Forage question-shad vs bluegill

[DitchPanda]

So my local pond has large populations of shad and various sunfish-bluegills, green sunfish, hybrids. Can always seem to catch bass that are crawfish eaters using a Texas rig or jig. But my confusion comes in as to when to switch from bluegill to shad baits. My experience is bass target bluegills prespawn into summer but generally when do you see the transition from gills to shad. I know you should match what they are feeding on but what if you dont see what they are eating?Wondering when I should change up my swimjig and squarebill colors. Is it a water temp thing? Length of day thing? 

[WRB]

Bluegills are spiny ray fish and bass prefer softer ray fish like Shad year around. Green Sunfish are in between and easier to eat then Bluegill. Young of the year prey are all good for bass. It comes down to what is most available and easy to eat prey. Opportunity, put it in front of a active bass and chances are it will strike.

Tom

 

[Fishes in trees]

 

 

A small lake that I frequently fish doesn't have any shad.  It has that classic Conservation department stocking of Bass/ sunfish / catfish.   Later on, they added some grass carp to the mix.   Someone, in their wisdom, added crappie to the mix.   Compared to other lakes that I fish, in this lake the bass just seem a little light for whatever length they're at.    Their heads seem normal size, but their bodies just seem a little skinnier than they should be.   I've seen 15" fish at this lake weigh in at just over 2 lbs, and in one case 1 lb 14 oz.    I've seen 15 " fish at Truman weight in at 2 lbs 10 oz, 13 oz & 15 oz.   One barely 15" fish that I caught at Truman a dozen or so years ago weighed in at 3 lbs 3 oz.

I think that part of the problem in my lake is that there aren't any shad.    They aren't part of the mix so the bass don't get any of that slightly easier to catch, better food source.  IMO - be thankful that your lake has shad.

 

Now, on the question of what color bait to use -  a whitish/greyish/ silver colored Timber Tiger DC 87 has accounted for MANY fish in this lake, and you can't find a more shad shaded crank than this one.   Maybe they're biting the baitfish on their dreams, I don't know.   The best advice I've got on crank colors is to throw the one you think will work.   To add to the dilemma - I 've got a very realistic shaded Sunfish colored DC8 and it is a great stained water color at Truman - it generally outfishes the lighter colored one, not all the time but often.   Go figure.

[WRB]

Skinny bass are almost always a over population to prey issue. Exception is over population of male bass that tend to be skinny physically vs heavier bodied and larger female bass.

Tom

PS, Crappie are preferred over Bluegill as bass prey.

[Luke Barnes]

24 minutes ago, WRB said:

Skinny bass are almost always a over population to prey issue. Exception is over population of male bass that tend to be skinny physically vs heavier bodied and larger female bass.

Tom

PS, Crappie are preferred over Bluegill as bass prey.

I was going to say, bass with destroy small crappie. Good thing they are prolific breaders! That's when white and light grey lures come into play. In my experience it doesnt have to be a super realistic paint job for a bass to bite it. 

[Black Hawk Basser]

I would think that if there is a mixture of both shad and sunfish, there may be some bass keying on shad and some keying on sunfish. Perhaps it depends on the activity/behavior of the forage at any given time to determine which to imitate.  You'd probably have to fish with several different methods to figure that out each time.  You're in my area.  I've found that in places with shad and gills, you can get on a really good bite for suspended bass, especially in the evening hours. Some may be chasing shad out in the deeper water, and gills are suspended near the top just off the deep weed edge.  A fluke works pretty well in this situation.

20 hours ago, Fishes in trees said:

Someone, in their wisdom, added crappie to the mix.

I hope this is sarcasm.  Crappies tend to really throw off the balance in a pond.  That's why they don't stock them in the first place.

[Tatsu Dave]

Given a choice I've always considered bluegills to be low on the bass menu. Shad and crayfish along w/crappie seem primary prey species. Where we fish crawfish seem to be tops, this is going by what they throw up when in the boat. With fish ladders now the spring shad runs are going where they haven't went in years. 

[roadwarrior]

Crawdads are a nutritional treat, but the main forage on the Tennessee River is 

threadfin shad (yellowtail).

 

[txchaser]

11 hours ago, Black Hawk Basser said:

I would think that if there is a mixture of both shad and sunfish, there may be some bass keying on shad and some keying on sunfish.

? ☝️

And lately I've been trying more white-ish/shad-ish colors in places without a lot of shad, and it is working. Seems to be worth an extra couple of fish to throw both gill and white/shad if I'm in a transitional area like a weed edge or flat near deep water. 

 

[Biglittle8]

I may be in the minority here, but I don't particularly try to "match the hatch" for me it's more about current conditions. ( Sun, wind, water clarity) Bass are vicious predators that will eat just about anything (see rat lure) when they're feeding. The Bluegillish colors seem to work better for me in clear water combined with overcast sky. Lighter shad colors seem to work better in sunny conditions. I also find that craw colors are effective in murky stirred up water especially when combined with sound and/or vibration... ie: chatterbaits and spinnerbaits. Sometimes, there are days when I don't think color plays as big of role as presentation. These are just my personal observations!

[Bankc]

I match the hatch with size.  I match the conditions with color and patterns.  I've caught a lot of bass on perch and trout colored lures in waters that have never seen a perch or trout.  

[the reel ess]

Bass never transition away from shad if they're present. But they are opportunistic feeders and will take a bluegill if it presents itself, especially in a pond with little other forage. It's important for bass in that situation to eat bluegill because if they don't the bluegill get so big bass can't eat them. Then they're both competing for minnows and whatever else they can scrounge. Bluegill are spiny as I'm sure you've notice when holding one. I imagine at some point they get unpleasant for bass to swallow. And bass will learn from a negative stimuli to avoid them unless they're starving. So the presence of shad or larger shiners is a wonderful thing.

54 minutes ago, Bankc said:

I match the hatch with size.  I match the conditions with color and patterns.  I've caught a lot of bass on perch and trout colored lures in waters that have never seen a perch or trout.  

Yellow perch is one of the best patterns in the south. And most waters don't have any. Then there's firetiger. To me that looks like a psychedelic perch. 

[Hook2Jaw]

On one of my local lakes it seems there are two groups of bass.  The first group, and the one most pressured by anglers, are the shallow bass that seem to stay shallow year round.  They seem to chomp young and mature sunfish.  The other group target the schools of shad that exist in deeper water.  That's not saying a shallow fish won't eat a shad and a deep fish won't eat a bluegill, but I have more faith in imitating bluegill in the shallows and shad when I'm fishing deep.

[Catt]

6 minutes ago, the reel ess said:

they are opportunistic feeders and will take a bluegill if it presents itself

 

And will take Shad, bluegill, crappie, or crawfish if they present themselves.

[the reel ess]

36 minutes ago, Catt said:

 

And will take Shad, bluegill, crappie, or crawfish if they present themselves.

LOL. Shiners, frogs, snakes, mice. I get the "match the hatch" idea. But sometimes they get really turned on by something new. 

[Shimano_1]

I may be foolish but I tend to throw a lot more shad colored baits than bluegill.  I'll mix it up some I'm the spring or when I think the gills are bedding or whatever.  Other than that I tend to fish the shad colors an overwhelming majority of the time. They say throw trout colored swimbaits even if there aren't any trout. I think it's way more about action and presenting it in a way they'll want it than color

[CrankFate]

On 8/7/2021 at 12:42 PM, WRB said:

bass prefer softer ray fish like Shad year around.

^This.

 

I am positive that bass eat BG as a last resort. Where there actually is forage that isn’t BG, they will prefer whatever it is. Especially if it’s soft and spikeless.