Thoughts on Line Conditioners?

[Mat_ski]

12 minutes ago, J Francho said:

Not KVD Line & Lure. It actually slickens  the line with long chain polymers. 

Explain please.
I’m not sure I understand how one long chain polymer make another long chain polymer slicker. 

[J Francho]

Check out the videos on the site. It seals and coats the line. You should try before spreading pseudo science. 

[Mat_ski]

3 hours ago, J Francho said:

Check out the videos on the site. It seals and coats the line. You should try before spreading pseudo science. 

From all the testimonials I was under the impression that it softens the line. I checked out all their stuff and I legit do not get how it softens the polymer without plasticizing or damaging it.

So I asked how and you went of offensive. 
Sealing and coating alone would not soften the line. 

[Bankbeater]

The only time I use line conditioner is on spinning gear, and then it's right after I spool on new line.  I've used Real Magic in the past, but now I only use KVD.

[FishinBuck07]

KVD here also, put it on the night before a trip.  Sometimes spray it on during the trip if my line starts coiling again.

[NoShoes]

Realistically all it does it make the line behave like you fished it all day first thing in the morning. 
 

and I like it…. Lol

[Mike L]

On 5/24/2022 at 5:53 PM, jimanchower said:

How are y'all applying the conditioner? Spraying the spool? Applying with a sponge or something?

 

Spray directly every 20 yards or so when spooling, then the night before an outing. 

 

Some folks use a rag when spooling but if you use an absorbent cloth to run it though you’ll have too much waste. 
However if you choose that route, I found using an old nylon to apply it won’t waste as much. 
 

Keep in mind, if you feel the need to reapply during a trip make sure it’s dry before casting. 
 

 

 

Mike

[treble hook]

I use the KVD. It does seem to keep my line limp and castable. 

[AJ Hauser]

19 hours ago, J Francho said:

Not KVD Line & Lure. It actually slickens  the line with long chain polymers. 

 

This is a key differentiator for them - thank you for pointing this out - I just switched to a "softer" fluorocarbon line in the same lb test to help with management, and I was worried that it would already be less abrasion resistant... last thing I want to do is weaken the line further with an additive of some sort. 

 

Side note: the Real Magic stuff does act as a quick lube on the spool, which I like, even though it does leave a bit of gross build up over time. You have anything that you use that might be a better option that you hit your gear with in between routine deep cleaning/oil/grease sessions? 

 

Thanks much!

[FishinBuck07]

To the point of how I apply it, I use a rag and run the line through it while spooling line on.  Then just spray directly onto the spool of the reel after it has been on there.

 

 

[Skunkmaster-k]

I only use line conditioner when I spool up my spinning reels . They get hosed down with Reel Magic one time just to keep them from jumping off the reel . 

[Team9nine]

Just some info to pass along from an old conversation with one of the developers of KVD L&L:

• Reel Magic, silicon sprays, WD-40, etc. typically contain petroleum distillates, which are a type of solvent . These solvents break down most plastics and other synthetic materials rapidly, and are good at relaxing line memory because they soften the line’s outer surface. Unfortunately, in this process, these same solvents are also leaching the plasticizers out of the line and can damage fishing reel components. Problem is, it’s these plasticizers that make the line flexible and durable. After just a few applications with these solvents the line can start to weaken and dry out.
• Line & Lure is a "polymeric surface modifier" and not an oil. Our polymers are exceedingly slippery when in contact with water and adhere effectively to mono, fluorocarbon, and braided lines. Line & Lure bonds to the line's surface and protects the line from nicks and wear, helping line last much longer. Line & Lure contains no solvents.
• Our testing consistently shows a 20% improvement in overall casting distance and line control. Unlike the others, Line & Lure formula works exceedingly well on fluorocarbon lines and will even improve knot strength.
• Apply Line & Lure to clean line, be it new or used. Avoid using Reel Magic or WD-40 on the line before using Line & Lure because the oils in those products will keep Line & Lure’s polymers from properly attaching to the line, which defeats its purpose.

[AJ Hauser]

FOLLOW UP: it says "Line & Lure"... do you guys spray any of this on plastics to keep them lubed up in the packaging and prevent things from getting sticky or drying out? 

 

Sometimes I'll throw a handful of plastics directly into a Plano container, and I wish I had a little squirt of something to keep them "hydrated" and from sticking - just as a preventative measure - but I have never tossed in any Real Magic or WD-40 because something about aerosol on my baits seems like a really, really bad idea. 

 

I've heard the myth about WD-40 having fish oil and therefore acting as an attractant... but I just don't buy that. 

 

Thoughts?

 

Thanks dudes!

[J Francho]

On 5/26/2022 at 1:56 PM, Mat_ski said:

Line conditioners work by breaking down the “stiff” polymer structure of the line, making it more limp, but also weaker in the process. 
 

How much weaker? I have no idea.

This statement is not correct in the case of L&L.

 

I caught this fish (and at least 30 others) on a 6# Tatsu that was spooled up sometime in 2018, based on the sticker I put on the reel foot.  After every trip, I treat the line with a few squirts of L&L.  If it weakened the line, I'm pretty sure my use case would reveal that.  It doesn't weaken the line.  It does soften the line a bit.  Solvent based products such as Real Magic and WD40 definitely damage line.

 

On 5/27/2022 at 2:53 PM, AJ Hauser said:

FOLLOW UP: it says "Line & Lure"... do you guys spray any of this on plastics to keep them lubed up in the packaging and prevent things from getting sticky or drying out? 

I do not.  However, I have found some benefit to treating the guides when fishing sub freezing conditions.  It helps make knocking the ice off the guides a little easier.  

[Mike L]

On 5/27/2022 at 2:53 PM, AJ Hauser said:

FOLLOW UP: it says "Line & Lure"... do you guys spray any of this on plastics to keep them lubed up in the packaging and prevent things from getting sticky or drying out? 

 

Sometimes I'll throw a handful of plastics directly into a Plano container, and I wish I had a little squirt of something to keep them "hydrated" and from sticking - just as a preventative measure - but I have never tossed in any Real Magic or WD-40 because something about aerosol on my baits seems like a really, really bad idea. 

 

I've heard the myth about WD-40 having fish oil and therefore acting as an attractant... but I just don't buy that. 

 

Thoughts?

 

Thanks dudes!

Sometimes I spray L&L on frog and spinner bait skirts before I put them down. 
It really helps to keep the strands separated and supple. 
 

I also keep my plastics in a box, If I was gonna spay anything on them before being stored back, it would be a scent of some sort not a product that wasn’t designed for that use. 
I used to do that but got away from it and they don’t seem to mind. 

 

 

 

Mike

[AJ Hauser]

Awesome - thanks guys - much appreciated! 

[rboat]

You may want to try mono for your leader. It will give you more stretch and is way more forgiving when tying knots. FC is very dense and hard. It does not give much stretch and degrades faster. It is also hard enough to cut itself if the knot is not perfect. I have switched all of my leader to mono and will never go back.

[J Francho]

Lots of myths being propagated in this thread.  I'd wager the stretch of fluoro is pretty similar to mono, though mono stretches a bit more when water logged.  Knots - you simply need a well tied knot.  I do not bother wetting the knot, just cinch it slowly, and always from the tag end.  Degradation is interesting topic.  I have run Invisx on reel for 6 years and Tatsu for 5.  I'm sure it would have lasted longer, but the line was getting too low on the spools.  Try that with mono.  

[KP Duty]

On 5/27/2022 at 1:15 PM, Team9nine said:

Just some info to pass along from an old conversation with one of the developers of KVD L&L:

• Reel Magic, silicon sprays, WD-40, etc. typically contain petroleum distillates, which are a type of solvent . These solvents break down most plastics and other synthetic materials rapidly, and are good at relaxing line memory because they soften the line’s outer surface. Unfortunately, in this process, these same solvents are also leaching the plasticizers out of the line and can damage fishing reel components. Problem is, it’s these plasticizers that make the line flexible and durable. After just a few applications with these solvents the line can start to weaken and dry out.
• Line & Lure is a "polymeric surface modifier" and not an oil. Our polymers are exceedingly slippery when in contact with water and adhere effectively to mono, fluorocarbon, and braided lines. Line & Lure bonds to the line's surface and protects the line from nicks and wear, helping line last much longer. Line & Lure contains no solvents.
• Our testing consistently shows a 20% improvement in overall casting distance and line control. Unlike the others, Line & Lure formula works exceedingly well on fluorocarbon lines and will even improve knot strength.
• Apply Line & Lure to clean line, be it new or used. Avoid using Reel Magic or WD-40 on the line before using Line & Lure because the oils in those products will keep Line & Lure’s polymers from properly attaching to the line, which defeats its purpose.

Did they really 'develop' it?  Quick detailers had been around many years before it was repurposed as 'fishing line condotioner'.  I figured the guy whom started the company probably tried some automotive quick detailer on his line.  It worked well, and he thought 'bass fishermen would pay a premium price for this if I rebrand it as 'line conditioner'.  It worked.  KVD is 4x the cost of premium auto detailer.  

[J Francho]

41 minutes ago, KP Duty said:

Did they really 'develop' it?  Quick detailers had been around many years before it was repurposed as 'fishing line condotioner'.  I figured the guy whom started the company probably tried some automotive quick detailer on his line.  It worked well, and he thought 'bass fishermen would pay a premium price for this if I rebrand it as 'line conditioner'.  It worked.  KVD is 4x the cost of premium auto detailer. 

I do believe it is a product developed by Rob Faddis himself.  The other product they market is Bow to Stern boat polish, which has very similar properties.

 

Also, if it was as simple as you suggest, any number of companies cold come out with a product and undercut the margin.  There just isn't anyone doing that, so that tells me there's more to it than that.