Daiwa T-Wing, FG knots, and leader length

[Junk Fisherman]

How long of a leader do you tie? In the super clear Great Lakes, do you think an 8’ leader is long enough? I go 12’-15’ on spinning reels but I am wondering about baitcasters. The reason I am asking is because even the thinnest FG knot I tie still hangs up too often going through the Daiwa T-wing. I suspect this will weaken the knot and cause failure.  It’s not an issue with the traditional round line guide on other baitcasters. I‘m considering getting my first Shimano (Curado 70MGL) in a long time just to solve this issue. Any thoughts?

[redmeansdistortion]

Lifelong Great Lakes fisherman here, been fishing Erie, Huron, Michigan, and St Clair for 35 years.  In my experience, you aren't going to need a leader.  Just tie direct, the bass aren't picky.  I've even caught plenty of steelhead from the piers using straight braid, and those fish are known to be line shy.  

[Deleted account]

The best T-wing knot is T-wing not...

[Dens228]

Five feet or so.......My leader knot never makes it to the reel. 

[Sir Shamsalot]

Usually I just use a straight line combination. Bit, on my leader rigged rods for close work, I'll use braid to 7 to 13ft leader. I just keep the knot out of the reel. 

 

Never did make sense to me to use a leader/braid combination on a horizontal presentation where one uses the FC to keep the fish from seeing the line. Didn't you just run a bunch of braid just past them before the FC got there?

 

[Michigander]

When I tie a fresh leader, the knot is an inch or two forward of the reel, never on the spool. 

[Junger]

What line are you using? I use 40lb braid to 17lb fluoro with some of my T-winged Daiwas, and never actually got hung up. Sure I feel the bump, but that's it. Also, whenever I break off, it's usually at the lure knot, or at a nic in the line. I've never broken off at the leader knot using a FG or Alberto knot.

[BobbyBudnick]

I use long leaders, 12-15 feet. With my t-wing daiwa's, I use 30 pound power pro braid to 12 pound trilene big game mono. I use Shin's knot to connect the lines, and it is thin enough that it runs through the t-wing without any resistance. 

[FrankN209]

I have a 6' 12lb flouro to 30lb braid fg knot.

[Bankc]

22 hours ago, Michigander said:

When I tie a fresh leader, the knot is an inch or two forward of the reel, never on the spool. 

That's what I do.  Though it's not to keep the knot away from the T-wing (I use 30lb braid and sometimes I'll use a 10-12lb leader and never had issues with my Tatulas).  It's to keep the knot off the spool so that when I cast and hover my thumb just above the spool, the knot doesn't wear out the pad of thumb.

 

And even that length is more so I don't have to retie my leader as I switch baits throughout the day.  I won't retie a leader until it's down to a foot or two.  Fish aren't smart.  

[Michigander]

1 minute ago, Bankc said:

That's what I do.  Though it's not to keep the knot away from the T-wing (I use 30lb braid and sometimes I'll use a 10-12lb leader and never had issues with my Tatulas).  It's to keep the knot off the spool so that when I cast and hover my thumb just above the spool, the knot doesn't wear out the pad of thumb.

Yet another reason to keep the knot off the spool!

[Junk Fisherman]

47 minutes ago, Bankc said:

That's what I do.  Though it's not to keep the knot away from the T-wing (I use 30lb braid and sometimes I'll use a 10-12lb leader and never had issues with my Tatulas).  It's to keep the knot off the spool so that when I cast and hover my thumb just above the spool, the knot doesn't wear out the pad of thumb.

 

And even that length is more so I don't have to retie my leader as I switch baits throughout the day.  I won't retie a leader until it's down to a foot or two.  Fish aren't smart.  

 

I know no one here has mentioned it but others besides myself do have issues with an FG knot getting hung up on the T-Wing.  It rarely gets hung up on the circular level-wind reels I have.  I fish very clear water so I want a little longer than 7'-8' of leader line.  Think I will make it easy on myself and keep the Daiwa Tatulas for straight fluoro.  Probably get the new Curado with the circular levelwind for braid and leaders.  Thanks everyone for the info.  

[EzyEric]

9 hours ago, Junk Fisherman said:

 

I know no one here has mentioned it but others besides myself do have issues with an FG knot getting hung up on the T-Wing.  It rarely gets hung up on the circular level-wind reels I have.  I fish very clear water so I want a little longer than 7'-8' of leader line.  Think I will make it easy on myself and keep the Daiwa Tatulas for straight fluoro.  Probably get the new Curado with the circular levelwind for braid and leaders.  Thanks everyone for the info.  

I'm with you on this. Live in Michigan and fish mostly ultra clear water. Had the issue the very first time I took my first Tatula out.  I resorted to using T Wing on my straight floro setups and just a shorter leader on the ones I still needed braid to flouro.  I really had that this has hinder the choices I have available with my current reels.  I just got a Fuego Ct to try since that's basically the Tatula without the T Wing. I think I see more Shimanos in my future as well. At least for the general use rods.

[softwateronly]

Haven't spent that much time with my tatula 200 and 300 yet, but the t wing on the 300 is significantly better at handling my fg knot, feels just like my shimanos.  Now, it's to the point where I keep my 200's leader out of the reel.  My shimano's don't mind the connection knot at all and this has definitely impacted which reels I'm looking at buying next.  

 

Giving up on braid to leader doesn't seem like a satisfactory choice, personally.  I made most of my rod decisions, I lean toward softer tips and moderate/fast actions, based on the lack of stretch of braid.   

 

scott

[Happybeerbuzz]

I start out with about 3 wing spans of leader which I am estimating to be over 12'.  I use an FG knot and wind the knot onto the spool.  I have not noticed a problem.  I will use that leader until there is about a rod length left after  reties.

 

I have one Daiwa TWS reel.  The only problem I have had is that during the retrieve, I feel the knot pass through the guide going back into the spool.  I did not care for it so I limited the gauge of the leader to about 15# mono.  Eventually I just started using straight braid with that reel and made it my flipping/pitching/frog reel.  

[MickD]

I think if your FG is getting hung up you may need to do two things.  First, make sure you are trimming the leader end really close to braid, then tie a few more half hitches to finish the knot.   The half hitches won't make the knot any bigger and may finish the end so it doesn't get hung up.  Worth a try.

 

But the best solution is to keep the knot out of the reel, and I don't think you need leaders that are longer than the rod length.  I never use one longer than 5 feet and have not seen anything that has made me think it was too short.  I think that leader invisibility is much more important than leader length.  How far away from the lure do fish look?  Not very far, in my opinion.

[Revival]

If you keep your leader the same length as your rod, your leader knot will always be on the outside of your reel.

[Bankc]

On 2/16/2021 at 10:38 AM, Junk Fisherman said:

 

I know no one here has mentioned it but others besides myself do have issues with an FG knot getting hung up on the T-Wing.  It rarely gets hung up on the circular level-wind reels I have.  I fish very clear water so I want a little longer than 7'-8' of leader line.  Think I will make it easy on myself and keep the Daiwa Tatulas for straight fluoro.  Probably get the new Curado with the circular levelwind for braid and leaders.  Thanks everyone for the info.  

Or get the Fuego.  Honestly, I don't think the T-wing adds much.  And the extra ball bearings of the Tatula are in the handle, so if you wanted, you could upgrade the handle and pretty much have a Tatula with a regular levelwind.  Or Curado's are fine reels too.  

[MickD]

17 minutes ago, Bankc said:

Honestly, I don't think the T-wing adds much.

I think you're right.  Which if true would lead one to believe that all the schemes of rod-building that try to get the line through the guides with a minimum of direction changes don't add much either.  If the big change of direction going through the first guide (the one on the reel) doesn't seem to be a problem then the gentle changes out on the rod are inconsequential.  This doesn't mean that spiral wraps don't make sense.  They do for eliminating the torque in the hand.  But as far as which spiral system is better on the cast, it really doesn't matter.  They all work fine.

[michaelb]

I just bought a tatula, and don't think I will ever have a long enough leader to matter. But I am curious about how and why this happens? How does a knot travel better through a small hole at an angle vs going through a large slot at less of an angle? Is it catching on the vertical edges of the bottom middle slot? The tatula's vertical slot where the line lays after casting looks more narrow than the width of the hole of my other reel.

[Junk Fisherman]

37 minutes ago, michaelb said:

I just bought a tatula, and don't think I will ever have a long enough leader to matter. But I am curious about how and why this happens? How does a knot travel better through a small hole at an angle vs going through a large slot at less of an angle? Is it catching on the vertical edges of the bottom middle slot? The tatula's vertical slot where the line lays after casting looks more narrow than the width of the hole of my other reel.

 

Not sure about the angle but the slot on the Tatula is definitely more narrow than the circular levelwind of other reels I own.  I use Team Daiwa X reels with the circular inlet and I can reel the FG knot onto the spool with no problems.     

[EzyEric]

6 hours ago, michaelb said:

I just bought a tatula, and don't think I will ever have a long enough leader to matter. But I am curious about how and why this happens? How does a knot travel better through a small hole at an angle vs going through a large slot at less of an angle? Is it catching on the vertical edges of the bottom middle slot? The tatula's vertical slot where the line lays after casting looks more narrow than the width of the hole of my other reel.

Mine usually caught on the top of the T-Wing. It's edges are fairly sharp metal ad opposed to ceramic smooth rounded edges in most other reels.  

 

I've found filling the spool less than normal helps reduce hitting the top but still it's not perfect.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Deephaven]

If you need a 10' leader perhaps just running straight FC makes sense.

[APK62]