was always the dilemma with golf carts 20 years ago. Replacing 6 batteries was about the cost of a gas golf cart I say we should go back to horses, I just have to figure out how to haul 3 skunks, two coons and half a dozen rats on horseback 10
Super User J Francho Posted August 31, 2022 Super User Posted August 31, 2022 4 minutes ago, TnRiver46 said: This was always the dilemma with golf carts 20 years ago. Replacing 6 batteries was about the cost of a gas golf cart I say we should go back to horses, I just have to figure out how to haul 3 skunks, two coons and half a dozen rats on horseback 9
Super User Deleted account Posted August 31, 2022 Super User Posted August 31, 2022 42 minutes ago, NavyToad said: IMO we’re 100 years away from whatever it is they’re trying to achieve. That’s IF it’s achievable. Meet George Jetson, Jane his wife... You know we went from the Wright brothers to the moon in about 70 years, yes?... 1
Super User T-Billy Posted August 31, 2022 Super User Posted August 31, 2022 A hybrid caught fire locally a few days ago. The fireman were hiding behind the firetruck while the batteries exploded throwing schrapnel in every direction. 2
DaubsNU1 Posted August 31, 2022 Posted August 31, 2022 My Dad still owns the 1962 Chevy Impala he took delivery of on his 21st birthday...it has 80k miles and is still going strong. I'm restoring a 1972 Chevy K-20...will likely never wear out. My daily driver is a 2005 Honda Accord, nicknamed "Taco." it's got just over 100k miles to date. Picked up this car used from an elder gentlemen, it had 48k. My Honda guy said the following, "those years of Accords are very solid...keep up on maintenance, change fluids, etc...you will get sick of driving it. Trust me on this one..." I have no doubt electric cars are going to get better and better. But right now, no way I'm trading in my old, reliable gas and diesel vehicles for something battery powered. 3
Super User GreenPig Posted August 31, 2022 Super User Posted August 31, 2022 If you'd quit using logic, it makes perfect sense to go EV. 4 8 1
Super User Tennessee Boy Posted August 31, 2022 Super User Posted August 31, 2022 1 hour ago, Captain Phil said: A neighbor of mine has a 2012 Chevrolet Volt with 70,000 miles showing on the odometer. He took it to our local Chevy dealer and was told he needed a new battery. The quote was $29,842 including $1,700 to install it. Your neighbor has an early version of a car with a terrible reputation made by a company that had no idea how to build an electric car. Just because General Motors and his dealer are trying to rip him off doesn't mean the technology doesn't make since. Here's a company that will sell him a replacement for $10K. https://www.greentecauto.com/hybrid-battery/chevrolet/volt/chevrolet-volt-battery According to Wikipedia the 2011/2012 Volt's battery was 16 kWh. You can buy a top of the line Battle Born lithium batteries for your boat for about 75 cents per Wh. Your neighbors experience says more about General Motors than it does about electric cars. 2
volzfan59 Posted August 31, 2022 Posted August 31, 2022 I don't see my wife and I ever owning an electric vehicle. I have no use for them. 4
Woody B Posted August 31, 2022 Posted August 31, 2022 FWIW I'm a former GM World Class Tech. I was also Volt certified. Volt's have an 8 year 100,000 mile warranty on the hybrid stuff. The way I see it the price of the car divided by 8 is what it cost per year to drive it. (at least $5K per year) The only time the "math" even comes close to working out on EV's in when someone else is paying for the charging. Even if there was 0 charging cost, and 0 gas cost it's still pretty expensive in the long run. However, Volts are a hybrid, not a pure electric car, so they use gas too. IF (big if) someone managed to always stay within their battery range between charges the engine will still occasionally start for what's called "maintenance mode". It will burn some gas, and still require oil changes and other maintenance. EV's (and hybrids) are simply a feel good myth. Much like wind and solar power. 12 1
NavyToad Posted August 31, 2022 Posted August 31, 2022 1 hour ago, Deleted account said: Meet George Jetson, Jane his wife... You know we went from the Wright brothers to the moon in about 70 years, yes?... So?
VolFan Posted September 1, 2022 Posted September 1, 2022 There’s a lot of anecdotes and just plain inaccurate info in here so far…keep it going! Who hates recycling? 1
Super User slonezp Posted September 1, 2022 Super User Posted September 1, 2022 4 hours ago, TnRiver46 said: This was always the dilemma with golf carts 20 years ago. Replacing 6 batteries was about the cost of a gas golf cart I say we should go back to horses, I just have to figure out how to haul 3 skunks, two coons and half a dozen rats on horseback They have legs. Let them walk themselves 2
Big Rick Posted September 1, 2022 Posted September 1, 2022 California passed legislation banning the sale of gas powered cars effective 2035. This morning California issued a warning not to charge your electric car to try to prevent blackouts. Interesting. 3 4
Super User DitchPanda Posted September 1, 2022 Super User Posted September 1, 2022 2 hours ago, Woody B said: FWIW I'm a former GM World Class Tech. I was also Volt certified. Volt's have an 8 year 100,000 mile warranty on the hybrid stuff. The way I see it the price of the car divided by 8 is what it cost per year to drive it. (at least $5K per year) The only time the "math" even comes close to working out on EV's in when someone else is paying for the charging. Even if there was 0 charging cost, and 0 gas cost it's still pretty expensive in the long run. However, Volts are a hybrid, not a pure electric car, so they use gas too. IF (big if) someone managed to always stay within their battery range between charges the engine will still occasionally start for what's called "maintenance mode". It will burn some gas, and still require oil changes and other maintenance. EV's (and hybrids) are simply a feel good myth. Much like wind and solar power. I'm confused...wind and solar power are myths? Meaning they aren't real? 1
Super User slonezp Posted September 1, 2022 Super User Posted September 1, 2022 2 minutes ago, DitchPanda said: I'm confused...wind and solar power are myths? Meaning they aren't real? They are not viable at this stage in the game. 4
Super User MN Fisher Posted September 1, 2022 Super User Posted September 1, 2022 Just now, DitchPanda said: I'm confused...wind and solar power are myths? Meaning they aren't real? Oh they're real - just that because of the lack of land to put up monstrous amounts of wind/solar farms, they're not going to make up the difference when all the coal/gal/oil power plants shut down. Also, the efficiency of them leaves much to be desired. Two things need to be done to solve the 'energy crisis' we're looking at down the road. 1: Bring back nukes - nuclear plants are the most efficient and there ARE ways to deal with the waste if we can get the tree-huggers to actually think. 2: Update the power grid - what we have now is NOT designed to handle the increase in electrical transmission that bringing electric vehicles online in massive numbers like 'they' want. Brown-outs, blown transformers and such would be the norm rather than the exception if the grid isn't modernized. 5 1
schplurg Posted September 1, 2022 Posted September 1, 2022 Ya and the horseless carriage will never catch on either. Oil will always be in large supply, right? It's only going to get more expensive. https://getoptiwatt.com/blog/how-long-will-your-tesla-battery-really-last Quote A study on 286 Tesla Model owners across the world revealed that Tesla vehicles lose just 5% of their capacity in the first 50,000 miles. Additionally, these vehicles will exceed 150,000 miles of driving before losing 10% of their initial battery life. The claim is that Tesla batteries can go between 300,000 and 500,000 miles. The motors last even longer and the cars hold their value much better than other cars. Sure a few cars have caught fire here and there. Good thing that never happens with gas engines! I mean how could it? My Dad is the same way though. "Electric cars never happen bla bla bla". Everything he claims about them is wrong. Wave of the future folks. 2 1
Super User slonezp Posted September 1, 2022 Super User Posted September 1, 2022 40 minutes ago, schplurg said: Ya and the horseless carriage will never catch on either. Oil will always be in large supply, right? It's only going to get more expensive. https://getoptiwatt.com/blog/how-long-will-your-tesla-battery-really-last The claim is that Tesla batteries can go between 300,000 and 500,000 miles. The motors last even longer and the cars hold their value much better than other cars. Sure a few cars have caught fire here and there. Good thing that never happens with gas engines! I mean how could it? My Dad is the same way though. "Electric cars never happen bla bla bla". Everything he claims about them is wrong. Wave of the future folks. They very well be the wave of the future. The technology is not here at this time. 3
Deephaven Posted September 1, 2022 Posted September 1, 2022 6 hours ago, Captain Phil said: A neighbor of mine has a 2012 Chevrolet Volt with 70,000 miles showing on the odometer. He took it to our local Chevy dealer and was told he needed a new battery. The quote was $29,842 including $1,700 to install it. He didn't have to buy gas for ten years, now he owns a ten year old car that is basically worthless. My wife drives a ten year old Toyota Avalon that gets about 30 miles per gallon. If she drives the same amount at an average of $3.50 a gallon, she pays about $8,000 for gas. Her Avalon is currently worth about $10K and she will most likely drive it for the rest of her life. Your "neighbor" confused the 1700 install with tax. The battery is normally sold as a refurb for $8800. Lots of info on the internet to try to sink EV's. That car is a piece of crap and an abomination, but the customer copy above was made for a message not a customer.
throttleplate Posted September 1, 2022 Posted September 1, 2022 3 hours ago, schplurg said: Ya and the horseless carriage will never catch on either. Oil will always be in large supply, right? It's only going to get more expensive. https://getoptiwatt.com/blog/how-long-will-your-tesla-battery-really-last The claim is that Tesla batteries can go between 300,000 and 500,000 miles. The motors last even longer and the cars hold their value much better than other cars. Sure a few cars have caught fire here and there. Good thing that never happens with gas engines! I mean how could it? My Dad is the same way though. "Electric cars never happen bla bla bla". Everything he claims about them is wrong. Wave of the future folks. Well tesla is now putting cheaper less range batteries in their cheaper cars. https://www.notebookcheck.net/Tesla-now-uses-cheaper-batteries-in-half-of-its-new-cars.615308.0.html
Super User Tennessee Boy Posted September 1, 2022 Super User Posted September 1, 2022 Ford has a $61 billion dollar market cap GM has a $55 billion dollar market cap Tesla has a $863 billion dollar market cap Rivian has a $28 billion dollar market cap The world is changing my friends.
Woody B Posted September 1, 2022 Posted September 1, 2022 9 hours ago, DitchPanda said: I'm confused...wind and solar power are myths? Meaning they aren't real? The cost of manufacturing the solar panels and wind mills is high. They have a relatively short life span, and the cost of disposal is high. The only reason their in use is due to taxpayer subsidies. Hydro electric is actually more cost efficient than wind or solar, but it's less efficient than pretty much any other source. I'm a fan of hydro since most of the lakes I fish on were built for it. 1
Super User DogBone_384 Posted September 1, 2022 Super User Posted September 1, 2022 13 hours ago, Woody B said: EV's (and hybrids) are simply a feel good myth. Much like wind and solar power. Solar power's a great myth. We put solar on our home in 2017 and go 7 months a year w/o an electric bill and make enough in SREC payouts to cover our gas & cable for the year. As far as EV's, to each their own. 4
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