Help with Daiwa Fuego baitcaster backlash?

[Nick Boehm]

I’m using a Daiwa Fuego with Braid. My Braid is tied to a fluoro leader with a double uni knot. I get backlash almost every time I cast because the Union between the braid and leader seem to briefly snag on my guides. Am I doing something wrong?

[MN Fisher]

Are you using heavier line...30#+ braid with 12#+ FC?

 

Double-Uni gets bulky with heavier lines - need to go with a slimmer knot for the leader. FG, Albright, Alberto are strong/slim knots.

 

I tie on 15# AbrazX to 50# 832 on my Heavy rig when I use a leader - FG is my leader knot of choice - and I don't have the 'catching' issue on the guides or even the reel aperture....and it's a Fuego-CT reel.

[PhishLI]

13 minutes ago, Nick Boehm said:

Am I doing something wrong?

Yes. You're not including all of the details about your setup, and I mean all. We can dig them out of you slowly, painfully, reply after reply, and in between go off on tangents about dog grooming and auto repair, or you can just give us the juice in full detail right up front and skip the messes.

 

Rod and it's ratings. Model # with action and power.

The weight of the baits you are trying to cast with it.

The reel's settings. Spool tension and braking.

[PressuredFishing]

You have 3 options

1. Shorter leader outside of final eye

2. Switch lines altogether

3. Learn a smaller knot.

 

This is completely normal with long leaders and bigger easier to tie knots, this is why I don't use braid with leaders.

[Nick Boehm]

MH 7’ Casting Rod

 

Was casting everything from Texas rig to frog to whacky rig. Spool tension was set just tight enough to drop bait to the water smoothly when pressing the trigger. Magnets were set so spool didn’t move much once dropped Kure hit the water. Leader was about 36” of Flouro 15lb. 
 

I was more or less wondering if it’s common for a double Uni to snag on guides like that or if my leader was too long

4 minutes ago, PressuredFishing said:

You have 3 options

1. Shorter leader outside of final eye

2. Switch lines altogether

3. Learn a smaller knot.

 

This is completely normal with long leaders and bigger easier to tie knots, this is why I don't use braid with leaders.

Can you recommend a better knot? I wasn’t looking for simple that just seemed to be what most use. 

10 minutes ago, MN Fisher said:

Are you using heavier line...30#+ braid with 12#+ FC?

 

Double-Uni gets bulky with heavier lines - need to go with a slimmer knot for the leader. FG, Albright, Alberto are strong/slim knots.

 

I tie on 15# AbrazX to 50# 832 on my Heavy rig when I use a leader - FG is my leader knot of choice - and I don't have the 'catching' issue on the guides or even the reel aperture....and it's a Fuego-CT reel.

I had 20lb braid 20lb Fluro. It’s what I had left from surf fishing this summer. 

[MN Fisher]

2 minutes ago, Nick Boehm said:

I had 20lb braid 20lb Fluro. It’s what I had left from surf fishing this summer. 

Ya - that combo is gonna make a larger knot and cause issues. I'd learn one of the slimmer knots...should take care of the issue.

 

3 minutes ago, Nick Boehm said:

Leader was about 36” of Flouro 15lb. 

I'm running 6'-8' leaders - so the longer ones actually end up inside the reel just before a cast.

[PhishLI]

Were you having this issue before you tied on a leader, or was it smooth sailing and backlash free?

17 minutes ago, Nick Boehm said:

I was more or less wondering if it’s common for a double Uni to snag on guides like that or if my leader was too long

Does your nameless rod have micro guides?

[Nick Boehm]

9 minutes ago, PhishLI said:

Were you having this issue before you tied on a leader, or was it smooth sailing and backlash free?

Does your nameless rod have micro guides?

No micro guides. I haven’t fished with a bait caster in about 12 years lol. Still learning. 

[bulldog1935]

Recently posted this photo on another thread - improved Allbright knot next to the smallest size K-frame guide on a 13Fishing casting rod - there are 2 smaller sizes microguides on the rod, which will pass the knot, but I still use a 2' leader, so I don't have to pass the knot. 

 

Some other rods with larger guides, and I use longer leaders, out to 10' on surf rods. 

I've been rolling these knots for 45 years of fly fishing, so they're second nature to me. 

I always wet the knot with a drop of pink-label Zap CA+ and shake off the excess, then spray it with the instant cure. 

I tie a perfection loop at the business end of the leader, and loop-on paper clip, micro-swivel, bite trace, or a complex rig. 

 

PE#1.2 X-braid (27-lb); 14-lb hard fluoro leader. 

 

 

 

here's the post that may help you analyze the cause of your backlash. 

[PressuredFishing]

42 minutes ago, Nick Boehm said:

Can you recommend a better knot? I wasn’t looking for simple that just seemed to be what most use

I don't use it really but the FG knot is known for being close to the best option with longer leaders across this forum, heavier braid is usually better to prevent digging and overrun  and thinner diameter leaders flow through the guides as a knot better. size guides may also play a factor, micro guides are bad. Other knots listed above seem fine and can be easier to tie but not as small or strong as FG (I don't even use it because it's annoying to tie but is smaller and stronger for your problem). Spinning reels also run into this problem but  its more tolerable because backlash does not occur due to the reel design so it is tolerable, plus spinning eyes are USUALLY larger.

 

I cannot gaurentee this will solve your problem, and I am not going to be sugarcoating braid or the FG knot like others may do, but that means I'm also not a complete ideolog and will be offering a more objective point of view other than the sad but common

 

"your doing it wrong because it works for me And it's easy to tie knots and mine never break"

[T-Billy]

Try ditching the leader and fishing straight braid, and/or learn the Alberto. It's an easy knot with a little practice. I've never had one fail, and it's small and passes through micros just fine.

[PhishLI]

46 minutes ago, Nick Boehm said:

No micro guides. I haven’t fished with a bait caster in about 12 years lol. Still learning. 

Then perhaps you should ditch the leader for a quick minute and establish if this is simply rather normal growing pains with a new-to you bait caster. It may have nothing to do with a leader knot.

3 minutes ago, T-Billy said:

Try ditching the leader and fishing straight braid

You're physic. I knew it.

[bulldog1935]

Both good suggestions - I'm out of likes today or I'd like @PhishLI and @T-Billy posts just above. 

I'll get back to it later...

[Nick Boehm]

Thanks for the knowledge everyone. Upon further investigation on the web I think I had my spool tension set way too tight. Apparently the “lure drop” method is terrible for the Daiwa Magforce Z system. Seems most are setting the spool tension super light and then tweaking the magnet setting. I’ll try resetting the spool tension and practicing in the yard tomorrow. 

[T-Billy]

7 hours ago, PhishLI said:

You're physic. I knew it.

Psychic? Psycho? Sumthin like that!!! ?

[ska4fun]

If you really find the knot being the culprit for the backlashes go to the FG and alberto knots. Heavier braids call for the FG.

[Cbump]

12 hours ago, PressuredFishing said:

You have 3 options

1. Shorter leader outside of final eye

2. Switch lines altogether

3. Learn a smaller knot.

 

This is completely normal with long leaders and bigger easier to tie knots, this is why I don't use braid with leaders.

 

This is the answer and we don’t need every single detail of the setup to come to this conclusion. 100% this is the answer. 
 

Btw, Alberto knot. Don’t use micro guides.

[new2BC4bass]

11 hours ago, Nick Boehm said:

Thanks for the knowledge everyone. Upon further investigation on the web I think I had my spool tension set way too tight. Apparently the “lure drop” method is terrible for the Daiwa Magforce Z system. Seems most are setting the spool tension super light and then tweaking the magnet setting. I’ll try resetting the spool tension and practicing in the yard tomorrow. 

Too much spool tension was going to be in my reply until I got to this post.  Micro guides on your rod was going to be my first question.  You've taken care of the first and answered the second.  Next it's practice, practice.

 

The Uni Knot is my go to knot except for line to line connections.  I prefer the Alberto or even the Albright.  The FG knot seems like a lot more trouble than I am willing to take.  Besides, the only time I had a leader break (almost never use one) it didn't break at the line to line connection.  Or at the hook.  I'm thinking I didn't check my leader often enough for possible nicks or abrasion.

[PhishLI]

1 hour ago, Cbump said:

we don’t need every single detail of the setup

Yes, we do, new guy. There aren't that many details to begin with. A few simple sentences from an OP can save a whole bunch of good people from typing a whole bunch of paragraphs for nothing.

[Cbump]

14 minutes ago, PhishLI said:

Yes, we do, new guy. There aren't that many details to begin with. A few simple sentences from an OP can save a whole bunch of good people from typing a whole bunch of paragraphs for nothing.

 

Oh, we’re calling names now. Ok, old guy. Right after the Why we love this forum thread. 
We don’t have to type anything on the forum at all. If typing an extra paragraph is so annoying to you, feel free to log out.
This isn’t my first forum and I’m certainly not new to fishing, btw. 

 

The OP literally says his line to line knot is catching in the guide causing backlash. Literally, right there in the first post. And you want to know his rod and reel make, line type, what lure he uses, what he had for breakfast, etc. None of that makes a difference. Bottom line, for HIS setup, whatever It is, the line to line knot is not making It through the guides. 
 

So how does he fix that? Shorten leader to keep It out of the guides. Use smaller connection knot. Use smaller diameter lines. Don’t use a leader at all. 

[ironbjorn]

[PhishLI]

9 minutes ago, Cbump said:

Oh, we’re calling names now.

Breathe deeply. Exhale. You're new to "this" forum. You're a "new guy", new guy.

10 minutes ago, Cbump said:

If typing an extra paragraph is so annoying to you, feel free to log out.

Well, thanks for the invitation to log out. Please take the lead. I'm never annoyed. You seem annoyed that anyone would request as much info as possible, which would literally add up to a sentence or two. You're obviously against that, or are you some kind of word-efficiency cop? If you disagree, then we differ obviously.  He got good advice.

13 minutes ago, Cbump said:

The OP literally says his line to line knot is catching in the guide causing backlash.

As we've come to find out the OP is basically new to baitcasters and this particular reel. He has no idea what his actual problem is yet. He's making an assumption at this point. Until we know more, so are you.

 

16 minutes ago, Cbump said:

And you want to know his rod and reel make, line type, what lure he uses, what he had for breakfast

..and what type of underwear he has on. If he's overloading his rod with baits out of its range he's going to backlash. That's useful info, don't you think? Yes it is.

 

We're going to find out what's what, maybe. Sometimes people simply disappear after a question.

 

 

[Cbump]

I’m not assuming anything. I’m reading what was posted. Not trying to solve problems no one asked about. 
I don’t think it’s hard to hear/feel/see a line knot catching in a guide. 
The fix to that was posted above. 

[FrnkNsteen]

Why so hostile? I think PhishLI asked some reasonable questions.

 

Yes,.. The OP commented that it seemed his leader know was catching on the eyelets, but he also said he hadn't really used a baitcaster in 12 years and was asking for input.

 

I had many of the same questions as PhishLI. For instance,.. If trying to throw too light of lures on too heavy of a rod, the leader knot catching would be much more likely to cause issues than using a more balanced lure to rod setup.

 

Don't understand why someone would get so upset about another member asking reasonable questions.

[MickD]

15 hours ago, PhishLI said:

give us the juice in full detail right up front and skip the messes.

Plus guide ring sizes, not micros are they?

I have given up on braid on my baitcasters, don't see that there is a significant advantage, and the casting quality relative to good mono is very poor.   I'm now using Suffix Elite 14 pound test and am very pleased with all aspects of it.  

 

There is another possible problem with braid that I've encountered, and it is, I believe, that some braids absorb water making them heavy, and that causes them to get loose on the spool during aggressive casts and hanging up on the reel supports (rods between the side plates).  It doesn't happen in the yard with dry line, but surely does on the water with wet line.