Pflueger President wind knots

[RealtreeByGod]

I have 4 spinning combos. All are just above entry-level quality, all have braid, and I've just noticed the only ones that get wind knots both have a Plueger President as their reel. One is a 6'6 2-piece M Diawa Fuego with a 3500 reel and straight 20lb Power Pro that I mostly just throw treble hook lures with, and the other is a 5'6 UL Shimano Clarus with a 2000 reel and 8 pound J-Braid with a 4lb J-Fluoro leader that I've been recently throwing panfish jigs or Ned Rigs targeting pond dinks.

 

Could something about the reel itself be causing wind knots? I always manually close the bail. 

[MN Fisher]

I toss braid on my Pfluegers without issue.

 

BTW:

The Pflueger 35 is a 3000 size

The Pflueger 20 is a 500 size

[Bluebasser86]

Is the spool filling evenly? Sometimes they'll fill more towards the top or bottom and you might have to add or remove a spacer on the spool shaft to fix it. Reels that have this issue will wind knot constantly. 

[bulldog1935]

There are exactly two things about a spinning reel that can affect wind knots.   

 

First is line lay - hour-glass or cone shape on line lay result increases the tendency for a loop of line to push multiple line loops ahead of it coming off the spool.  Usually deep spools will load mono perfectly, and just won't repeat the same result with stacked braid.  

 

Second is line roller.  A good ball-bearing line roller is required to fish braid -  a line roller that can't keep up with the braid spooling in puts twist in the line.  The first people I saw using braid on old Penn's suffered this problem badly.  

 

There's one thing about the operator that can produce line loops. . Using auto-bail closure or winding against loose line creates wind knots.  

[MN Fisher]

1 hour ago, bulldog1935 said:

Second is line roller.  A good ball-bearing line roller is required to fish braid -  a line roller that can't keep up with the braid spooling in puts twist in the line.  The first people I saw using braid on old Penn's suffered this problem badly. 

President and up all have bearings...only the Trion uses a bushing.

 

Another reason I went with the Avocet RZT - bearing in the line roller...so all my spinners are now 'braid compatible'.

 

1 hour ago, bulldog1935 said:

First is line lay - hour-glass or cone shape on line lay result increases the tendency for a loop of line to push multiple line loops ahead of it coming off the spool.  Usually deep spools will load mono perfectly, and just won't repeat the same result with stacked braid.

Another reason to back the braid with mono - less likely to have this problem.

 

Also, Pfluegers aren't deep spool reels...it's a reason I shy away from Diawa as most of their USDM models are deep spool for some reason known only to them.

[bulldog1935]

"Just the facts, ma'am" - I certainly didn't call out Pflueger.  

But I will call out Shimano for their crappy BB line roller design, which is the same across the range to Stella.  Tica and Daiwa both have better line roller designs.  

At least in the salt, seals serve to trap salt, and the chromed brass roller will need replacing every few years, anyway.  You might say not all BB line rollers are created equal.  

  

What you can't see is the bastante white lithium grease I already cleaned out.  

I upgrade all my Shimano line rollers with MTCW dual BB - no seals, just shims, a second BB, and a titanium roller.  

 

 

If our OP is getting line twist, he should note that separately from casting knots, but line twist is certainly a cause of casting knots.  

[WRB]

All spinning reels twist line with each rotator rotation. Smaller spool diameter twist line tighter and faster. If the lure end of the line can’t untwist the line stays twisted.

This shows up quickly using mono, copoly, FC line. Braid being yarn fibers the twist take longer to build up but in time with use the twisted line forms wind knots.

You can untwist line by dragging behind the boat at walking speed for a few minutes without anything tied on the end.

If the spool has over a hundred yards of braid you can reverse it putting untwisted line on top.

Tom

[FrankN209]

1 hour ago, WRB said:

Spinning reels twist line with each rotator rotation. Smaller spool diameter twist line tighter and faster. If the lure end of the line can’t untwist the stays twisted.

This shows up quickly using mono, copoly it FC line. Braid being yarn fibers the twist take longer to build up but in time with use the twisted line forms wind knots.

You can untwist line by dragging behind the boat at walking speed for a few minutes without anything tied on the end.

Could this be eliminated by using swivels, instead of tying directly to the lure?

[OkobojiEagle]

I'll guess you've got those reel spools filled "to the top".  I'd pull off 10 yards and fish them underfilled a bit.

 

oe

[bulldog1935]

1 hour ago, FrankN209 said:

Could this be eliminated by using swivels, instead of tying directly to the lure?

 

I use micro barrel swivels, both with built-in micro snaps and titanium-wire trace.  

Though barrel swivels get bad press on BR in lieu of BB swivels, especially the micros are all you need, and they're great.  

 

54 minutes ago, OkobojiEagle said:

I'll guess you've got those reel spools filled "to the top".  I'd pull off 10 yards and fish them underfilled a bit.

 

oe

Not exactly true with the right spool and good spool shimming - I've never had a wind knot, and fill to where my fingernail in the spool line keeper trough can't feel a drop moving onto the line.  

[FrankN209]

I have a Pflueger Supreme XT and had wind knots in the past.  I turned to Berkley Ultra 8 because it was stiffer and I never had a wind knot with it. With Gliss and PP, I've had wind knots, probably something on my part. 

[MN Fisher]

4 minutes ago, FrankN209 said:

I have a Pflueger Supreme XT and had wind knots in the past.  I turned to Berkley Ultra 8 because it was stiffer and I never had a wind knot with it. With Gliss and PP, I've had wind knots, probably something on my part. 

Going to a rounder braid also helps. Had wind knots with PP, switched to 832 and they disappeared. Smackdown is also a good braid for spinning.

 

I think Sufix 131 (13 carrier) would work even better.

[GetFishorDieTryin]

A good BB in the roller helps, but you definitely don't need one to have good line lay.  My Exceler and Fuegos all stack line pretty well with bushings.  Reels are mass produced so 2 of the same reels necessarily wont manage line the same.  

So long as the reel stacks the line without any gaps, most if not all wind knots that occur are going to be caused by operator error.  After you close the bail put some tension on the slack line before you take it up.  You may have to do the same thing when fishing with really light baits in a heavy crosswind. 

[TnRiver46]

The wind can’t tie a knot 

[bulldog1935]

they're casting knots, but where the name comes from is the same reason mid-cast backlash on a baitcaster is called Wind Backlash - wind drag on the cast lure lets more loose line peel off, and turning the crank for auto-bail closure leaves a lot of slack line to end up beneath your spool.  

 

I always loan a Tica with fluorocarbon, and the user inevitably gets line behind the spool, until we go over manual bail technique again.  

 

 

My buddy Stevo, though, was keen on it when I loaned him my small Tica on long UL with braid last winter - he did it right and caught his limit.  Went home and ordered his new NS Black Hole small game spinner.  

  

[Born 2 fish]

I also got wind knots with power pro then I switched to suffix 832 and my problem was solved.