SI/DI versus Livescope difference

[mheichelbech]

I haven’t been able to find this, what is the difference between Side Imaging and/or Down Imaging and the Livescope (or Lowrance equivalent)?

 

Trying to research all this.

[Team9nine]

In general, side imaging is a thin beam that goes out almost 180 degrees to each side of the boat and works best while moving, usually 3-5 mph and shows things in high resolution to either side of you. Most commonly used off the back while driving, but some do use it off the troll motor.

 

Down imaging is also a thin hi-res beam that focuses more underneath the boat, more similar to 2D. Again, most frequently used off the back of the boat while moving under power slowly.

 

Forward Facing Sonar/Livescope/Active Target is a transducer that shoots a thin beam forward of it's location at a high frequency, most commonly off the troll motor, and is used to search for fish and objects by rotating and searching using the troll motor head or a separate pole installed up front. The main difference is the incredibly fast update rate that basically makes it a "live" refresh, like maybe watching an ultrasound of a baby where you can see everything moving in realtime. You can even watch your lures in relation to fish and cover objects on the screen as you work your baits, and see fish follow and hit them, or don't - lol. Doesn't work well with much speed or movement, and is more a point and shoot type application.

 

SLight difefrences with each brands specific units, but this should give you a general idea. Very easy to YouTube any of these and see plenty of videos of each in action on the water.

[TnRiver46]

For panoptics or live target, think of a flasher type unit like a vexilar but instead of shooting straight down an ice hole it can pan all around. And instead of displaying it as flashes, it turns it into a clear display and you can see fish moving on a screen. People have been watching fish approach their lures on units for a long time, but it was always directly under the ice or boat. Now they can scan forward while moving the boat around, effectively scanning 360 degrees. I also imagine the newer live units have a wider cone angle than older units? Not sure though. 

[mheichelbech]

14 hours ago, Team9nine said:

In general, side imaging is a thin beam that goes out almost 180 degrees to each side of the boat and works best while moving, usually 3-5 mph and shows things in high resolution to either side of you. Most commonly used off the back while driving, but some do use it off the troll motor.

 

Down imaging is also a thin hi-res beam that focuses more underneath the boat, more similar to 2D. Again, most frequently used off the back of the boat while moving under power slowly.

 

Forward Facing Sonar/Livescope/Active Target is a transducer that shoots a thin beam forward of it's location at a high frequency, most commonly off the troll motor, and is used to search for fish and objects by rotating and searching using the troll motor head or a separate pole installed up front. The main difference is the incredibly fast update rate that basically makes it a "live" refresh, like maybe watching an ultrasound of a baby where you can see everything moving in realtime. You can even watch your lures in relation to fish and cover objects on the screen as you work your baits, and see fish follow and hit them, or don't - lol. Doesn't work well with much speed or movement, and is more a point and shoot type application.

 

SLight difefrences with each brands specific units, but this should give you a general idea. Very easy to YouTube any of these and see plenty of videos of each in action on the water.

Thanks.  This is pretty much what I thought was the deal.  If I get it correctly, only down imaging is useful with the big motor(going slow) moving around...correct?

 

Are there scenarios where the si/di would be more desirable than the forward facing?

[Team9nine]

8 minutes ago, mheichelbech said:

Thanks.  This is pretty much what I thought was the deal.  If I get it correctly, only down imaging is useful with the big motor(going slow) moving around...correct?

 

Are there scenarios where the si/di would be more desirable than the forward facing?

 

SI and DI are both better under power and moving. Consider them more as search tools. FFS is more a troll motor approach, once you are on a spot to actually look at and cast to fish and cover and watch your lure in relationship to both in realtime.

[A-Jay]

Just now, Team9nine said:

 

SI and DI are both better under power and moving. Consider them more as search tools. FFS is more a troll motor approach, once you are on a spot to actually look at and cast to fish and cover and watch your lure in relationship to both in realtime.

This is still pretty hard for me to wrap my head around. 

There's a very good chance that sooner rather than later,

this is only going to get 'better'.

And I thought Maxwell Smart's shoe phone was the wave of the future.

A-Jay

 

[Team9nine]

And the Jetson’s said we'd all be flying around in cars by now ?

 

It’s an interesting debate in the sport right now - has technology gone too far. Notable proponents on both sides of the fence. I’m standing on one side, feet firmly planted, but looking over the fence and wandering myself. 

[TOXIC]

I look at it this way, electronics have always been about locating and seeing depth, structure and fish.  Technology hasn’t changed that much from the old 2d sonar.  It’s just gotten clearer and more defined.  Just because I can see a fish swimming doesn’t mean I can make it bite.  I understand the front facing give a different perspective as well as the 360 units but I don’t feel its that much of a “game changer” to be debated as unfair in tournaments and for me worth the $$$$$ investment.  

[gim]

9 minutes ago, TOXIC said:

I look at it this way, electronics have always been about locating and seeing depth, structure and fish.  Technology hasn’t changed that much from the old 2d sonar.  It’s just gotten clearer and more defined.  Just because I can see a fish swimming doesn’t mean I can make it bite.  I understand the front facing give a different perspective as well as the 360 units but I don’t feel its that much of a “game changer” to be debated as unfair in tournaments and for me worth the $$$$$ investment.  

I mostly agree. The difference with live sonar IMO really comes into play when ice fishing. It’s popular up here and it has drastically reduced the amount of time required to locate schools of fish like crappies or sunfish under the ice. You used to have to drill a ton of holes and stay mobile to find active fish when ice fishing. Those days are going away. Live sonar allows ice anglers to find them much quicker and with less energy. Then they exploit it and often catch a bunch, and of course they don’t release them since virtually all ice anglers are not in it to catch and release.

 

I don’t think it will affect bass populations as a whole since most have a strong catch and release ethic anyways, but it has and will continue to affect populations of certain species that are often targeted to harvest.

[TOXIC]

4 minutes ago, gimruis said:

I mostly agree. The difference with live sonar IMO really comes into play when ice fishing. It’s popular up here and it has drastically reduced the amount of time required to locate schools of fish like crappies or sunfish under the ice. You used to have to drill a ton of holes and stay mobile to find active fish when ice fishing. Those days are going away. Live sonar allows ice anglers to find them much quicker and with less energy. Then they exploit it and often catch a bunch, and of course they don’t release them since virtually all ice anglers are not in it to catch and release.

 

I don’t think it will affect bass populations as a whole since most have a strong catch and release ethic anyways, but it has and will continue to affect populations of certain species that are often targeted to harvest.

So is what you are saying is that the ice fishermen drill a pilot hole and then scan the area for schools of fish?  Do they then move over them and drill another hole?  

[gim]

50 minutes ago, TOXIC said:

So is what you are saying is that the ice fishermen drill a pilot hole and then scan the area for schools of fish?  Do they then move over them and drill another hole?  

Yes. It’s primarily basin fishing where schools of fish roam in the winter under ice. They can drill one or two holes that are not directly over fish, and then simply move on top of them.

 

Prior to this it was more of a waiting or guessing game. The permanent shacks generally don’t utilize this technology because they aren’t designed to be mobile, but for the guys that use flip over portable shacks (or no shack at at all) it’s deadly. The DNR here in MN has already reduced sunfish limits in 95 lakes from 20 to 5.

[mheichelbech]

On 3/27/2021 at 12:39 PM, TOXIC said:

I look at it this way, electronics have always been about locating and seeing depth, structure and fish.  Technology hasn’t changed that much from the old 2d sonar.  It’s just gotten clearer and more defined.  Just because I can see a fish swimming doesn’t mean I can make it bite.  I understand the front facing give a different perspective as well as the 360 units but I don’t feel its that much of a “game changer” to be debated as unfair in tournaments and for me worth the $$$$$ investment.  

I agree after fishing a tournament with a guy using all 3 of the goodies yesterday.   Execellent tools to find and see cover but they definitely don’t make the fish bite!

 

What I thought was one of the best parts was how we could see rock piles and see how far they were from the boat and if fish were positioned around the rock piles.  However it was still encumbent upon us to properly position the boat and make them bite which they didn’t.

[Team9nine]

I try and explain that very thing to all the kids (and adults) coming through the gate at the trout pond, too - just because you can see them doesn’t mean they’ll bite. It’s not as easy as you think 

 

[jbsoonerfan]

You obviously can't make them bite, but seeing where they are in and around cover sure makes it easier to "try" to catch them. I have Mega 360 and I use it to find cover, but I can't see the fish in real time. I think the guys that are able to see how the fish are reacting to their bait help as well. I have been to the lake the last 2 weekends and have seen a number of guys just staring at their screen. I don't even know if they were fishing or just watching. LOL

[TOXIC]

I will admit that the first time I ever saw a fish hit my lure on my graph was with down scan and a dropshot.  There was a noticeable delay (older gen 2 lowrance) but you could see the fish come to the bait.  Have seen the same thing bouncing spoons under the boat.  The big advantage with the forward looking units is that you can see the cover/structure and if there are fish on it.  Definite time savings.  

[gim]

I have a question about livescope for those that have seen it in person. Is it mostly open water effective or can you see fish in thick cover too? For example, if there’s a big patch of thick weeds, and you cast into a pocket, I assume it’s not going to pick that up amongst all the vegetation, is it?

[padon]

idk. i have nothing against guys using forward facing, may even get it myself one day. but for me it just doesnt feel right.i mean i tell my son im taking him fishing so he doesnt stare at a screen all day , then we go to the lake and stare at a screen all day.