Spotted Bass, good or bad?

[bulldog1935]

Again, largemouth and spotted bass do not interbreed. 

I would also be really surprised if competition for forage was the issue between spotted bass and largemouth populations. 

If white bass are present, they're the fish that deplete the forage base for other species, and also prey on black bass fingerlings. 

The last dumb move TPWD made was stocking white bass in the upper Guadalupe at Ingram - only 10 years ago.  They've spread all over the upper river, resulting in a noted decrease in endemic bass, right up to boundary of the Johnson Creek A-strain.  

Eat them - impossible to over-fish. 

[Drew03cmc]

19 hours ago, AlabamaSpothunter said:

1000%.    If you follow the Mountain Lion sighting in some of these eastern states where their DNRs refuse to acknowledge an easily variable account of a Lion sighting, and then look into what the DNR has to gain by refusing such clear evidence, you realize how corrupt these state government organizations are....big shocker.

 

These DNRs won't admit a single Lion sighting because then they are generally required to use resources to protect, establish, and sustain a population.      It's all about the money, it really is. 

 

Ultimately like the fish biologist on my local lake says, the angler is the one with his hand on the pulse of the fishery, not a scientist, not a bureaucrat, but those actually fishing.    Nobody cares more about these fish than us, certainly not a state government agency. 

https://listen.stitcher.com/yvap/?af_dp=stitcher://episode/80690278&af_web_dp=https://www.stitcher.com/episode/80690278&deep_link_value=stitcher://episode/80690278

 

Listen to Steve Sammons, biologist at Auburn, talk about the Alabama Bass.

[Bankc]

2 hours ago, bulldog1935 said:

Again, largemouth and spotted bass do not interbreed. 

I would also be really surprised if competition for forage was the issue between spotted bass and largemouth populations. 

If white bass are present, they're the fish that deplete the forage base for other species, and also prey on black bass fingerlings. 

Yeah, I don't believe that's correct.  In some water systems, they won't interbreed because they typically spawn at different depths.  However, in water systems where there aren't adequate spawning sites for both species, they will share and interbreed freely, and produce viable offspring.  Hence why most of the black bass on my local lakes are hybridized, or whatever you want to call it.  

 

Here's a little story about that:

https://www.ncwildlife.org/Connect-With-Us/Blog/the-spotted-bass-state-record-that-wasnt

 

Though you're right about white bass.  And unfortunately, since they're our state fish in Oklahoma, they tend to stock them in every lake we have.  Which is a shame, because all of our lakes are man-made, and quite a few are isolated from the watershed (no inlets or outlets other than pipes).  So they could have been controlled, if anybody wanted to.

 

 

[roadwarrior]

... you're right about white bass.  And unfortunately, since they're our state fish in Oklahoma...

 

Gosh, that's awful.  How did that happen?

 

                                           

[AlabamaSpothunter]

2 hours ago, Drew03cmc said:

https://listen.stitcher.com/yvap/?af_dp=stitcher://episode/80690278&af_web_dp=https://www.stitcher.com/episode/80690278&deep_link_value=stitcher://episode/80690278

 

Listen to Steve Sammons, biologist at Auburn, talk about the Alabama Bass.

Will do, I'm an Auburn grad too

[Woody B]

Bankc beat me to the NC state record that was actually a LM/Spot hybrid.  I'm pretty sure the bass I pictured in the first post of this thread is a LM/Spot hybrid.   Due to silt Lake Norman has limited spawning areas.   

 

I've often wondered what impact stocking other species have on Black Bass populations, and fishing.  Lake Norman used to be DD heaven, at least for my area, but it was also well stocked with Stripers.  I caught a 16 pound Striper there on a crank bait when I was a kid.   

 

I sold my boat and quit fishing in 1992 due to "life".   I had never heard of a Spotted Bass.  I had also never heard of a White Perch, or caught a Catfish while bass fishing.   I don't know NCs or SCs stance on White Perch (actually a true bass cousin to Stripers....Silver Bass)  I believe TN considers White Perch to be invasive.  However others have said in this thread that TN considers everything invasive if they're money to be made.    

 

Since starting back fishing in December 2021 I've caught multiple White Perch, a few Crappie(not usual 30 years ago) and a BUNCH of Catfish.   I'd never caught a Catfish while bass fishing until This year.   I caught a 50+ Flathead on a square bill.  My Wife also caught a 21 pound Blue or Channel (I forget which is which).  We've caught multiple smaller cats too.   

 

 

According to NC there were no Spotted bass in Lake Norman before 2000 ish.  I wonder if there really weren't any or if we/them just didn't know of acknowledge the difference.   I caught the first bass in my new boat on December 18 on Moss Lake NC.   The water temp was 50ish, but it fought like heck.  My previous colder water Large Mouth catches were like reeling in a block of ice.   I thought it's mouth was small, but didn't learn about Spotted or Alabama bass until a few days later.    

 

 

FWIW on the Catawba river chain I've fished Lake Wylie (the most) Lake Norman(a few times) Lake Rhodhiss (once) and Lake James (once).   I've caught Largemouth and Spots in Wylie and Norman.  More Spots, less LM in Norman compared to Wylie.   I caught Spots only in Rhodhiss.   In Lake James I caught 3 Largemouth and 3 Smallmouth.   

 

 

Moss Lake (Shelby NC, owned by the City of Kings Mountain) Is closest to my house.  I caught a bunch of spot and a few Largemouth there back in the Winter.  I don't go there much now.  It's a 1500 acre lake with a BUNCH of fishing pressure.  The last 3 times I went there all of the bass I caught had multiple previous hook holes in their mouths.   They stock Moss fairly heavy with Hybrid/Bodie bass (Striper/White bass hybrid).  I've caught a couple of them this year while bass fishing.   I wonder what their effect in on Black Bass populations.   Moss Lake has a pretty big algae bloom going on now too.   

 

 

[fishingram24]

I would rather catch a spotted bass than any other type but we just don't have that many in the waters I fish regularly. I've caught several near 5 pounds in my trips to central Al. over the years and believe me they are a blast and have not seen any reduction in the numbers of LM we catch either. Even a small one has an attitude. 

[AlabamaSpothunter]

5 minutes ago, fishingram24 said:

I would rather catch a spotted bass than any other type but we just don't have that many in the waters I fish regularly. I've caught several near 5 pounds in my trips to central Al. over the years and believe me they are a blast and have not seen any reduction in the numbers of LM we catch either. Even a small one has an attitude. 

Amen brother, I think I said earlier in this thread that anybody who thinks they are trash should come to where they are native, and you can catch 5-7lb trophies.....aka Lay Lake, and Smith Lake are perhaps the two best.     

 

Once I caught my first 6lb Alabama Bass I knew they were the fish I'd always have at the top of my list.  

 

 

[Alex from GA]

Like soflabasser said there are a bunch of species of bass in GA and I try to catch a Bass Slam each year.  I've gone to places where I've caught a species one year and a couple of years later they're hybrids.  Alabamas are always the culprit.  I fish Lake Lanier several times a week and usually catch 3 or 4 times the amount of Alabama Bass compared to LM when in the old days my friends, who have fished here since the lake was impounded,  say they rarely caught anything but LM.  Talking about white bass; I lived in CA for most of my life and there was only 1 lake where white bass were stocked and you couldn't put a live one in your livewell.  If you wanted to keep one we pulled the gills out.  Lake Nacimiento is the lake.

[AlabamaSpothunter]

17 minutes ago, Alex from GA said:

Like soflabasser said there are a bunch of species of bass in GA and I try to catch a Bass Slam each year.  I've gone to places where I've caught a species one year and a couple of years later they're hybrids.  Alabamas are always the culprit.  I fish Lake Lanier several times a week and usually catch 3 or 4 times the amount of Alabama Bass compared to LM when in the old days my friends, who have fished here since the lake was impounded,  say they rarely caught anything but LM.  Talking about white bass; I lived in CA for most of my life and there was only 1 lake where white bass were stocked and you couldn't put a live one in your livewell.  If you wanted to keep one we pulled the gills out.  Lake Nacimiento is the lake.

I was born in the 80s, my entire life Lake Lanier has been known as one of the world's greatest Spotted Bass fisheries, long before the Alabama Bass was recognized.    Never once have I heard of that lake being referred to as a LGM lake.   It's not a great lake for LGM based on depth, topography, water clarity, and lack of abundant structure.     It would be like calling Smith Lake in Alabama a once thriving LGM lake.     It's deep, clear, cold, lacks structure....always has, always will.   Without the Alabama Bass, major tournament circuits would never fish it.     Lanier is the same way. 

 

That link above from the Auburn professor explains quite nicely why your friend talks about the lake the way he does when it was first impounded.   There is an actual phenomenon that occurs in newly flooded impoundments......and for about 10 years, LGMs thrive, and continue to grow in size and numbers, however after that first decade, silt and decay of the original flooded structure has occurred, the lake is not getting all those decomposing nutrients, the lake clears up, the lake loses the decayed structure......bam, you now longer have a great LGM lake because the actual lake itself doesn't lend itself to being a good one....has nothing to do with the fish themselves.   At the same time, you have a species of Bass that thrives in those conditions, and now the lake has trophy class fishing again....albeit not what apparently some Bass purists want.     

 

 

 

[WRB]

Southern Spotted bass now being called Alabama Spotted bass date back we’ll over 75 years. 

The McClane’s New Stand Fishing Encyclopedia, 1965 details the Alabama Spotted bass under the Black Bass family.

Lake Perris in California opened in 1973 and set a world record Spotted bass in 1977 @ 9 lbs 4 oz. Today no Spotted bass are known to exist in lake Perris do to Eastern Florida Bluegill introduction wiped out the spawn and fry.

 

Tom 

[GReb]

I have a hard time believing that spots and lmb negatively correlate. If anything is competing with our lmb for forage it’s crappie and gar. However there is no shortage of Shad or baitfish in our system. 
 

What’s affecting lmb is fishermen. 

[Bankc]

On 8/23/2022 at 10:25 AM, roadwarrior said:

... you're right about white bass.  And unfortunately, since they're our state fish in Oklahoma...

 

Gosh, that's awful.  How did that happen?

 

                                           

We were the 46th state admitted to the Union, so by then all of the good fish were taken.  It was either that or the Gaspergou.  

[flatcreek]

Lake Chatuge Ga/NC border lake was once 2/3 smallmouth and 1/3 largemouth until spotted bass were illegally stocked and as a result took over the lake. Every now and then a smallmouth is caught usually on the Ga side.Largemouth can still be caught but not nearly as plentiful as they were before the Spots were stocked. Chatuge is now known predominantly as a Spotted bass lake.

[AlabamaSpothunter]

20 minutes ago, GReb said:

I have a hard time believing that spots and lmb negatively correlate. If anything is competing with our lmb for forage it’s crappie and gar. However there is no shortage of Shad or baitfish in our system. 
 

What’s affecting lmb is fishermen. 

I took a 15 year hiatus from harcore Bass fishing, and now that I've started back....it's staggering the amount of fisherman vs a decade and a half ago.    

 

I thought we reached peak Bass back then, I had no idea this sport would practically double in that span.    The amounts of baits, high end rod and reel makers, whole aisles full of $50 dollar line, I mean nobody wants to talk about fishing pressure because we all add to that fact.   

 

I have no doubt in some places the Alabama Bass is outcompeting native species, but this problem especially on major impounded reservoirs is significantly deeper than just blaming it on the Alabama Bass.    The podcast posted does quite a good job explaining some of these other things. 

[soflabasser]

1 hour ago, flatcreek said:

Lake Chatuge Ga/NC border lake was once 2/3 smallmouth and 1/3 largemouth until spotted bass were illegally stocked and as a result took over the lake. Every now and then a smallmouth is caught usually on the Ga side.Largemouth can still be caught but not nearly as plentiful as they were before the Spots were stocked. Chatuge is now known predominantly as a Spotted bass lake.

The Alabama spotted bass have caused much damage to many native black bass populations, that is fact. From what I researched these Alabama spotted bass were illegally released into Georgia waters by fishermen that wanted easy to catch bass. These people do not care about the rare native species of black bass in Georgia, so of course they will defend the invasive populations of Alabama spotted bass in Georgia.

21 hours ago, Alex from GA said:

Like soflabasser said there are a bunch of species of bass in GA and I try to catch a Bass Slam each year.  I've gone to places where I've caught a species one year and a couple of years later they're hybrids.  Alabamas are always the culprit.  I fish Lake Lanier several times a week and usually catch 3 or 4 times the amount of Alabama Bass compared to LM when in the old days my friends, who have fished here since the lake was impounded,  say they rarely caught anything but LM.  

Everyone I know that enjoys catching rare species of black bass in Georgia does not like what the invasive Alabama spotted bass have done to native black bass populations. Many keep the Alabama spotted bass to eat, or give away to others that want them to help the native black bass population, this is a good thing.

[Drew03cmc]

2 hours ago, GReb said:

I have a hard time believing that spots and lmb negatively correlate. If anything is competing with our lmb for forage it’s crappie and gar. However there is no shortage of Shad or baitfish in our system. 
 

What’s affecting lmb is fishermen. 

You can have a hard time believing it, but I gave you half of a 4 hour discussion, 2 hours of it pertaining to hybridization and Alabama Bass specifically. If you choose to put your head in the sand and not listen to a tenured professor and biologist who is focused on river bass in the southeast, that's on you. He details how they impact other, native species and the dangers they are concerned about as they continue to be spread.