Why the need to change hooks on a hard bait?

[813basstard]

3 hours ago, Deleted account said:

Said the guy from the strip bar 

 

? 

[waymont]

4 hours ago, gimruis said:

Rapala is notorious for putting crap trebles on their hard baits.

They come with VMC hooks. I wouldn't call those crap

[gim]

7 hours ago, waymont said:

They come with VMC hooks. I wouldn't call those crap

I would.  VMC makes quality products but the trebles simply aren't strong enough on the rapala crank baits and jerk baits I have.  They bend way too easily.

[MN Fisher]

10 minutes ago, gimruis said:

I would.  VMC makes quality products but the trebles simply aren't strong enough on the rapala crank baits and jerk baits I have.  They bend way too easily.

I think the standard hook that comes on Rapala/Storm/Blue Fox is the 9649...which is a so-so hook.

For mass replacements, I go with the 9650 which is a 1x...much better than the 9649 and relatively inexpensive too.

[FishTank]

I change them as I see fit. Some of even the best baits could have bad hooks but some are changed as soon as I open the box, for example the KVD Strike King baits. I like the XD baits but the hooks couldn't go through warm butter. Once changed, these baits are great. Rapala and Lucky Craft (JDM) hooks also get changed but only after a few fish.  They don't stay sharp long. The most fragile to me are Megabass hooks.  They are very sharp but tend to bend on big fish.  Anything else,  I check it and change as needed.  I might go through 12-20 hooks a year. I like Owner ST-36 and Gamakatsu EWG's and G-finesse. If you want to cheap BPS hooks aren't bad and Berkley Fusions are good as well.

[Mbirdsley]

Right, If a hard bait comes with good hooks from the mfg IE spro , lucky craft, mega bass, 6th sense etc etc  I’m not going to waste my time changing hooks.  
 

However, if they don’t come with good hooks to begin with IE strike king, rapala ( I guess there Vmc’s which, I still swap) or any other myriad of hard baits I swap out to mustard 1x short 1x strong triple grips.  I started doing this 3-4 years ago. Since I started swapping  bad hooks out for the mustads my hook up and land % has went way way up. I also hate rusty hooks.  Every stock strike king hook has rusted on me. 1x strong usually prevents hooks from being bent while using pliers or getting tangled in the net.   
 

 I guess in the end stock hooks don’t have to swapped out but, at the very least the stock hooks need to be sharpened.  

[Smallies]

13 hours ago, A-Jay said:

Additionally, I’m a fan of EWG’s vs the Round Bend model in just about every scenario. 

 

@A-Jay first of all, your lure collection, I believe, is second to none, sir — and I always appreciate your detailed and thorough approach to ... well everything.  I am the same way, and I appreciate that when I see it. Though it can be a pain in the arse for those that live with us 

 

Was just curious about why you prefer EWGs.  I read your article you linked up, and I didn't get a good idea about why you prefer EWG to round bend, other than you believe it catches more fish.  But why?  I previously saw the Kyle Welcher video below, where he says he will NEVER use an EWG for crank baits.  Not that he's the expert or anything, but I find it interesting — I guess it's just a confidence thing?

 

 

[Deleted account]

8 hours ago, waymont said:

They come with VMC hooks. I wouldn't call those crap

Must stand for Very Much Crap. The hooks that come on the shadow raps are the worst I've ever fished, and the only ones I change out as soon as I open the package. I fish mono and a soft stick, and bendt them out and broke points in one outing.

[Jigfishn10]

17 hours ago, J Francho said:

The baits I buy usually have very good hooks. When the hooks dull and can't be sharpened, I replace them with either Owner ST-36 or VMC Vanadium Inlines. 

Seems like a lost art or practice I should say. 

I know I read a couple of posts here about sharpening hooks, but I guess replacing treble hooks are cheap enough than sharpening. I get it, but what about fixed hooks? Jigs, spinnerbaits etc, do they just get tossed? 

[J Francho]

49 minutes ago, Jigfishn10 said:

I get it, but what about fixed hooks? Jigs, spinnerbaits etc, do they just get tossed? 

If I'm on the water, I'll sharpen them.  Once I'm off the water, they get tossed.  I buy baits that have good hooks, so if they're toast, they were well used.  I don't care for sharpening Cutting Point hooks, though I know you can, so unless it's an emergency, I toss them when they dull out.

[A-Jay]

2 hours ago, Smallies said:

 

@A-Jay first of all, your lure collection, I believe, is second to none, sir — and I always appreciate your detailed and thorough approach to ... well everything.  I am the same way, and I appreciate that when I see it. Though it can be a pain in the arse for those that live with us 

 

Was just curious about why you prefer EWGs.  I read your article you linked up, and I didn't get a good idea about why you prefer EWG to round bend, other than you believe it catches more fish.  But why?  I previously saw the Kyle Welcher video below, where he says he will NEVER use an EWG for crank baits.  Not that he's the expert or anything, but I find it interesting — I guess it's just a confidence thing?

 

 

OK so I watched this entire video ~ while I'm not familiar with Mr Welcher,

I do agree with almost everything in this clip, almost.

The idea of a 'system' is right up my alley. 

He provides a ton of very good, experienced based information here that most anyone, especially those bassheads not super experienced with this subject, could benefit from.   

And long before this young man came to be, and way before youtube, some us already had this figured out.  During my personal journey down treble hook road, I came to favor the EWG hook.  

Simply because from Michigan to Mexico, I rarely lose fish. 

If I had, I'd of found something else. 

So yes, I like the design & function of them and this is where my confidence lies. 

Is the EWG the end all, best treble ever, probably not.

But the beauty of it all is we all get to choose to go with what we like. 

A-Jay

 

 

 

 

 

 

[gim]

2 hours ago, Jigfishn10 said:

I know I read a couple of posts here about sharpening hooks, but I guess replacing treble hooks are cheap enough than sharpening.

I sharpen my muskie hooks.  Replacing those aren't cheap.  Replacing trebles on an $8 jerk bait isn't so hard on the wallet.

[Smallies]

41 minutes ago, A-Jay said:

Is the EWG the end all, best treble ever, probably not.

But the beauty of it all is we all get to choose to go with what we like. 

Absolutely, agreed.  I guess it's just pick one and fish with it, and if you feel like you're losing a large number of fish, switch it up.  Or something like that, hah!

[TnRiver46]

42 minutes ago, A-Jay said:

OK so I watched this entire video ~ while I'm not familiar with Mr Welcher,

I do agree with almost everything in this clip, almost.

The idea of a 'system' is right up my alley. 

He provides a ton of very good, experienced based information here that most anyone, especially those bassheads not super experienced with this subject, could benefit from.   

And long before this young man came to be, and way before youtube, some us already had this figured out.  During my personal journey down treble hook road, I came to favor the EWG hook.  

Simply because from Michigan to Mexico, I rarely lose fish. 

If I had, I'd of found something else. 

So yes, I like the design & function of them and this is where my confidence lies. 

Is the EWG the end all, best treble ever, probably not.

But the beauty of it all is we all get to choose to go with what we like. 

A-Jay

 

 

 

 

 

 

If the size of smallies you wrestle can’t bend them, they’ve got to be strong 

[waymont]

10 hours ago, gimruis said:

I would.  VMC makes quality products but the trebles simply aren't strong enough on the rapala crank baits and jerk baits I have.  They bend way too easily.

I’m definitely not a crankbait guy, but I regularly use husky jerks, original rapalas, and shad raps with original hooks and I only replace them when they need it. I’ve caught 100s of fish on them.

[steve-pierce]

I use whatever comes on them until they blunt unless I want shortys. No telling how many huge pond bass have been pulled out with old eagle claws.

[Smells like fish]

Owner rings and owner or gama trebles short shanked, up sized, red hook or as with the st-35 with 150 degree points. They make me feel good about what I’m doing ☺️

[CrashVector]

I never change my stock hooks unless they rust or get super dull.

[Ravox]

I guess that is one of the topics that is very divisive in fishing world like leader on braid, I can see that im not alone not changing the hooks except when needed like rust hooks etc… and I can’t say i lost a fish due to the hooks that came with the bait

 

Just got this peacock bass today with a lipless cordell cranckbait  with original disgusting hooks

[scaleface]

Replacing hooks is expensive and I'm not made of money . I'm a recreational angler and not trying to keep up with tournament anglers . I use stock hooks until they lose their integrity . On some of my older baits , I do  change the hooks out . I still have new in box , old stock Bomber Long A minnows and I change them out .

[Aaron_H]

In my experience, hooks and split rings are the first things lure manufacturers will skimp on to lower costs. There are a lot of companies that still use quality hardware, but it is still too common a practice IMO. I'm not willing to risk losing a personal best bass to a bent out split ring (had it happen on Rapala baits) or broken hook shanks (looking at you again, Rapala) just because I didn't feel like throwing $2-3 worth of hardware on it. With upgraded hardware, I don't have to play the guessing game on if it's going to hold up or not.

 

And of course, like many others, I'm pretty firmly in the EWG camp, and most lures I buy still come with round bends.

[TnRiver46]

6 hours ago, Aaron_H said:

In my experience, hooks and split rings are the first things lure manufacturers will skimp on to lower costs. There are a lot of companies that still use quality hardware, but it is still too common a practice IMO. I'm not willing to risk losing a personal best bass to a bent out split ring (had it happen on Rapala baits) or broken hook shanks (looking at you again, Rapala) just because I didn't feel like throwing $2-3 worth of hardware on it. With upgraded hardware, I don't have to play the guessing game on if it's going to hold up or not.

 

And of course, like many others, I'm pretty firmly in the EWG camp, and most lures I buy still come with round bends.

I was wire brushing some lures with rust spots here and there yesterday. I had a bomber long A with stainless steel hooks that barely had any rust but the split rings were completely rusted 

[gim]

On 1/21/2022 at 5:53 PM, waymont said:

I’m definitely not a crankbait guy, but I regularly use husky jerks, original rapalas, and shad raps with original hooks and I only replace them when they need it.

Same. I replace them when they need it too. And they need replacing right out of the package.

 

As previously mentioned, they just aren’t strong. They bend. I will say that they are sharp though. Plus I deal with fish that have teeth here too. A lot of them.

[Jp_midwest]

I always change the hooks unless I know they come with good hooks. if I had to pick trebles to change on baits it would be owner st-36's and mustad KVD ewg triple grips 

[bulldog1935]

Mine is easy - I fish a lot of freshwater plugs in the salt.  This Dog-X is a perfect mullet color. and bronzed hooks were swapped with Gami SpMH

The hooks that get removed get spread around on my FW bass plugs - what's with the size 10 treble at the back of a Jackalls? Bigger is better

 

The YoZuri wakebaits on the right got bronze replaced with SpMH, but I've also found that the bright hooks on YoZuri salt plugs will rust after one use, even with a sink bath back at home - more Gami SpMH. 

Again it's a winter salt thing, but these little FW trout plugs  will also get used in limestone creeks for endemic bass on a finesse trout rod.  While seatrout will slash into a big flashy lure for a bait ball of winter glass minnows, both redfish and snook are picky about the size of the individual bait they're going to sip. 

A size 14 treble is pretty pointless, but a size 6 single plug hook will take all species in salt and creek. 

This one was sight-fished on a fly rod, but in our creeks, 15" bass earn their living on dime-sized minnows