Want to try a "different" line...

[Hulkster]

19 hours ago, CrankFate said:

@JS8588After having 2 kids, I would suggest that if you fished on and off for your life, having a baby is a time to be “off” when it comes to fishing. I missed a lot of fishing after having kids. It’s only now that they are over 10, that I can get out that much again. I love fishing like a second wife and a third child but it’s not about escaping from the real ones. Most serious guys would tell you they were doing it before and they are doing it after and, yes, life gets in the way.

yeah before our kid i used to go a couple times a week out fishing. after our daughter was born i still (to this day, she is 8 now) try to get out once per week. but for me its usually an evening thing. I don't own a boat so i shore fish from my favorite spots usually on Sunday Evenings. 

[Tail Slap]

I have been bouncing my new premium fluoro obession on Bulldog1935.  I started evaluating some of the various JDM Seaguars top end fluorocarbon.  Was a bit on a pain getting accurate English translations.  Many time the Aussie sites had the best info on them.  

 

Below are my research findings and opinions based on my experience.  Others may differ.

 

Seaguar unfortunately keeps its best lines out of the USA market. Another thing I found I had  to watch out for is line rating vs diameter.  USA destination packaging many times reduces its line rating for a given diameter so it fits with all the other underrated lines i.e. 10lb line that breaks at 22lbs etc.  This is normally not the case when you order JDM packaged line.  It's rated very close to actual.  It can make a JDM  line look weak until you check the diameter.  

 

Seaguar's top of the line premium general use fluorocarbon leader as I understand it is under the Grand Max line series.  GrandMax FX Leader is their newest, replacing standard GrandMax, highest for diameter line and knot strength.  Grand Max FX Shock Leader adds slightly more stretch to the leader.  They also offer a tippet version Grand Max and GrandMax FX Tippet specifically for fly fishing.

 

  In main lines of couse we have the Tatsu main line they finally brought to USA.    There JDM top of the line  series is R18.  It unlike Tatsu has its properties changed for target species specific as well as properties.   They have a bass line, a sea bass line.  More interesting is they have a R18 Hard line  Here instead of their being a softer outer layer of the dual layer fluoro lines they use a hard outer layer.  It requires specific knots but is more rigid and also abrasion resistant. 

 

For Salt water they have heavy duty fluoro leader line Big Game Premium MANYU it starts at 60lb and goes up to 220lb IIRC.  It makes a great saltwater or toothy leader as well as a Shock leader for surf casting bait-n-wait.  Has slightly lower strength /diameter ratio then R18 and GrandMax but has more stretch and higher abrasion resistance.

 

Just remember if you order these JDMs there lb/kg rating is likely close or closer to its rating.  No 15lb breaking at almost 25-28lbs type of stuff.

 

IMO for mainline Tatsu is really good and can be sourced domestically.  But for leader I have been very impressed by the GrandMax FX and Shock leader versions.  They are not cheap but 50-100m using in 2-3' sections can last a good bit.

 

I want to try the R18 Hard mainline version to see how it acts.  It's suppose to have the most sensitivity, least stretch,  maximum strength and abrasion resistance.  I want to see how stiff it is.

 

I use to think the only real difference in a certain series between leader and mainline was a increase in diameter for a given strength rating but same formula.   After using some of these lines and reading the tech info on some of them I know this is not the case.  At least not with these Seaguar lines.   They really do seem to have different properties.

 

I am switching over to Grand Max FX for my leader and will be using the MANYU line as my SW leader where I use thicker leader and my surf setup Shock leader.  Been impressed with both of these.  I will see if the bear out in the long term.  I was super impressed by Daiwa Xbraid Grand when I first started using it. But dumped it after a season when I started having break offs for no apparent reason.  I am not willing to keep loosing costly lures. Lesson learned..,take longer time before jumping in and swapping multiple reels over.

[Tail Slap]

Wanted to add that Tatsu is part of the R18 series.  R18 limited is Tatsu as far as I know and according to multiple sources.  You can get 2lb R18 but USA Tatsu stops at 4lb IIRC.

[Boomstick]

If you are targeting catfish chances are you are using some sort of a bottom contact rig. So I would either use mono or braid to mono or fluoro leader for that. The problem with straight fluoro is when you let that bottom contact sit out there for a while, the line will go flat against the bottom pretty much, which often leads to the line going between two rocks and you lose your bait.

[Deleted account]

4 hours ago, Tail Slap said:

I have been bouncing my new premium fluoro obession on Bulldog1935.  I started evaluating some of the various JDM Seaguars top end fluorocarbon.  Was a bit on a pain getting accurate English translations.  Many time the Aussie sites had the best info on them.  

 

Below are my research findings and opinions based on my experience.  Others may differ.

 

Seaguar unfortunately keeps its best lines out of the USA market. Another thing I found I had  to watch out for is line rating vs diameter.  USA destination packaging many times reduces its line rating for a given diameter so it fits with all the other underrated lines i.e. 10lb line that breaks at 22lbs etc.  This is normally not the case when you order JDM packaged line.  It's rated very close to actual.  It can make a JDM  line look weak until you check the diameter.  

 

Seaguar's top of the line premium general use fluorocarbon leader as I understand it is under the Grand Max line series.  GrandMax FX Leader is their newest, replacing standard GrandMax, highest for diameter line and knot strength.  Grand Max FX Shock Leader adds slightly more stretch to the leader.  They also offer a tippet version Grand Max and GrandMax FX Tippet specifically for fly fishing.

 

  In main lines of couse we have the Tatsu main line they finally brought to USA.    There JDM top of the line  series is R18.  It unlike Tatsu has its properties changed for target species specific as well as properties.   They have a bass line, a sea bass line.  More interesting is they have a R18 Hard line  Here instead of their being a softer outer layer of the dual layer fluoro lines they use a hard outer layer.  It requires specific knots but is more rigid and also abrasion resistant. 

 

For Salt water they have heavy duty fluoro leader line Big Game Premium MANYU it starts at 60lb and goes up to 220lb IIRC.  It makes a great saltwater or toothy leader as well as a Shock leader for surf casting bait-n-wait.  Has slightly lower strength /diameter ratio then R18 and GrandMax but has more stretch and higher abrasion resistance.

 

Just remember if you order these JDMs there lb/kg rating is likely close or closer to its rating.  No 15lb breaking at almost 25-28lbs type of stuff.

 

IMO for mainline Tatsu is really good and can be sourced domestically.  But for leader I have been very impressed by the GrandMax FX and Shock leader versions.  They are not cheap but 50-100m using in 2-3' sections can last a good bit.

 

I want to try the R18 Hard mainline version to see how it acts.  It's suppose to have the most sensitivity, least stretch,  maximum strength and abrasion resistance.  I want to see how stiff it is.

 

I use to think the only real difference in a certain series between leader and mainline was a increase in diameter for a given strength rating but same formula.   After using some of these lines and reading the tech info on some of them I know this is not the case.  At least not with these Seaguar lines.   They really do seem to have different properties.

 

I am switching over to Grand Max FX for my leader and will be using the MANYU line as my SW leader where I use thicker leader and my surf setup Shock leader.  Been impressed with both of these.  I will see if the bear out in the long term.  I was super impressed by Daiwa Xbraid Grand when I first started using it. But dumped it after a season when I started having break offs for no apparent reason.  I am not willing to keep loosing costly lures. Lesson learned..,take longer time before jumping in and swapping multiple reels over.

All of this to catch some fish? It's not that hard.

[bulldog1935]

@BassWhole! you could certainly say that about absolutely everything on this forum including the forum itself - and you'd have 3 fingers pointing back at yourself. 

Putting together gear that works right, tuning the gear to eliminate annoyance and improve performance is all part of the fun and satisfaction of the sport.  

Certainly Tail Slap's answer was in context with the OP's question.  

If it doesn't interest you, it's not worth taking another to task - just move on and find something that does interest you.  

 

[Tail Slap]

If you really want to stay away from braid and want to give a high quality fluoro  mainline a try, give Tatsu a go.  I, personally, am sold on braid mainline for most all my fishing excluding my new fly fishing endeavor @bulldog1935 is patiently helping guide me.  But if you want to try fluoro mainline, for catching Mr Wiskers, the only way your going to know how it works is to try it for yourself..

 

I do understand the sense that braid, especially these days, has so many superior qualities it can almost feel unfair. LOL   It's very hard to beat a high quality braid to fluoro leader setup.  It's the culmination of the industry's current line technology performance.

 

But as its doubtful anyone on this forum is going hungry without their catch, if they even keep it (C&R), if you want try or even simply entertain the idea of using something different for experience sake why not?

[Tail Slap]

7 hours ago, BassWhole! said:

All of this to catch some fish? It's not that hard.

You are of course 100% correct.  Even to this day I will grab some of my younger family members take them out in the Jon boat on the pond @the farm or the lake with nothing but a cane rods with some mono tied on and  worms, corn, and grasshoppers for bait.  We come back with a stringer full of crappie to fry up coated in beer batter and good memories of a great time.  

 

With that said,, because you can catch fish with a stick, string, and a sharpened bent piece of wire does not mean you can not appreciate using best or various levels of higher tech does it?  Who on this forum uses only what is minimum needed to catch fish?

 

Who needs 7 different rods with many anglers having multiples of these just to catch a dinky fish? Boxes full of reels, lines, a bazillion lures, $30k up bass boat, etc?   No one.  You could apply that to every part of modern life in this country.

 

So is "all that just to catch fish" ??  Of course not but as I understood it, that was not the intended direction of the OPS question.     I read it as a question asking about options and what was possible leaning toward the premium side of gear. 

 

His setup Daiwa Kage LT MQ 4000D-CXH mounted to a 7'6 Daiwa Ardito MH is certainly not a basic budget setup but a high end premium setup.   His first listed option for line was also not budget.  He asked about Tatsu which many would consider the highest end fluoro mainline sold in this country and one of the top fluoro mainline from the company most consider the tech leader in fluoro line development.   At least to me these point to the direction the OP wanted to focus, which is high end premium gear.

 

If he had asked about what no name line to get from Walmart for his $35 rod reel combo to catch catfish  I would have offered very different options.

 

I was simply giving him premium options in line with the quality he indicated by his choices outside the mainstream found locally in the USA that were still easily acquired online from numerous sources.  Also was hopefully adding to the collective knowledge via my experiences, which I feel is one of the primary benefits to forums such as these.

[JS8588]

I've pretty well settled on Tatsu for this setup as well as for the Penn Fathom 300 LPHS (which is also being paired with a 7'6 Daiwa Ardito MH. Yeah, I prefer to go with travel rods assuming the overall quality is there). Once wife gets back into swing of things, they'll function nicely as a his/hers setup. Just going to see if Amazon offers anything worthwhile on Prime day before I hit "order".

 

I get that it may not be ideal for catfishing, but neither is the higher gear ratios on those reels. If it's causing too many breakoffs, well, I can always work out something else (Daiwa Luvias LT 4000D-C with a 7'6 Avid Trek, maybe?) 

 

Thanks for the input, all. I'll be posting another inquiry on an ultralight rod sometime in the coming days.

[Tail Slap]

@JS8588

 

Done a fair bit of catfishing. Enjoy it still to this day.  Not to mention smoked cat is good eaten when done right.  

 

What type of catfish are in the waters you fish?  What typical sizes?    River or lake?

 

[JS8588]

9 hours ago, Tail Slap said:

@JS8588

 

Done a fair bit of catfishing. Enjoy it still to this day.  Not to mention smoked cat is good eaten when done right.  

 

What type of catfish are in the waters you fish?  What typical sizes?    River or lake?

 

 

Usually channel cats up to 10-ish lbs & bullheads. Flatheads are around but not generally where I go. I do have a bead on a local spot that might have em, though. At the moment I live in Eastern PA. We'll be moving south of the Mason-Dixon after the little guy gets here. 

[JS8588]

Tatsu has been ordered. Thanks for the input, everyone!

[GetFishorDieTryin]

On 6/19/2021 at 9:35 AM, Tail Slap said:

USA destination packaging many times reduces its line rating for a given diameter so it fits with all the other underrated lines i.e. 10lb line that breaks at 22lbs etc.  This is normally not the case when you order JDM packaged line.  It's rated very close to actual.  It can make a JDM  line look weak until you check the diameter. 

USDM line doesn't reduce the rating they use a different system than that of the JDM lines, thats why the dia is so much lower then UDSM lines.  USDM lines list the minimum breaking strength where JDM lines list the maximum. 

On 6/19/2021 at 11:10 PM, JS8588 said:

I've pretty well settled on Tatsu for this setup as well as for the Penn Fathom 300 LPHS

I'm curious about them and haven't heard many reviews.  What do you think of your so far?

 

[JS8588]

7 hours ago, GetFishorDieTryin said:

I'm curious about them and haven't heard many reviews.  What do you think of your so far?

 

 

It's a post ~2016 Penn. It's sturdy, not THE smoothest reel I've ever spun (which is to say it's not a Daiwa or Shimano), but it feels like it'll get the job done & not need to be babied (in other words, the reasons I buy a lot of Penn products). Freespool is a lot nicer than I'd have anticipated. That's really all I can say until I get some line on it. The reviews that are out on the Fathom low-pro line are pretty much universally good. So far, I see why. 

 

I may have ordered an Okuma Komodo 471 while buying the Tatsu. Decided I need a new Party Boat setup. Ya know what? I just might spool it up with braid. Anyone have an opinion on the Berkley X9 stuff?

 

Since you're considering the Penn Fathom LP, apparently Daiwa just came out with this: https://thebasscast.com/daiwa-launches-lexa-tw-300-400/

 

It never ends.