How to cover water but with finesse?

[DitchPanda]

3in grub on a ball head

Ned rig

[Bluebasser86]

I can cover a ton of water with a Ned rig, even with my 1/16oz heads I use.

 

 

[RDB]

4 hours ago, Luke Barnes said:

I'll add more to my original post here. I'm terrible at line watching and feeling those tiny little sips of the lure into the fish's mouth. Probably why I am not that good of a finesse angler in all honesty. I'm decent at detecting the bite on a drop shot but that's about it. 

 

The pond i was at yesterday I couldn't see any visible cover or structure. It was super windy and murky water. Less than 1 ft visibility. Its a fairly large pond so would take quite a while to cover every inch and I dont have that kind of time. 

 

The Neko sounds like the quickest way to cover ground while still being somewhat finesse I guess. Ive only thrown it once so i really don't know. I always have a ned tied on but usually fish it slow. I guess I could speed it up. I'm just having a really tough year. Last year was so much better for me by this time. 

The conditions you mentioned do not set up very well for finesse fishing.  Less than 1 foot visibility, super windy, not able to see what you are fishing are all situations where finesse presentations are not super effective.  Someone may try to say that Ike got out fished by another fisherman using finesse in pea soup or one time I had a great day doing this but the reality is that finesse is better suited with better visibility (they have to find your small bait to eat it) and light baits and line can be difficult to fish correctly in high winds.  In my opinion, under those conditions you would have been better off going even larger and louder in your bait choices.

[RDB]

10 hours ago, TnRiver46 said:

even the tactical bassin guys, who use the word finesse as much as anyone, break fishing into two categories: reaction or finesse .

Reaction is a motivation, finesse is a style, they are very different.  Bass feed based on hunger or reaction, both of which can be achieved using finesse. Techniques within certain styles (I.e. drop shot) are ways to trigger one of the feeding motivations.  Your choice of style and technique will be influenced by conditions and fish motivation.  Breaking fishing into the 2 categories of reaction or finesse is like saying the reason I hit someone is out of anger or with a baseball bat ?.

[Catt]

Every strike is a reaction strike: bass sees lure...bass reacts!

 

Finesse: refinement of workmanship; skillful handling of a situation: adroit maneuvering

 

Adroit: having or showing skill, cleverness, or resourcefulness in handling situations.

 

Finesse fishing doesn't necessarily mean small or slow, it's about picking an area apart.

 

Kevin VanDam finesse fishes with power baits, he skillfully picks an area apart by whatever means necessary.

 

[NHBull]

9 hours ago, Bassjam2000 said:

Bubba shot uses stout gear and heavier line which is hardly finesse, perhaps you meant powershotting which is drop shotting modified by using a heavier weight but the same gear and line as usual which should meet the op’s criteria.

I stand corrected.....I throw mine on a spinning gear and it is just heavier and faster DS

[TnRiver46]

Covering water slowly or quickly? I guess that depends on how much time you have to fish 

[Fishes in trees]

Original poster - sounds a little bit like whining.  Oh poor me - the places I have to fish are pressured.  Power fishing doesn't work.   Finesse fishing is soooo slow.   Help me help me.

 

In my opinion, your primary issue is between your ears.  Fishing pressures water - you might have to change your expectations.  In real pressured waters, a fish or two per day is an accomplishment.   The easy answer is to try different stuff.   Consider finesse fishing as more of an attitude toward bait presentation rather than specific baits & gear & stuff like that.

 

If you're looking for specific structures in a pond, perhaps one of those depth finders made for bank fishermen, with a castable transducer.   This will literally cover the water and allow you to make more educated guesses about where the highest priority spots to throw might me.  Back in the day, when I was a meat fishing bush hippie, I wish I would have had one of those toys.   

What I did back in the day was throw a Brewer Slider worm as far as I could, work it back while polishing the rocks, and just try to pay attention to strike detection.   Back in the day, I found the more I paid attention to that, the better I got at it.

 

To address the question "How do I cover the water using finesse techniques?"

The answer is - you just do it.   Don't feel like you've got to cover X amount of water to be successful.   You cover the water that you can cover in the amount of time you got, to the extent that you feel you've "covered" that water.  I'd say , "slow down & smell the roses " but every time I slow down to smell the roses, my allergies kick in, so that isn't really a good analogy.

 

Other than that - don't have an answer.

[galyonj]

4 minutes ago, Fishes in trees said:

If you're looking for specific structures in a pond, perhaps one of those depth finders made for bank fishermen, with a castable transducer.

 

I've given some serious thought to getting one of those things. I hate dragging more junk to the lake with me, but I would very much like to make more informed decisions on the water.

[RDB]

4 hours ago, Catt said:

Every strike is a reaction strike: bass sees lure...bass reacts!

 

Finesse: refinement of workmanship; skillful handling of a situation: adroit maneuvering

 

Adroit: having or showing skill, cleverness, or resourcefulness in handling situations.

 

Finesse fishing doesn't necessarily mean small or slow, it's about picking an area apart.

 

Kevin VanDam finesse fishes with power baits, he skillfully picks an area apart by whatever means necessary.

 

I guess if you want to split hairs, life is just reactions.  What I was saying and what you will hear on every tour (including our regional tour) is that either bass will feed out of hunger or you have to find a way get them to strike (curiosity, anger, surprise, etc.). In other words, react when their inclination is not to feed.  Just this week at Pickwick you heard multiple pros talk about the slow fishing and changing techniques to try to elicit a reaction strike.  Not my term, you will hear it from the mouth of every pro.

[Steelhead]

10 hours ago, Bluebasser86 said:

I can cover a ton of water with a Ned rig, even with my 1/16oz heads I use.

 

 

 

When I'm working water 20' - 30' I'll bump it up to 3/32oz.

[FishinBuck07]

11 hours ago, Bass_Fishing_Socal said:

Neko rig is a very fun way to fish. It is very versatile technique, can fish fast or slow, can use any type worm or even creature like brush hog, can fish effectively in deep or shallow water. It is open hook technique so can use lighter line, yet less snag than any technique required weight. The most of all, the bites are so varies and very challenging to detect the bite. As long as you keep tension on the line you would know it is a bite but to hook and land them is another thing. The way you keep moving/shaking the lure make you feel more active than said dead sticking or dragging, but you would get tired fast so comfortable and light setup is a must.

If I want to fish slow or dead sticking, I will use Zman either ZinkerZ or Finessez, shallow to medium I use 6” Roboworm, for deeper I go with Senko. I pretty much use one weight about 3/32oz (2.5 grams). Most of the fish I caught from spinning setup last year come from Neko Rig (close to 100 fish).

This one caught two days ago.

 

This is my rig.

Look at you with all the out of the box thinking!  I may have to steal these ideas!!!  

11 hours ago, Bass_Fishing_Socal said:

Neko rig is a very fun way to fish. It is very versatile technique, can fish fast or slow, can use any type worm or even creature like brush hog, can fish effectively in deep or shallow water. It is open hook technique so can use lighter line, yet less snag than any technique required weight. The most of all, the bites are so varies and very challenging to detect the bite. As long as you keep tension on the line you would know it is a bite but to hook and land them is another thing. The way you keep moving/shaking the lure make you feel more active than said dead sticking or dragging, but you would get tired fast so comfortable and light setup is a must.

If I want to fish slow or dead sticking, I will use Zman either ZinkerZ or Finessez, shallow to medium I use 6” Roboworm, for deeper I go with Senko. I pretty much use one weight about 3/32oz (2.5 grams). Most of the fish I caught from spinning setup last year come from Neko Rig (close to 100 fish).

This one caught two days ago.

 

This is my rig.

Look at you with all the out of the box thinking!  I may have to steal these ideas!!!  

[RDB]

2 hours ago, Fishes in trees said:

Original poster - sounds a little bit like whining.  Oh poor me - the places I have to fish are pressured.  Power fishing doesn't work.   Finesse fishing is soooo slow.   Help me help me.

I don’t think it’s whining...it sounds like frustration which is an emotion I think all fishermen can relate to.  I have been there a thousand times but was to probably to proud to ask for help.  I credit the OP for asking for feedback from other anglers.

[Fishes in trees]

  to RDB - fair enough - perhaps I was harsh.  Whenever fishing issues get stuck between my ears, I turn to my trusted friend  -  IPA - and maybe his acquaintance  -  Bud.

[king fisher]

Though not a fineness technique, a small inline spinner can be used as a search bait in any pond, clear or muddy.  Once fish are located, slower bottom bumping finesse techniques may help you catch more.

[RDB]

28 minutes ago, Fishes in trees said:

  to RDB - fair enough - perhaps I was harsh.  Whenever fishing issues get stuck between my ears, I turn to my trusted friend  -  IPA - and maybe his acquaintance  -  Bud.

Lol...their neighbors Jack and Jim can be pretty helpful as well.

[Catt]

2 hours ago, RDB said:

Just this week at Pickwick you heard multiple pros talk about the slow fishing and changing techniques to try to elicit a reaction strike.

 

Exactly my point ?

 

How did they accomplish that?

 

With a multitude of lures, even Bill Lowen's jig bite were reaction strikes. Some are just fished faster than others.

[RDB]

1 hour ago, Catt said:

 

Exactly my point ?

 

How did they accomplish that?

 

With a multitude of lures, even Bill Lowen's jig bite were reaction strikes. Some are just fished faster than others.

Fair enough...I’ll own the misunderstanding as we are probably saying the same thing.  At the end of the day, everything is technically a reaction but in my view, reactions can be bucketed based on a desire to feed reaction or a non-desire to feed reaction.  Three examples to illustrate:

1.  I would venture to guess that 99% of female bass caught off of beds are non-active feeders.  2.  There are many times when the only time a bass will hit your lure is if it deflects off of something.  3.  If there wasn’t a distinction between feeding v. non-feeding, it would be fruitless to winter fish as bass can go many days without feeding.

Like I said, I think we are on the same page.  I think the hang up is the word reaction and maybe it’s thrown around too loosely.  I believe it was Ott Defoe during the last MLF tournament that said on camera that the fish had become inactive and he needed to trigger a reaction bite.  Pro’s say that all the time, as do I, but I guess technically it is a little lazy.

 

Edit:  One last point to refer to your jig example, jig weight (rate of fall) is often changed to elicit non-active strikes.

 

 

[Deleted account]

1 hour ago, king fisher said:

Though not a fineness technique, a small inline spinner can be used as a search bait in any pond, clear or muddy.  Once fish are located, slower bottom bumping finesse techniques may help you catch more.

1/4 oz with an Oklahoma blade and a #5 feathered treble. I spun one up and went out yesterday, and it worked well, went back over the area with a mini chatter and a 4" t-rigged Senko (cause sometimes you gotta watch paint dry) and mopped up a bunch.

[WRB]

Pond bass usually are within a casting distance from shore.

Unless the pond is a bowl without any places the bass can ambush prey the bass shouldn’t be that difficult to locate?

Finesse spinning presentations are almost limitless.

How often do these bass see or get caught on a broken back original Rapala minnow, deadly pond lure.

Bottom contact my favorite is a Split Shot or Slip Shot rig, read the Split Shot recent Split Shot thread.

Start anywhere you know bass are located and simply fan cast a complete 1/2 circle areas then move to the next area and repeat all the way around the pond.

Tom

[GetFishorDieTryin]

16 hours ago, RDB said:

I might as well be the oddball and say that I don’t think that finesse fishing is just about dragging and not reeling.  While I will agree that when most people finesse fish, they are using things like drop shots, etc., I think most would agree that a spy bait is a finesse technique or a small hair jig is a finesse technique and those are moving applications.  To me, finesse fishing is about the presentation.  Downsized tackle, downsized lure, trying to present the bait as natural and non threatening as possible.  Iaconelli says that you can finesse fish a large crankbait but I haven’t quite figured that one out.

I agree, I think it has more to do with the gear and the way your fishing the bait, using precision over power.

[GetFishorDieTryin]

On 3/23/2021 at 2:50 PM, Luke Barnes said:

I'm about over trying to power fish in these pressured public ponds. The fish see it all and I'm tired of getting skunked. I know downsizing and finesse is a good way to coax pressured bass into biting and I have a few dedicated spinning combos for finesse. My question though is unless I have a hard target like a lay down or weeds, how do I cover alot of water to find the fish but using finesse techniques? Wacky, Ned, drop shot all are slow and methodical and would take me an entire day to cover a whole pond going slow. I want to be able to find them, then throw the slow stuff to get more bites. Any advice?

When things get tough small swimbaits are a great option, they draw lots of bites and allow you cover water from top to bottom depending how you fish them.  I use the lightest JH I can get away with usually 1/20 or 1/16.  My favorites are 3" Easy Shiners and Swing Impacts, the weight of the dense plastic helps casting distance.  7'+ ML F or XF is ideal, but most ML DS rods will work well enough.  If I can get away with I like to use 8-10 lb braid - 6-10lb leader.  If you want to go with a FC mainline 6 or 7lb is ideal.

[galyonj]

6 minutes ago, GetFishorDieTryin said:

When things get tough small swimbaits are a great option, they draw lots of bites and allow you cover water from top to bottom depending how you fish them.

 

Every time I come back to this thread, I think that something like a small paddletail, or a curlytail grub, or a tube might be nice.

 

For some reason I doubt pond fish see many tubes, but I might be wrong.

[fishwizzard]

19 hours ago, Bass_Fishing_Socal said:

 

This is my rig.

That is a very crafty way to make screw-in weights. 

[Luke Barnes]

So many responses I cant quote them all. But thank you for the advice everyone, except that cranky old codger who suggests I drink to solve my problems fishing. 5 weeks sober today!!

 

Anyways I really think for my style and where I fish the Neko would be a very good choice. What you all mentioned about the variety of worms, speeds, retrieves, it makes sense to me.

 

Also @WRB what you said about picking apart an area rang true. The last few years I really worked whatever area I was in with different lures and presentations but this year I thought maybe I spend too much time in one place and need to move more. Well ive done that. Last year I did way way better by this time of year really dissecting one or two spots and not trying to cover the whole pond. 

 

So it culminates to slow down on the moving spots and try a Neko more. Also work the other techniques thoroughly before hopping spots.