Losing lures

[Cyclones]

Why do I keep losing lures on my baitcasters?  Lost a chatter bait on 1 caster last weekend and a swig jig on a different one.  Then today lost a crank bait on one.  All happens the same way….long cast out and then…SNAP… the line breaks.  Not sure if at the knot or elsewhere.  I’m not getting birds nests prior but that’s almost what it feels like when the line snaps.  2nd season on 30lbs braid.  What can I do to minimize this issue?

[Choporoz]

Check your line guides for nicks using a QTip.

[casts_by_fly]

What lure knot are you tying?

 

are you getting the braid dug into the spool such that when you cast the dog in is stopping the spool while the lure keeps going?

[TOXIC]

Straight braid or with a leader? What’s your setup and how are you casting?  Did both rods get the braid from the same spool? Putting everything you’ve got into the cast or loading the rod and letting it do the work.  How old is the braid? I would walk off a good portion of the line and reel it back on the spool.  As has been said, check your guides as well.  

[Cyclones]

3 minutes ago, casts_by_fly said:

What lure knot are you tying?

 

are you getting the braid dug into the spool such that when you cast the dog in is stopping the spool while the lure keeps going?

Improved clinch on 1 and palomar on 1.  It feels like a definite snag I think, like the 60mph to 0 instantly.  Could be dug in line.  What causes that?  Too much line on spool?  Probably have a bit much.  Loose line?

3 minutes ago, TOXIC said:

Straight braid or with a leader? What’s your setup and how are you casting?  Did both rods get the braid from the same spool? Putting everything you’ve got into the cast or loading the rod and letting it do the work.  How old is the braid? I would walk off a good portion of the line and reel it back on the spool.  As has been said, check your guides as well.  

Braid came from same spool.  No leader.  Both are 7ft mh rods. One is a shimano dlc and one is a abu Garcia revo max.  I feel like a let the rod load and don’t throw excessively hard 

[Deleted account]

1 minute ago, Cyclones said:

It feels like a definite snag I think, like the 60mph to 0 instantly. 

That is the spool locking up due to a backlash, tighten the brakes, switch to 40 lb braid, and practice casting with a smoother stroke until you get the hang of it.

 

[casts_by_fly]

An improved clinch with braid will slip easily. Stick to a Palomar or uni. 
 

Dig happens when you a reeling against a lot of force (pulling against a snag, a big fish, etc) with looser line underneath. You can eliminate it by ensuring that you watch out for it and when you’re using a slack line presentation to every now and then strip down all of the loose line and reel it all back on under tension so you have a firm

base of braid. 

[Bankc]

Check for nicks on your line guides.  Also, check your line periodically, especially if your fishing near rocks, shells, or anything that might be scratching your line.  Lastly, switch to 40lb braid. It's still thin enough to cast well on a baitcaster, yet thick enough that you won't get as much line dig in your spool.  Thinner diameter braid is worse about line dig than thicker.  

[TOXIC]

If your guides aren’t nicked and you think it’s because you have line dig, the walk off the line from the spool and respool it with firm pressure on the line.  

[FishTank]

I am battling this on a reel I just purchased.  I have been out three times with it and have sort of lost four lures.  All of them the same way, the line is breaking in the spool when I try do a long cast. Cast and then snap.  This has been the nature of braid for me and why I usually don't use it for main line but the reel I bought was specifically designed for braid.  Just in case, two of the lures I was using were floating crankbaits and I was able to get them back with line still attached.  The knot on the lure is perfectly fine.  The line had snapped like it had been cut clean.  I only have this issue with braid on baitcasters.

 

Also, the line I am using is .08 PE Veritas Super Trout Advanced. The line is tough as nails.  The second fish I caught on it was a 10-15lb carp (which was a blast on BFS gear) so I know line will hold up to big fish. I have also checked the guides with a magnifying glass lamp.

 

My belief is that it is digging in on the retrieve and when I go to cast, it's catching and snapping the line part way through the cast. I may switch to FC just see what happens.  I will be out $35 for the line but it's better than loosing time and lures.

[suzuki2903]

What brand is the braid ? I ran into this with power pro and will never touch that brand again! New spool and snapped off two lures. Got to looking and there was several spots down the line where it was odd looking.  Bad spool of line which I suppose can happen to any brand but I’ve switched to sufix 832 and j braid and never had a issue since but I also use the uni knot as well.    Maybe re spool it with new braid if the guides are ok and go from there.

[Cbump]

2 hours ago, casts_by_fly said:

An improved clinch with braid will slip easily. Stick to a Palomar or uni. 
 

Dig happens when you a reeling against a lot of force (pulling against a snag, a big fish, etc) with looser line underneath. You can eliminate it by ensuring that you watch out for it and when you’re using a slack line presentation to every now and then strip down all of the loose line and reel it all back on under tension so you have a firm

base of braid. 

 

I don’t buy that first part at all. I’ve used improved clinch on every line type, including Braid, from 6lb to 80lb, and caught bluegill to 250lb sharks. For 30 years. Wet the line, cinch down, and the knot will be just fine. 
 

I don’t think this is a knot failure. Well maybe, but not in the traditional sense. I think the line is dug in the spool and the stopping action on the cast is snapping It, like you said. 

Btw I’ve found several knots tied in the middle of a new spool of power pro before. Watch for that. 

[Firstoutfisher]

I've had this happen on baitcasters spooled with braid. I eventually found out it was caused by dig in. It may not even be visible but when you're hitting a certain spot on the spool its stopping the line and the force causes your knot to fail launching the lure into orbit. You can fix it by running out your line and reeling it back in with proper tension. I did the same and haven't had any issues since. I figure after a certain amount of time of reeling in slack line or untensioned line the line tension on the spool will need to be reset again. 

[Cyclones]

So I respooled with 50lb braid.  While taking off the old stuff in random spots it all looked tight but then there’d be a big loop turned over flat on the line.  The. I’d come to spots in the reel where one outside edge was just super loose line for maybe a dozen turns.  So I’m guessing loose line was the culprit and causing dig in.  I’m just surprised braid can snap so easily 

[Firstoutfisher]

40 minutes ago, Cyclones said:

So I respooled with 50lb braid.  While taking off the old stuff in random spots it all looked tight but then there’d be a big loop turned over flat on the line.  The. I’d come to spots in the reel where one outside edge was just super loose line for maybe a dozen turns.  So I’m guessing loose line was the culprit and causing dig in.  I’m just surprised braid can snap so easily 

You would be amazed at the amount of force imparted on your line when the lure flying through the air comes to a dead stop. 

[PhishLI]

7 hours ago, casts_by_fly said:

An improved clinch with braid will slip easily. Stick to a Palomar or uni. 

Gotta disagree on this one. I’ve been using a 8 turn IC with 30lb J8 for years, including tied to a VMC snap which has a much smaller diameter than any hook making it more likely to cut the line, and do not break off randomly, or have ever been broken off fighting a fish. I use the same knot on 15 lb PP SS. No issues.

2 hours ago, Cyclones said:

So I respooled with 50lb braid.  While taking off the old stuff in random spots it all looked tight but then there’d be a big loop turned over flat on the line.  The. I’d come to spots in the reel where one outside edge was just super loose line for maybe a dozen turns.  So I’m guessing loose line was the culprit and causing dig in.  I’m just surprised braid can snap so easily 

So there’s your answer. A few months ago I casted off a 3/8oz chatter bait and trailer on 50 lb braid because I was busy yapping and not pulling off loose coils when I should’ve. You can feel them, so as long as you pull them out once you do, you’ll avoid this issue.

[dodgeguy]

I use 50 lb braid at least on a baitcaster. Been using braid since the early 90s and never had this happen. It's caused by line dig and backlash loops but even when I did have my line stop it never snapped.I don't believe in using anything lighter than 50 lb.. Also stick with Sufix 832.

 

[casts_by_fly]

6 hours ago, Cbump said:

 

I don’t buy that first part at all. I’ve used improved clinch on every line type, including Braid, from 6lb to 80lb, and caught bluegill to 250lb sharks. For 30 years. Wet the line, cinch down, and the knot will be just fine. 
 

I don’t think this is a knot failure. Well maybe, but not in the traditional sense. I think the line is dug in the spool and the stopping action on the cast is snapping It, like you said. 

Btw I’ve found several knots tied in the middle of a new spool of power pro before. Watch for that. 

 

1 hour ago, PhishLI said:

Gotta disagree on this one. I’ve been using a 8 turn IC with 30lb J8 for years, including tied to a VMC snap which has a much smaller diameter than any hook making it more likely to cut the line, and do not break off randomly, or have ever been broken off fighting a fish. I use the same knot on 15 lb PP SS. No issues.

So there’s your answer. A few months ago I casted off a 3/8oz chatter bait and trailer on 50 lb braid because I was busy yapping and not pulling off loose coils when I should’ve. You can feel them, so as long as you pull them out once you do, you’ll avoid this issue.

I fish 30 and 50 lb 832 now on baitcasters and yo zuri on my spinning reels. I have fished powerpro and some others in the past. I’ve never had an improved clinch that wouldn’t slip. I normally tie a 6-7 turn knot the same as my mono as I’ve tied them for 30+ years. I don’t know what I’m doing differently but I know that I just don’t bother with a clinch and braid. If I’m throwing braid it’s usually on something like a jig, frog or plastic where a palomar is quicker to tie anyway. 
 

rick 

[Cbump]

It’s weird how different people’s experiences can be. 

[FishTank]

So I found my issue.  I can't say it is same for the OP but this knot was tight when I put the line on. 

 

I put about 5-10 yards of 4lb mono backing and respooled with the same braid. We will see if it improves. 

 

 

7 hours ago, Cbump said:

 

I don’t buy that first part at all. I’ve used improved clinch on every line type, including Braid, from 6lb to 80lb, and caught bluegill to 250lb sharks. For 30 years. Wet the line, cinch down, and the knot will be just fine. 
 

I don’t think this is a knot failure. Well maybe, but not in the traditional sense. I think the line is dug in the spool and the stopping action on the cast is snapping It, like you said. 

Btw I’ve found several knots tied in the middle of a new spool of power pro before. Watch for that. 

 

I have used the same knot for braid as well. It never breaks at the knot and if it does, it's always in the spool. 

 

I have had great luck with the double San Diego jam as well. 

[RDB]

58 minutes ago, casts_by_fly said:

I’ve never had an improved clinch that wouldn’t slip.

The improved clinch knot has never done well in tests with braid for that reason.  If I were going to use that knot on braid (which I do occasionally), I run the line through the eye twice and add more twists.  My typical knot is a Palomar knot but with braid, I use a double Palomar.  In both cases, I want to add more friction spots due to the nature of braid.

[dodgeguy]

11 hours ago, casts_by_fly said:

 

I fish 30 and 50 lb 832 now on baitcasters and yo zuri on my spinning reels. I have fished powerpro and some others in the past. I’ve never had an improved clinch that wouldn’t slip. I normally tie a 6-7 turn knot the same as my mono as I’ve tied them for 30+ years. I don’t know what I’m doing differently but I know that I just don’t bother with a clinch and braid. If I’m throwing braid it’s usually on something like a jig, frog or plastic where a palomar is quicker to tie anyway. 
 

rick 

100 percent correct. I also glue my tag end.

[PhishLI]

12 hours ago, casts_by_fly said:

I’ve never had an improved clinch that wouldn’t slip.

I'm in no way attempting to encourage you or anyone else to use this knot, especially if you've had poor luck with it in the past.

 

You're not fully locking the coils down against the eye of the hook. You may think you are, but you're not. Not enough tension when you finish your pull. That's all. No glue necessary. I've never used it once, and I tie this knot 100% of the time with braid. On rigs where I use a VMC clip and 30-40-50lb braid, the same knot might be tied on for many months at a time. After a certain amount of open-close cycles, like several hundred, I finally change the clip when I feel metal fatigue might be setting in. In between that time frame, I catch a dink or two in a hellscape of pads, arrowheads, dense milfoil, and water chestnut. Good chance I'll drag in a log or two.

1 hour ago, dodgeguy said:

100 percent correct. I also glue my tag end.

If I make my way up there someday, I'll tie it right in front of you using 30lb J8. We'll hook the bumper of your Ram, and you can do it to it. No glue, no lighters. The knot I tie won't slip. I promise.

12 hours ago, Cbump said:

It’s weird how different people’s experiences can be. 

Yup.

[dodgeguy]

I only glue it because I hate it when it frays. Call me ocd. 

[Cbump]

Yeah you have to get a lot of tension sometimes to cinch It down. Has to like fold back on itself. That’s not right but if you tie this knot you know what I’m talking about. Sometimes I’ll grab the hook with pliers or hook It to something and wet and pull. No slip.