Do you think George Perry's record is legit?

[Catt]

On 6/11/2021 at 3:03 PM, RenzokukenFisher said:

. I think this record has a chance of being legit but I do think extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Without solid pictures, measurements, and witness testimony to verified weights it makes it harder to believe.

 

So anything that happened prior to what the 80s, 60s, 40s didn't happen?

 

My dad was born in 1919, we talked about this record before, he stated there would have been two places with scales, the post office or a butcher shop.

 

Y'all need to study life in rural America during the Great Depression to get a better understanding of why some of the events surrounding this record happened the way they did.

[Hook2Jaw]

I don't believe the Perry bass is the world record.  The fish caught in Japan, the one an ounce heavier, is the daggum world record.  Where I come from the better number wins and the Kurita fish has the better number. 

 

It's pure ridiculousness.

 

If I ever catch a fish an ounce heavier than the Kurita fish and they tell me it isn't the world record I'm gonna be mad as fire, and then you guys can discuss here about why or why it is not the world record.

[12poundbass]

2 hours ago, A-Jay said:

While this town is growing pretty fast, thankfully it still maintains the "small town" feel. Probably helps in this situation. The name of the small grocery store is 'Family Fare', if that tells you anything.

Plus, I know a guy . . . .

Fish Hard

A-Jay

We have a small grocery store in our town as well where the employees who wear dress pants, white shirts, wear ties, bag your groceries, and ask if you’d like your groceries loaded in your car. Where you can watch the butcher through the window cut your meat, and there are only two checkout lanes. 
 

I love the small town living. Maybe I’ll see if they can weigh my next big bass...if I can find the big ones. ?

2 hours ago, A-Jay said:

While this town is growing pretty fast, thankfully it still maintains the "small town" feel. Probably helps in this situation. The name of the small grocery store is 'Family Fare', if that tells you anything.

Plus, I know a guy . . . .

Fish Hard

A-Jay

We have a small grocery store in our town as well where the employees who wear dress pants, white shirts, wear ties, bag your groceries, and ask if you’d like your groceries loaded in your car. Where you can watch the butcher through the window cut your meat, and there are only two checkout lanes. 
 

I love the small town living. Maybe I’ll see if they can weigh my next big bass...if I can find the big ones. ?

[Catt]

1 hour ago, Hook2Jaw said:

The fish caught in Japan, the one an ounce heavier, is the daggum world record. 

 

So what do you do with Dottie at 25#?

[Mobasser]

3 hours ago, Catt said:

 

So anything that happened prior to what the 80s, 60s, 40s didn't happen?

 

My dad was born in 1919, we talked about this record before, he stated there would have been two places with scales, the post office or a butcher shop.

 

Y'all need to study life in rural America during the Great Depression to get a better understanding of why some of the events surrounding this record happened the way they did.

Catt, this is 100% correct. My folks grew up during the depression in rural Missouri. It was very hard times. Any fish of any size or species would have been kept to eat, to feed the family. No catch and release back then. Then you had the dust bowl, which transplanted much of Oklahoma and Texas out to California. Some of them never made it. Fishing was more about survival for many of these folks.

[Dwight Hottle]

2 hours ago, Hook2Jaw said:

I don't believe the Perry bass is the world record.  The fish caught in Japan, the one an ounce heavier, is the daggum world record.  Where I come from the better number wins and the Kurita fish has the better number. 

 

It's pure ridiculousness.

 

If I ever catch a fish an ounce heavier than the Kurita fish and they tell me it isn't the world record I'm gonna be mad as fire, and then you guys can discuss here about why or why it is not the world record.

If you catch a fish one ounce heavier than Kurita fish it would be 2 ounces heavier than Perry's fish which would be a new record if submitted properly. IGFA uses the two ounce rule for fish weighing up tp 25lbs. Fish over 25lbs have a higher differential to qualify. The reasoning for the two ounce rule is for eliminating scale tolerance differences. 

 

Weights needed to defeat or tie existing record

1. To replace a record for a fish weighing less than 11.33 kilograms (25 pounds), the replacement must weigh at least 56.69 grams (2 ounces) more than the existing record.
2. To replace a record for a fish weighing 11.33 kilograms (25 pounds) or more, the replacement must weigh at least one half of one percent more than the existing record. For an existing record weighing 45.35 kilograms (100 pounds), the additional weight required to defeat the record would be 226.7 grams (8 ounces).
3. A catch that matches the weight of an existing record or exceeds the weight by less than the amount required to defeat the record will be considered a tie. In the case of a tie claim involving more than two catches, the weight must be compared with the original record (i.e., the first fish caught). No catch weighing less than the original record will be considered.

[Bird]

On 6/11/2021 at 5:03 PM, jbsoonerfan said:

For those who like World Record drama, look at the Milo Hanson buck. The Perry bass arguments are nothing compared to the Hanson buck.

That is very true.

I was at a big game show in PA and actually saw the Hanson buck and it wasn't the biggest buck there but do to the way the horns are officially scored, the Hanson bucks design benefits from the scoring process vs much heavier horned animals like the Jordan buck.

On 6/11/2021 at 5:03 PM, jbsoonerfan said:

 

 

On 6/11/2021 at 5:03 PM, jbsoonerfan said:

 

 

[Hook2Jaw]

3 hours ago, Catt said:

 

So what do you do with Dottie at 25#?

Foul hooked.  I've foul hooked many a carp, it was pure chance.  That's what I do with Dottie at 25.

1 hour ago, Dwight Hottle said:

If you catch a fish one ounce heavier than Kurita fish it would be 2 ounces heavier than Perry's fish which would be a new record if submitted properly. IGFA uses the two ounce rule for fish weighing up tp 25lbs. Fish over 25lbs have a higher differential to qualify. The reasoning for the two ounce rule is for eliminating scale tolerance differences. 

 

Weights needed to defeat or tie existing record

1. To replace a record for a fish weighing less than 11.33 kilograms (25 pounds), the replacement must weigh at least 56.69 grams (2 ounces) more than the existing record.
2. To replace a record for a fish weighing 11.33 kilograms (25 pounds) or more, the replacement must weigh at least one half of one percent more than the existing record. For an existing record weighing 45.35 kilograms (100 pounds), the additional weight required to defeat the record would be 226.7 grams (8 ounces).
3. A catch that matches the weight of an existing record or exceeds the weight by less than the amount required to defeat the record will be considered a tie. In the case of a tie claim involving more than two catches, the weight must be compared with the original record (i.e., the first fish caught). No catch weighing less than the original record will be considered.

 

I don't much care for those IGFA rules, but I'm aware of the two ounce difference rule.  I think an ounce is an ounce and Perry's record is, to me, obsolete.  The Kurita fish is the world record in my eyes.

 

I also don't think Georgia produced the world record at all, ever, because I've fished Oxbow lakes from time to time and I'll tell you they're poorly oxygenated mudholes full of gar and bowfin.  It doesn't matter, George Perry lost any claim to the record years ago.

[Catt]

54 minutes ago, Hook2Jaw said:

Foul hooked.  I've foul hooked many a carp, it was pure chance.  That's what I do with Dottie at 25.

 

Accidentally foul hook but still 25 lbs, sounds like you wanna pick & choose records based on opinion.

[Mobasser]

Even though the Perry bass has been argued about for years, I think it should still be recognized, along with Dottie and the Japanese bass. We'll never know the exact answer.                                             This thread makes me wonder how many other huge fish have been caught over the years, but were weighed on poor scales, or never checked in? 

[TnRiver46]

20 hours ago, slonezp said:

I don't know about the rest of the country but if I walked into the post office, to weigh a fish, here in Chicago, one of 2 things would happen. They would run me out of the store because they thought I was crazy or I would wait in line for an hour and they would ask if I wanted it shipped priority.

 

8 hours ago, 12poundbass said:

I’ve often thought about that myself. I believe grocery stores have certified scales as well. I could only imagine the looks walking into a post office or grocery store holding a bass or carrying a dripping wet weigh in bag with a flopping fish through the store. 
 

I believe @A-Jay has reached out to a local certified scale and put a game plan in place. I wonder if he got a sideways look? 

When we were 16, we caught a smallie that we were certain was 6 lbs so we put it in a 5 gallon bucket and raced to our favorite gas station deli that we ate at all the time. The ladies weighed our fish, it was 4.01 lbs haha. So instead of mounting our 6 lb smallmouth, we released it into a golf course pond. 
#thjngspeoplewouldprosecutenowadays

On 6/11/2021 at 10:46 AM, gimruis said:

I consider myself to be a competitive person.  However, I've accepted the fact that no matter how hard I try and how much time I invest into any one activity, there will always be someone better than me at it.  It still isn't going to stop me from trying.

 

Until his record is beaten, it will remain the record whether it is legitimate or not.  There is literally no way to verify the validity of it it at this point now.

Well obviously you haven’t taken a ride in my new time machine yet.......

[schplurg]

11 hours ago, Catt said:

 

So anything that happened prior to what the 80s, 60s, 40s didn't happen?

 

My dad was born in 1919, we talked about this record before, he stated there would have been two places with scales, the post office or a butcher shop.

 

Y'all need to study life in rural America during the Great Depression to get a better understanding of why some of the events surrounding this record happened the way they did.

 

What matters is whether or not this is a valid record, and what evidence was used in granting that record.

 

This is fishing. Tall tales abound. If any record needs specific evidence, rules and documentation, it's fishing. It isn't personal.

 

It doesn't mean Perry was dishonest. I don't think he was, I doubt he even cared much. I think it should be a footnote in the record books since there is no evidence that this fish weighed what is claimed. It can't meet current record requirements, not even close.

 

This level of evidence, or lack thereof would not pass muster today. It's not fair to the guy who catches a verifiable fish of the same weight next week. This record cannot be verified in any way. It was not officially weighed. There is no evidence of it's weight whatsoever, not even any verifiable photos of the fish. 

 

I don't care if the lake was too small for big fish, or no other bass near that size have been caught in the area, and I don't care how many cameras or scales were in the county. All that matters are facts in evidence and there are little to none.

 

I'm a nice guy, but sorry! Rules are rules. My tune has changed a bit since the start of this thread. I think this catch should be stricken from this record based on what I just wrote. There's no other fair way to look at it. This isn't Perry's fault, it's the IGFAs.

 

Anyone can start a new world record with their own rules. Call it the BassResource Record. Lower the evidence requirement if you want. The IGFA doesn't need to be the final authority on anything.

 

This particular record though has it's own rules. They shouldn't be broken and they would have to have been to accept this fish as the record. Maybe a new record organization for fishing should be started since this one doesn't seem to follow its own rules.

[Tennessee Boy]

Technology is constantly improving which makes record keeping more accurate and easier.  It’s true in all sports.  In Track & Field times are measured with extremely accurate automated systems that eliminate the chance of human error.  This was not true 75 years ago.  The problem is you can’t just throw out the old records as being inaccurate every time new technology brings a higher level of accuracy.  The same is true with new rules and processes that are added to insure the authenticity and accuracy of fishing records.  The old records are a big problem that the IGFA has struggled with.  The smallmouth record set in 1955 was stripped from DL Hayes then later reinstated.  The walleye record set in 1960 was stripped from Mabry Harper and then later reinstated.  It’s a mess and I don’t see a solution.  Like I said in an earlier post on this thread,  I think it’s unlikely that the record is legit but I don’t think there is evidence to justify overturning it.

[.ghoti.]

The simple, undeniable fact of the matter is; Perry’s fish IS the world record largemouth bass. The IGFA says so, and they are the authority on the subject.

 

This topic comes up on a regular basis. The same arguments are made. The same comments about California, hand fed, giant bass are reiterated. Dottie, and Kurita always get mentions, with arguments making either, or both, legit records. And, as many arguments against both.
 

And, somebody is always butthurt about it.

 

Don’t like the current state of affairs? Simple. Create your own records keeping organization, with rules that keep you from being butthurt.

 

Keep in mind somebody is going to get all butthurt about it, no matter what you do.

 

We havin fun yet?

[soflabasser]

There are a lot of salty haters that is for sure complaining about George Perry's and Manabu Kurita's official World Record largemouth bass. Like I said earlier it takes a humble man to admit someone is better at them in a Sport, some people are just sore losers who refuse to give credit when it is due. With that said if you have people hating on your bass fishing success you know your are doing something right.

[WRB]

The Perry WR LMB Record was caught in 1932, nearly 90 years ago, over 20 years before IGFA started to keep fresh water game fish records. The catch was Grandfathered.

The Kurita WR LMB was caught in 2009 and no doubt about it’s legal. The length, the girth, the weight, multiple photos. 

BASS president Ray Scott did everything he could to disallow the Kurita Bass, sending biologist to Japan to validate the fish that was examined with a fine tooth comb. The catch was authenticated by the IGFA.

Dottie was unintentionally snagged on top of the head with a white jig and several witnesses watched the catch and blew the whistle. Dottie was caught illegally by California regulations therefore disqualify the catch for IGFA rules.

The. Perry bass is the longest standing WR IGFA fish and the only record without a photo.

I don’t believe 25.01 lb Dottie will ever be topped.

Tom

[TnRiver46]

2 hours ago, schplurg said:

 

It was not officially weighed. There is no evidence of it's weight whatsoever

I’ve heard from several sources there was evidence that it was weighed. The evidence was 22 lbs 4 oz. There is even further evidence on what scale was used . Heck I’ve never seen a picture of Abe Lincoln next to a tape measure but I think he was 6’4”

[Tennessee Boy]

I’ve done a lot of reading on this fish because I think it’s one of the most interesting stories in bass fishing.  Two country boys go fishing way before the modern bass fishing craze and before there were world records.  They were just hoping to catch something for dinner.  One of them caught a big fish and a friend suggested he enter it in a magazine contest.  If not for that friend we would have never heard of George Perry and his fish.   The contest entry became a world record and George became famous.  It’s a great story with a lot of mysteries.  I’ve enjoyed this thread.  I’m also fascinated and a little surprised how emotional folks get on this subject.

[N Florida Mike]

I caught a 22 pound , 4 oz fish.

But it was a channel Cat. 

 

For the record, I think Perrys fish should stand. What else could he have done in a rural country town. 
Have y’all not seen the picture a lot of people think was the fish?  A different man than Perry was holding it, with a little boy standing there. Definitely a huge bass . Whether or not it was THE fish has long been the debate. The picture is easy to find on google. Here it is...

[Hook2Jaw]

16 hours ago, Catt said:

 

Accidentally foul hook but still 25 lbs, sounds like you wanna pick & choose records based on opinion.

 

Catt,  I love you and I appreciate every bit of advice you've given me, and I am going off my own personal opinion.  The Kurita fish, in my opinion, is the world record largemouth bass.  It is the heaviest bass ever caught that was not foul hooked off a bed.

[Tennessee Boy]

George Perry said that two photos were taken of the fish but he didn’t know what happened to them.  The photo with the little boy turned up in 2006.  The man in the photo is not Perry.   Another more mysterious photo was emailed to Bill Baab in 2013.  Baab is the outdoor writer at the Augusta Chronicle and has done more research on George Perry than anyone.  The email said the photo was found in a family barn in Florida.  It contained no further details and it’s unknown who sent it.  When Baab replied to the email he got a reply that the account was no longer active.  The photo shows Perry on one knee holding a fish.  Family members have confirming that the man is Perry and the date "June 2, 1932" is written on the photo. 
 

[WRB]

4 hours ago, N Florida Mike said:

I caught a 22 pound , 4 oz fish.

But it was a channel Cat. 

 

For the record, I think Perrys fish should stand. What else could he have done in a rural country town. 
Have y’all not seen the picture a lot of people think was the fish?  A different man than Perry was holding it, with a little boy standing there. Definitely a huge bass . Whether or not it was THE fish has long been the debate. The picture is easy to find on google. Here it is...

If you analyze the photo a few things jump out;

It’s afternoon daytime, Perry always stated it was rainy day and didn’t get back until early evening.

The boy would need to be over 4’ tall for the bass to be 32” long. The bass measure by using the head being 1/3 the length, The mans forearm, the boy the bass is approximately 28” long, mouth closed. If the girth was equal to the length it’ about 18 lbs, 80% girth it’s 15 lbs, hard to justify another 6 to 9 lbs.

It’s academic the Perry bass accepted as a IGFA World Record catch.

 

 

[soflabasser]

4 hours ago, Tennessee Boy said:

George Perry said that two photos were taken of the fish but he didn’t know what happened to them.  The photo with the little boy turned up in 2006.  The man in the photo is not Perry.   Another more mysterious photo was emailed to Bill Baab in 2013.  Baab is the outdoor writer at the Augusta Chronicle and has done more research on George Perry than anyone.  The email said the photo was found in a family barn in Florida.  It contained no further details and it’s unknown who sent it.  When Baab replied to the email he received a reply that the account was no longer active.  The photo shows Perry on one knee holding a fish.  Family members have confirming that the man is Perry and the date June 2, 1932 is written on the photo. 
 

It is amazing how small some 15-19 pound bass look in photos yet George Perry's 22 pound, 4 ounce bass looks over 20 pounds in the photo you mentioned. Even better is that he was not even trying to make the bass look big unlike most people these days. The mouth shows how huge this bass really was.

[Djenko]

On 6/10/2021 at 8:55 AM, NoShoes said:

As someone from Georgia, I have my doubts on it. Look at the biggest from the surrounding states (all known for big bass as well), and the next biggest bass is 18lbs, GA included. 
 

We have big bass here, not typically in the rivers though. 
 

I live about an hour and a half from where Perry caught it, the bass pro here has a replica of the fish. Very impressive by any measure. 

I mean Floridas unofficial record is 20.13lbs, I understand how big fish in places like Cali can exist because of the food sources they have(trout) but i dont know if places like Georgia have the capacity to support such large fish but it could've just been a freak of nature bass.

[J Francho]

The Perry bass's legitimacy doesn't really matter to me. Dottie and the Kurito bass prove that bigger is a likely possibility, and it's as simple as catching one. Good luck.