Theory on "off-shore" fishing - you're opinion please

[BigAngus752]

I was recently doing some studying and ran across a video with a theory about off-shore fishing from a popular fishing guy (many of you have seen this video and will recognize it as I describe it).  I would very much like to hear the opinions of the bassresource-ers.  Please and thank you!

 

The basis of the theory is that "off-shore fishing" (defined as fishing more than a cast-length from the bank, regardless of depth) is often treated differently (and incorrectly) than "beating the bank" fishing, by fisherman.  Bass fisherman will move quickly down the shoreline making one or two casts at prime targets or spend five to ten casts on a juicy looking dock and will then move on if they don't get a bite.  Conversely, a bass fisherman tends to devote 30 minutes or more to an offshore target simply because it's easy to spot fish on the graph bunched around a ledge with rock on it.  Since the fisherman doesn't know WITH ABSOLUTE CERTAINTY that the dock holds bass, they will make a concerted effort with five to ten casts using one or two different lures and then move on.  But once the fisherman IS ABSOLUTELY CERTAIN that the off-shore target holds fish (seen on the screen) they will hit the spot lock and spend 40 or 50 casts or more chucking the tacklebox at those fish even though they aren't getting bit.  

 

This particular expert/teacher believes that bass fisherman should treat off-shore structure just like a good looking dock.  Regardless of how many fish you see on the screen, you should make no more than ten casts with a couple different lures and then MOVE ON.  He reasons this out as follows:

-Bass only feed a couple/few times a day BUT bass in different areas feed at different times

-A fisherman is only going to be successful by targeting actively feeding fish

-A bass fisherman that is beating the bank is presenting his lures in the faces of tons of bass that aren't in an eating mood and just don't bite as he heads down the bank or past a dock but the fisherman doesn't care because he doesn't know they are there.  

-A bass fisherman should keep that same mentality when fishing off-shore targets and make a concerted but brief effort and accept when the fish aren't in an eating mood and move on.  

 

What do you think? Agree? Disagree?  Would you modify this somehow?

 

This is a mental game-changer for me.  I avoid the atypical off-shore fishing like the plague because my only experience with it is an hour of thowing every boring technique at a bunch of fish I know are there only to be frustrated.  Whether this is a well thought out theory or not, I will be adopting this mentality simply because it's going to get me to make a short but concentrated effort on more off-shore targets at that time of year when that's where I SHOULD be.  It may not be the best way, but it will get me started at being a more well-rounded fisherman.  Or is this the best way to fish off-shore?  

Happy Easter and God Bless

[MN Fisher]

That's pretty much the way I fish off-shore. Even if I see fish on the graph, if they don't bite after 5-6 casts of 4-5 different lure types, I'll move to another likely spot.

 

Bank fishing for me is the opposite - since the shore fishing spots around here are few and far between, I'll toss everything (sometimes including the kitchen sink) trying to catch a fish for a couple hours before pulling up stakes, loading the truck and going to the other bank spot.

[BigAngus752]

2 minutes ago, MN Fisher said:

Bank fishing for me is the opposite

Absolutely right.  I should have clarified that.  I love to bank fish also but you are generally tied to a spot.  

[Deleted account]

1 hour ago, BigAngus752 said:

I was recently doing some studying and ran across a video with a theory about off-shore fishing from a popular fishing guy (many of you have seen this video and will recognize it as I describe it).  I would very much like to hear the opinions of the bassresource-ers.  Please and thank you!

 

The basis of the theory is that "off-shore fishing" (defined as fishing more than a cast-length from the bank, regardless of depth) is often treated differently (and incorrectly) than "beating the bank" fishing, by fisherman.  Bass fisherman will move quickly down the shoreline making one or two casts at prime targets or spend five to ten casts on a juicy looking dock and will then move on if they don't get a bite.  Conversely, a bass fisherman tends to devote 30 minutes or more to an offshore target simply because it's easy to spot fish on the graph bunched around a ledge with rock on it.  Since the fisherman doesn't know WITH ABSOLUTE CERTAINTY that the dock holds bass, they will make a concerted effort with five to ten casts using one or two different lures and then move on.  But once the fisherman IS ABSOLUTELY CERTAIN that the off-shore target holds fish (seen on the screen) they will hit the spot lock and spend 40 or 50 casts or more chucking the tacklebox at those fish even though they aren't getting bit.  

 

This particular expert/teacher believes that bass fisherman should treat off-shore structure just like a good looking dock.  Regardless of how many fish you see on the screen, you should make no more than ten casts with a couple different lures and then MOVE ON.  He reasons this out as follows:

-Bass only feed a couple/few times a day BUT bass in different areas feed at different times

-A fisherman is only going to be successful by targeting actively feeding fish

-A bass fisherman that is beating the bank is presenting his lures in the faces of tons of bass that aren't in an eating mood and just don't bite as he heads down the bank or past a dock but the fisherman doesn't care because he doesn't know they are there.  

-A bass fisherman should keep that same mentality when fishing off-shore targets and make a concerted but brief effort and accept when the fish aren't in an eating mood and move on.  

 

What do you think? Agree? Disagree?  Would you modify this somehow?

 

This is a mental game-changer for me.  I avoid the atypical off-shore fishing like the plague because my only experience with it is an hour of thowing every boring technique at a bunch of fish I know are there only to be frustrated.  Whether this is a well thought out theory or not, I will be adopting this mentality simply because it's going to get me to make a short but concentrated effort on more off-shore targets at that time of year when that's where I SHOULD be.  It may not be the best way, but it will get me started at being a more well-rounded fisherman.  Or is this the best way to fish off-shore?  

Happy Easter and God Bless

Yes, and no. If I know there are fish there for sure (by whatever method) then I will spend some more time and effort than if I don't, however, this does not directly depend on whether I'm fishing shallow or deep. Think of bed fishing as an example. That being said, while finding fish is always the first step, finding willing fish is 1a.

[Tennessee Boy]

Well there is no doubt that I can find fish on my electronics that I can't catch.  I prove that constantly.  So in that respect I agree and I'm not gonna spend an hour trying to catch fish that have already proven that they are smarter than I am.  That said,  how much time you should spend is a judgement call.  I'm gonna try several different lures for at least 10 minutes before I move on.  In some cases maybe longer.  

 

What KVD did in last years BPT Chickamauga tournament was very interesting.  From what I could tell,  it looked like he camped out on one spot just about the whole day on the final day.   He could see fish on the spot and would go long periods of time without catching any.  He just waited until one or more got hungry.   I think it was a combination of not wanting to give up the spot to a competitor and not having any other good options.   He won the tournament so it worked for him.

[BigAngus752]

6 minutes ago, Tennessee Boy said:

What KVD did in last years BPT Chickamauga tournament was very interesting.  From what I could tell,  it looked like he camped out on one spot just about the whole day on the final day.   He could see fish on the spot and would go long periods of time without catching any.  He just waited until one or more got hungry.   I think it was a combination of not wanting to give up the spot to a competitor and not having any other good options.   He won the tournament so it worked for him.

That's a good point.  Perhaps the fisherman's personal preference is simply to wait the fish out until they are in the mood.  Kind of like being married...

[WRB]

2 off shore threads the same day “Off Shore Simplified” and this Theory post.

Anglers that camp out on a spot are either novices or know something about bass behavior. Camp out on the wrong spot your a zero, right spot with active feeding bass you are a hero.

Some anglers are run & gun while other tend to saturate the area. Both techniques work if bass are active while you are fishing.

Seeing fish on sonar doesn’t indicate the fish are bass. Seeing bass visually you know what the fish is. Shallow water bass are easier to see visually then deep water bass. 

Off shore bass fishing isn’t any different imo then shore fishing, you just need to visualize what you are targeting.

Off shore you should know what the bass are eating and put your lures where the prey is located, bass are never too far away. Off shore bass tend to be in groups in lieu of loners like ambush oriented shore bass tend to be.

The off shore group of bass are usually hunting along the structure if near it. If the bass are suspended away from structure they are usually inactive unless hunting a bait fish school.

Either situation you don’t leave bass biting to look for more bass. The big ? Is when to fold em or hold em. 

I usually give a off shore spot about 20-30 minutes before leaving and meter the area when leaving looking for bait fish or bass suspended. If I see something then will return in a few hours. Generally set up a milk run of off shore spots until figuring out the active periods on each spot.

Jigs, worms and swimbaits are my primary lures off shore because you can work the entire water column. 

Shore line bass fishing everything comes into play until you figure out what the bass want, it generally takes longer to figure out shore line bass then off shore bass.

When you figure out either shore line or off shore bass the lures are often the same if the cover elements are the same. Exception is boat docks and rip rap walls that are only located near shore lines.

 

Tom

[Luke Barnes]

I'm solely a bank angler so I'll give my opinion on not having electronics and fishing off shore. 

 

I dont know whats out there so I have to go by feel. If everything around a spot off shore feels one way then I hit something different, I'm casting to that spot with every lure I have tied on, if I can reach them. Obviously I'm not casting a weightless wacky anywhere near as far as say a t rig. But if i don't catch anything in that spot I will move on and hit it again later. This panned out for me fishing a decently large pond I couldn't cast to the middle of. I cast a rage craw out and after a second or two felt something different than the previous casts so I cast to that area a few times and bam. Granted it was a giant crappie I was still happy. I rarely spend more than a cast or two in the deepest, farthest spots of a pond but once I learned about feel more, I started casting off shore alot more. 

[DaubsNU1]

I stink at off-shore fishing. Just got a good fish finder last summer, and still haven't managed to dial it in well...I can see structure...but having trouble picking out fish. Doesn't matter much...as I'm no good at catching them off-shore. 

 

I'm learning, and reading, and trying new things.  Confounds me.  

[gulfcaptain]

So last year after acquiring livescope I spent a lot more time offshore fishing.  #1 the unit lets me see what I'm  fishing as in I get a live visual reference scanning the area. Let's me see bait, fish, structure, etc. #2 I can read the mood of the fish. Decide quickly if they are bass or not. See if they want anything to do with the bait  I'm throwing. Do they follow, run away, ignore, etc. Are they on the bottom or suspended? So I've broken down my offshore  game, made it more user friendly by being able to read the water. Same thing we do beating the bank. We target fish, high percentage areas, but move quickly. Using modern technology  I can now do the same thing offshore and fish productively  opposed to fishing areas I mark that look good but don't have the activity  I'm looking for and some fish people aren't even targeting which are un-pressured and easier to catch. 

[Deleted account]

1 hour ago, WRB said:

Anglers that camp out on a spot are either novices or know something about bass behavior.

The fool and the sage

[Zcoker]

In many wide open spots down here in S. Florida, the particular weather conditions can dictate the results for open water fishing....or at least that's been my experience. Was out just the other day, for example, wind picked up mid afternoon, so I headed to open water....at that point I started throwing a big white buzzbait with a big white trailer and on second cast, boom! No theory involved, just grabbed what "felt right" lol

 

 

 

 

 

[lo n slo]

at first, i started out fishing off shore without the aid of electronics. triangulation,  a texas rigged worm, a marker buoy and an anchor. it got a little easier once i bought a $100 Eagle depth finder (with the old blocky pixels), but i still employed the triangulation method, and still do to this day, even with my basic Garmin sonar. i’m not knocking all the new technology, or those who use it, but i still enjoy the “old school” sporting aspect of the hunt. as far as the amount of time spent fishing one spot, i’ll do some fan casting on each of my holes until i feel i need to move on, usually 5-10 minutes if they’re not biting, more if they are.

[Bankbeater]

If I'm fishing a bank spot, either from a boat or walking and I'm getting sunfish bites, and catching them, I move.  I figure if the baitfish are that active there is nothing around that can eat them.  In a boat I'll go farther off shore, if I'm walking I go somewhere else.

[Catt]

Bass are predators & will eat whenever the opportunity arises.

 

With that in mind explain to me how y'all know if a bass are "active" or not?

 

On 4/17/2022 at 6:25 PM, WRB said:

Anglers that camp out on a spot are either novices or know something about bass behavior

 

Or they know the structure & body of water extremely well.

 

A lot of offshore bass I catch I do not see on my electronics. 

 

As far how much time I spend on a piece of cover or structure varies from day to day & sometimes hour to hour depending on changing conditions.

[michaelb]

Why would we think off shore bass in different locations feed at significantly different times? That doesn’t make sense to me, but i haven’t figured this out either. Fish may hang at different depths at times during the day so finding that at any time may be the answer. 

[lo n slo]

3 hours ago, Catt said:

Or they know the structure & body of water extremely well.

 

A lot of offshore bass I catch I do not see on my electronics. 

yes!

[gulfcaptain]

2 hours ago, michaelb said:

Why would we think off shore bass in different locations feed at significantly different times? That doesn’t make sense to me

So offshore fish unlike a lot of shore related fish are grouped up. Yes you might find small wolf packs of bass up shallow, but then those fish are feeding in a group. They aren't the lone fish we catch a lot of the time bank beating. Certain variables  play offshore, mood of fish, location of bait, depth, wind, weather, etc. You hear guys talk about getting the offshore schools fired up. You play to the competitive feed instincts  of the fish when you can get that group of offshore fish firing.  And unlike shore related wolfpacks,  you may have 100 bass in that school instead of 5 or so. So yes they can fire at different times depending on variables  of the location offshore.

[TOXIC]

My theory………Bass that are shallow or “on the bank” are more likely feeding.  They don’t go shallow without a reason and the main reason is to feed.  Bass that are holding on “off shore” structure won’t be feeding unless there’s also baitfish around.  

[RDB]

6 hours ago, Catt said:

Bass are predators & will eat whenever the opportunity arises.

?This?
 

IMO, it is not true that a fisherman can only be successful targeting actively feeding fish…they are opportunistic feeders.  I’m not hungry right now but if someone put a Snickers in front of my face, I’d probably eat it.  There are too many variables that influence behavior to focus on a singular approach.
 

Also, we are talking about several different types of targets (structure & cover) and the time spent will vary.  When fishing offshore, cover may be a small brush pile that requires fewer casts.  On a structure like a point, you may need to hit it from different angles and depths to determine how fish are relating.  Whether offshore or shallow, ideally you will eventually be able to identify how bass are relating to cover/structure and run that pattern.  It may be focusing on the outside edges of deeper docks or the walkways but you are going to have to work them more throughly to identify the prime spots.  Then you can cover more water by focusing primarily on those areas.

 

Also, a lack of bass on imaging doesn’t mean there are none present as bass will often belly down to the bottom and are difficult to see.  If I find an ideal offshore spot in the right conditions, I’m likely going to test it whether I can see fish or not.

[Choporoz]

If I stumble across an offshore potential, I might spend 4 to 6 hours there the first time, depending on the complexity of the structure and cover.

  If I visit that spot the 15th time, I may spend 10 minutes or an hour depending on how well I think I've read it and fished it....not too mention how I've applied what I already think I learned on my way there.

  If there is moving water there, or very close, I might work the area all day long.

[Catt]

On 4/17/2022 at 4:52 PM, BigAngus752 said:

The basis of the theory is that "off-shore fishing" (defined as fishing more than a cast-length from the bank, regardless of depth)

 

Here's a simple starting point an old guide told me years ago on Toledo Bend.

 

Turn around! ?

 

For every bass you catch on the bank there's 5 behind you waiting to be caught!

 

Instead of casting towards the shoreline, cast in front of the boat.

[softwateronly]

15 minutes ago, TOXIC said:

My theory………Bass that are shallow or “on the bank” are more likely feeding.  They don’t go shallow without a reason and the main reason is to feed.  Bass that are holding on “off shore” structure won’t be feeding unless there’s also baitfish around.  

 

My theory is slightly different, strictly based on 12 years at one 250acre lake in MI w/out electronics and more than likely I'm wrong or incomplete at best.  I think there's 3 groups of bass in how they relate to structure, cover, and depth.  Group one is shallow, >10 fow, very cover orientated, homebodies, and primarily ambush predators.  If you put it in their face, they bite.  Group two, I think the largest group, seems to move between deeper structure/cover and shallow structure/cover.  I feel like they feed in both locations, actively, tend to be in groups, and seem to conform to "bite windows," but when they go shallow, they primarily go to feed.  I think these fish target any and all things that they can fit in their mouths, but sometimes get keyed in on what is currently most prevalent.  I also think a large chunk of these fish are nocturnal shallow cruisers/feeders.  Group three, is the most mysterious to me and least likely to be true and in my opinion the smallest group.  They exclusively live in open water and hunt schools of bluegill, crappie, and juvenile bass from below.  They probably use structure in ways I don't understand, since my lake basically bowls out past 25 fow. 

 

Some of my "proof" is based on the coloration of the bass I catch and at what depth and the times I've run into large schools of bass both shallow and deep.  I never pull dark, dark green bass from deep water.  "Normal" to slightly pale seem to get caught at all depths, but my night time shallow bass caught on moving baits are almost always in the normal to pale hue.  I feel like my group 3 is delineated by the open, deep water bass I catch at night or underneath daytime surface feeders that are a larger class of fish from the ones I get on topwater.  There's a lot I don't know about bass, but this working theory usually puts me on fish when I get out on this body of water.  

 

scott

[Tennessee Boy]

I think every opinion expressed in this thread is correct 20% - 80% of the time.  ?

[Luke Barnes]

2 hours ago, softwateronly said:

 

My theory is slightly different, strictly based on 12 years at one 250acre lake in MI w/out electronics and more than likely I'm wrong or incomplete at best.  I think there's 3 groups of bass in how they relate to structure, cover, and depth.  Group one is shallow, >10 fow, very cover orientated, homebodies, and primarily ambush predators.  If you put it in their face, they bite.  Group two, I think the largest group, seems to move between deeper structure/cover and shallow structure/cover.  I feel like they feed in both locations, actively, tend to be in groups, and seem to conform to "bite windows," but when they go shallow, they primarily go to feed.  I think these fish target any and all things that they can fit in their mouths, but sometimes get keyed in on what is currently most prevalent.  I also think a large chunk of these fish are nocturnal shallow cruisers/feeders.  Group three, is the most mysterious to me and least likely to be true and in my opinion the smallest group.  They exclusively live in open water and hunt schools of bluegill, crappie, and juvenile bass from below.  They probably use structure in ways I don't understand, since my lake basically bowls out past 25 fow. 

 

Some of my "proof" is based on the coloration of the bass I catch and at what depth and the times I've run into large schools of bass both shallow and deep.  I never pull dark, dark green bass from deep water.  "Normal" to slightly pale seem to get caught at all depths, but my night time shallow bass caught on moving baits are almost always in the normal to pale hue.  I feel like my group 3 is delineated by the open, deep water bass I catch at night or underneath daytime surface feeders that are a larger class of fish from the ones I get on topwater.  There's a lot I don't know about bass, but this working theory usually puts me on fish when I get out on this body of water.  

 

scott

You sir have something that can not be bought or shown on the most high-def imaging setup. You have experience. If I were to fish with you at that lake I would trust every word you said. 

 

But with my little knowledge of bass in general is that it changes so much from one body of water to another. For your lake I don't doubt a single word you said. But if you were to go to a different lake I wonder if it would all still hold true. Different water and different fish, even in the ponds I fish, change so much.