Do all good B C reels today have a Level Winder guide to prevent Braided Line dig ins with very light braids ?

[cyclops2]

75 years ago almost all smaller fresh water reels had a level winder to allow full line capacity & prevent silk line dig ins.

[Bankc]

Not necessarily.  Most have a level wind just so the line winds up level.  Thin diameter braid will still dig in.  It's just the nature of thin, braided line.  

[cyclops2]

Thank you. So a bass B C is not really meant to use super  thin braided lines ? We have just assumed it SHOULD be able to.  6 to 15# test Was never meant  to be used in heavy cover. 

Even I switch to a 60 or 80# line for that cover.

[islandbass]

30 minutes ago, cyclops2 said:

Thank you. So a bass B C is not really meant to use super  thin braided lines ? We have just assumed it SHOULD be able to.  6 to 15# test Was never meant  to be used in heavy cover. 

Even I switch to a 60 or 80# line for that cover.

That’s been my experience and I’m sure many others. It seems the trouble starts at 20# braid just as @Bankc mentioned However, there are a few of us who can handle 20# braid. 
 

There are some things you can do to lessen the occurrence of line dog with < 30# braid but most people won’t bother. 
 

Just making a guess but I don’t think the level wind on a reel has anything to do with or help reduce line dig. 

[cyclops2]

Well I KNOW & had line dig with 4# Cajun even in my super duper Mitchel 300s . IF I tried to use a Rapala floater 1.5" long. I remove the lip & both trebles. One use a wire barbless tiny hook. 30' is max into any wind. So I always cast downwind. I can see lots of sloppy line loops being pulled out by the wind. But it catches more perch than a normal setup.

[cyclops2]

I have to admit. I am getting the urge to buy a BC reel again.  2nd childhood of fishing ?  ?

 

 

[PhishLI]

1 hour ago, islandbass said:

Just making a guess but I don’t think the level wind on a reel has anything to do with or help reduce line dig. 

Some of Daiwa's PE(braid) Special BC reels have a faster than usual level wind in relation to one crank of the reel's handle. This produces a similar effect observed with a long stroke(oscillating) spinning reel. The line criss-crosses on the spool instead of being neatly stacked side by side as seen with a standard speed level wind. This helps to avoid dig-in.

[bulldog1935]

3 hours ago, PhishLI said:

Some of Daiwa's PE(braid) Special BC reels have a faster than usual level wind. This produces a similar effect observed with a long stroke(oscillating) spinning reel. The line criss-crosses on the spool instead of being neatly stacked side by side as seen with a standard speed level wind This helps to avoid dig-in.

The king of these looks like it will be the Silver Wolf, due in June. 

https://japantackle.com/casting-reels/daiwa/low-profile-casting-reels/reg0000324.html

 

adding a ps here - I fish PE #1.2 (Resin Sheller) on my braid-raced 4600C3, and PE#0.8 (Duel X-wire) on my braid-raced 1500C.  I do note slight line dig when I'm setting drag on both reels, but no problems with it while fishing, and never a line dig problem with PE#1.2 (X-wire) on my salt ML with braid-raced Zillion. 

Since I already referenced Jun Sonada at JapanTackle, he recommends PE#1.0 hard shell as the smallest braid to use on a baitcaster to avoid line dig. 

Note the Silver Wolf is made for down to PE#0.4 - equivalent diameter is 4-lb braid in Sufix 832

 

@cyclops2 - about that 75 years ago thing - 75 years ago, braid and mono were the same diameter for the same test. 

Edited February 18, 2022 by bulldog1935

[PhishLI]

Just now, bulldog1935 said:

The king of these looks like it will be the Silver Wolf, due in June.

Check out this guy on YT. He's all over BFS gear. Good chance he'll have one before long.

 

[bulldog1935]

I still have a shared niche reel between two rods, and will eventually add one for me. 

salt finesse

bass finesse (ooh, sorry about the green tint in this photo)

[Bluebasser86]

20lb is about as small as I'd comfortably go on a standard bass casting reel with braid.

[RB 77]

One of the main reasons why I use only 50 & 65 lb line on my baitcasters is because thin braid digs. It's certainly not because I need that strong of line for Bass fishing. I don't need the line capacity of thinner line either. 

[dodgeguy]

I would stay with 50 Main line then put a light leader on. Or just spool up with 8lb flouro. Lower than that is spinning country.

[PressuredFishing]

2 hours ago, RB 77 said:

One of the main reasons why I use only 50 & 65 lb line on my baitcasters is because thin braid digs. It's certainly not because I need that strong of line for Bass fishing. I don't need the line capacity of thinner line either. 

This as well ^^^ still digs in for me, but it's not as bad. Plus using braid you have plenty of space even for 60lb. 

[PhishLI]

Some people clearly have had problems with lower lb tests braid, but I haven't had much of an issue at all. The MHF rig I've had in my hands most this past year is spooled with 30lb J-Braid x8. No dig-ins were great enough to disrupt my next casts after jacking fish through pad fields or covered in 5 pounds of weeds. Maybe the dismissed and unloved Daiwa J-Braid x8 gets the credit? I also use the same 30lb line on my medium cranking/lipless setup. No problems. Same line on a MF setup. I never pull snags out against the drivetrain of my spool, so that's a non issue for me. Also, I ran 20lb J-Braid on a Tat SV for a year, but the terrain where I fish is loaded with Lily pads which lead to several breakoffs at the knot. I can't have that, so 30lb it is. Besides that, we really don't have much in the way of wood or rocks here, and no shell beds whatsoever.

 

 

If there's an issue worth noting about braid it's this: You can have a fluff and recover during the cast with mono or fluoro, but not really with braid. If you dial in for the longest cast possible, throw a high arc cast, and you keep your eyes on the spool you can observe a fluff and recover towards the middle of the cast using mono/fluoro. This scenario is much more likely with Daiwa's Magforce Z or SV than with friction brakes. Better to not begin to lose it with centrifugal brakes at all.

 

Regardless of which braking system you use, a fluff with braid requires just one thrown loop to cause the spool to lockup instantly. Dead stop. I'm describing what sometimes happens early in the cast during the ascent of the lure on a clear path. Not clipping a branch or dead stopping the lure on the descent. Meaning hitting the water or against a dock piling, etc. That's birds nest time. The quick lockup during an unobstructed ascent type with braid is usually quick and easy to get out. Good luck with the big birds nest type, especially on the spot. Sometimes. Possibly. Maybe, but not often quickly.

 

[islandbass]

7 hours ago, PhishLI said:

Some of Daiwa's PE(braid) Special BC reels have a faster than usual level wind in relation to one crank of the reel's handle. This produces a similar effect observed with a long stroke(oscillating) spinning reel. The line criss-crosses on the spool instead of being neatly stacked side by side as seen with a standard speed level wind. This helps to avoid dig-in.

That is good to know! Thanks. Do you know which Daiwa bc reels have this?

[PhishLI]

37 minutes ago, islandbass said:

Do you know which Daiwa bc reels have this?

Daiwa 20 HRF TW PE Special

 

I believe @onenutinthewater has one. $225 from Asian Portal

[onenutinthewater]

1 hour ago, PhishLI said:

Daiwa 20 HRF TW PE Special

 

I believe @onenutinthewater has one. $225 from Asian Portal

Yes, great reel! I'm surprised they are not more popular. No issues hauling in 20#+ salmon