Grips: Carbon Fiber?

[Michigander]

I'm planning two builds for my new X-ray blanks Hopefully they arrive early in the new year. With NFCs reputation regarding speed and holiday postal overload, I am buckled in to be patient.

 

That being said, I have plenty of time to deep dive on components. So I am trying to figure out what the functional differences are between the carbon fiber grips (like the G2s, CFX, or NFC soft touches) and Winn Grips.

 

So other than:

-Price

-Weight, with a Winn Grips setup being on average ten grams heavier (roughly two US nickels)

-Generally smooth and rigid carbon vs soft and grippy Winn

 

What are the performance differences? 

[kayaking_kev]

I can't quite help you with the functionality of those handle options yet, but I have recently bought all of them. 

 

I have the G2 Carbon Full Handle for the X-Ray MB-736 and have it installed already, but haven't fished with it yet.

 

I have the G2 Carbon Split Grip Handle for the X-Ray MB-733 as a spinning rod and it's dry fitted right now, but I'm waiting to receive the G2 trim fittings that I had to order after dry fitting and measuring the blank to get get the right size. The G2 Full Handle comes with the trim fittings already, the G2 Split Grip Handle, you have to order them separately. 

 

I have the CFX Full Handle Grips for a X-Ray MB-7109 build, but have not started building it yet.

 

I have the black Split Grip Winn Grips I just put on a Phenix X-10 Composite build a couple of days ago, but have not fished with it yet.

 

----------------------------------------------

I can give you some of my initial impressions and thoughts on them though.

 

The G2 Handles seem like they will be the most sensitive just by going by some small testing. The full grip handles only have two small arbor rings inside and the rest is hollow inside and the split grips only have one small arbor ring in each section. It reduces weight and I think reflects vibration better than any other type of handle by far.

But, they have their down sides. They have no grip and might get slippery when wet. The other downside is you need a AT G2 reel seat, which are awesome, but don't come in specific id sizes. So I had to get an insert for them because I wanted the exposed reel seats. Now, on one of them I didn't use an insert, but instead used a Carbon Fiber Rod Skin with some finish on top to make it thick enough so the reel seat fit tightly. FYI, I have the G2 CCT Razor and Blade Carbon reel seats, which are the best two offered and while both are awesome, the Razor is the bomb.

 

As far as the CFX Handles goes, those are the only ones I haven't reamed out and at least dry fitted yet, but they look nice, have some grip to them and are light, so I'm sure I'm going to like them and I don't see much of a down side to them.

 

Winn Grips of course are going to give you the most grip and they look pretty good too, but I think they will be the less sensitive out of the three, hence why I put them on my crankbait rod. They were also the messiest to ream out and I had to keep cleaning my reamer.

 

My thoughts were to put the G2 Carbons on my two setup that I wanted the most sensitivity out of, MB-736 and MB-733. I wanted some comfort, but still wanted that sensitivity for my power rod, so I went with the CFX. For my crankbait rod I wanted grip more so than sensitivity, especially with it being the rod that will be in my kayak 100% of the time and the probability that it will get wet the most. Plus it will be my jerkbait rod for now and I don't want a slippery handle for that technique.

 

So for me they all have their advantages, with the CFX kind of being the middle ground with both grip and sensitivity. But, if you asked my wife, she would choose the Winn Grips because she likes the way they feel.

 

 

Top to bottom 

 

X-Ray MB-7109 Blank

 

CFX Full Handle Grip + EC-22 Butt Cap + AT G2 Vibe Reel Seat + Fuji Alconite Guides, Spiral Wrapped ( Awaiting G2 Insert for Vibe Reel Seat)

 

Phenix X-10 Composite Blank + Spit Grip Winn Grips + AT G2 CCT Razor Reel Seat + G2 Insert + G2 Carbon Foregrip Sleeve + Fuji SiC Guides

 

X-Ray MB-733 + G2 Carbon Split Grip (Bushido) + AT CCT AERO Reel Seat + Fuji Titanium SiC Guides ( Awaiting Trim Fittings for Handle)

 

X-Ray MB-736 + G2 Carbon Full Handle 9" (Matte) + AT CCT Blade Reel Seat + Carbon Fiber Rod Skin under Reel Seat + G2 Carbon Foregrip Sleeve + Fuji Titanium Torzite Guides, Spiral Wrapped

 

[S Hovanec]

The G2 casting also fits Fuji ECS 16 and 17 seats.

[Michigander]

1 hour ago, S Hovanec said:

The G2 casting also fits Fuji ECS 16 and 17 seats.

If I went G2 and non AT reel seat, it'll most likely be a Pac Bay Ultra Lite skeleton seat. I like that seat quite a bit.

@kayaking_kev ok, so the Bushido grips are the non-patterned ones, that's good to know. It was unclear in the product images I was reviewing which was which. I'm not a huge fan of the weave pattern.

[kayaking_kev]

39 minutes ago, Michigander said:

 

@kayaking_kev ok, so the Bushido grips are the non-patterned ones, that's good to know.

 

Correct. And, the Bushido isn't as gray as the pic made it appear, my camera had the flash on. It will also look better when the trim pieces are inserted on them.

[Michigander]

36 minutes ago, kayaking_kev said:

 

Correct. And, the Bushido isn't as gray as the pic made it appear, my camera had the flash on. It will also look better when the trim pieces are inserted on them.

So it feels kind of like a PVC pipe then?

[Michigander]

I just saw the promo video for the new AT Tsuka reel seat and that looks pretty sweet as well!

[kayaking_kev]

 

5 hours ago, Michigander said:

So it feels kind of like a PVC pipe then?

It's hard, but very thin, not near as thick as PVC. I do have some concerns that it could even shatter if it hits against something hard enough due to them being mostly hollow inside and being very thin, but that's what probably makes them so sensitive.

[Michigander]

Just now, kayaking_kev said:

 

It's hard, but very thin, not near as thick as PVC. I do have some concerns that it could even shatter if it hits against something hard enough due to them being mostly hollow inside and being very thin, but that's what probably makes them so sensitive.

I guess I meant more like the feel of PVC, smooth and rigid?

 

I'm quite interested in this type of grip, never had one. I guess if it shatters I can always Winn wrap it, lol.

[kayaking_kev]

4 hours ago, Michigander said:

I just saw the promo video for the new AT Tsuka reel seat and that looks pretty sweet as well!

I though you didn't like the weave pattern? It would look good with my Matte G2 Handle, but I like the exposed carbon seats. The Blade is nice, but the Razor is just flat out awesome, and for spinning the AERO carbon with the palm support is really comfortable.

[Michigander]

4 minutes ago, kayaking_kev said:

I though you didn't like the weave pattern? It would look good with my Matte G2 Handle, but I like the exposed carbon seats. The Blade is nice, but the Razor is just flat out awesome, and for spinning the AERO carbon with the palm support is really comfortable.

I thought I saw the plain version in a promo shot... Maybe I was mistaken. If it's only weave I will pass, lol.

 

I've got a Razor on my bench for another build. Seems pretty cool. I'm more of a skeleton seat guy though.

[kayaking_kev]

10 minutes ago, Michigander said:

I guess I meant more like the feel of PVC, smooth and rigid?

 

I'm quite interested in this type of grip, never had one. I guess if it shatters I can always Winn wrap it, lol.

They're very smooth, even the Matte pattern ones are smooth, you can't feel any pattern on them. You would probably have to whack them pretty good to get them to crack, but it is a minor concern.

 

I did a lot of research on them before buying them and couldn't find anyone who owned them and didn't like them, I just can't wait to fish them and see for myself, but I had to order another guide for one of the builds and another build has one guide back ordered.

7 minutes ago, Michigander said:

I thought I saw the plain version in a promo shot... Maybe I was mistaken. If it's only weave I will pass, lol.

 

I've got a Razor on my bench for another build. Seems pretty cool. I'm more of a skeleton seat guy though.

 

The difference between the Blade & Razor is the Razor is exposed on both sides of the blank, while the Blade is exposed on the bottom and has a thin piece of carbon on top that the reel sits on that the Razor doesn't. With the reel on, they look about the same, but the Razor lets the reels sit directly on the blank.

[Michigander]

10 minutes ago, kayaking_kev said:

They're very smooth, even the Matte pattern ones are smooth, you can't feel any pattern on them. You would probably have to whack them pretty good to get them to crack, but it is a minor concern.

 

I did a lot of research on them before buying them and couldn't find anyone who owned them and didn't like them, I just can't wait to fish them and see for myself, but I had to order another guide for one of the builds and another build has one guide back ordered.

 

The difference between the Blade & Razor is the Razor is exposed on both sides of the blank, while the Blade is exposed on the bottom and has a thin piece of carbon on top that the reel sits on that the Razor doesn't. With the reel on, they look about the same, but the Razor lets the reels sit directly on the blank.

Oh, that's cool. Didn't know that about the Razor. Haven't put it on the blank yet as I'm still waiting on components.

 

Do you think it needs an insert or can the blank just be "floating" in the exposed section?

[Michigander]

Just called AT and they said Tsuka is only 3k, so that's the end of that.

 

They also advised me to use an insert for the Razor.

[kayaking_kev]

3 minutes ago, Michigander said:

Oh, that's cool. Didn't know that about the Razor. Haven't put it on the blank yet as I'm still waiting on components.

 

Do you think it needs an insert or can the blank just be "floating" in the exposed section?

Some have said they didn't need the insert on certain X-Ray blanks. All 3 AT seats I have were too loose not to have something though. There would of been too big of a gap in the exposed section that would cause a lot of play & flex in the reel. The AERO seat I got though isn't exposed, so I'm just going to arbor that.

 

I used a G2 insert on two of them and one I used a Carbon Fiber Rod Skin with some finish on top to make the seat fit and I put the seam facing up so it wouldn't be exposed. But, considering the CF Skin cost the same as the insert and was more work, I would just get the insert if I did it over again.

 

I've also had someone tell me and show me a pic of the CFX insert working with the AT reel seats as well, but can't confirm.

[Michigander]

36 minutes ago, kayaking_kev said:

Some have said they didn't need the insert on certain X-Ray blanks. All 3 AT seats I have were too loose not to have something though. There would of been too big of a gap in the exposed section that would cause a lot of play & flex in the reel. The AERO seat I got though isn't exposed, so I'm just going to arbor that.

 

I used a G2 insert on two of them and one I used a Carbon Fiber Rod Skin with some finish on top to make the seat fit and I put the seam facing up so it wouldn't be exposed. But, considering the CF Skin cost the same as the insert and was more work, I would just get the insert if I did it over again.

 

I've also had someone tell me and show me a pic of the CFX insert working with the AT reel seats as well, but can't confirm.

I think the insert will be just fine. I'm a new builder so assembling premade parts is more my speed than coming up with new and unique solutions, lol. AT said that they use the Fuji inserts as well without issue.

[kayaking_kev]

7 minutes ago, Michigander said:

I think the insert will be just fine. I'm a new builder so assembling premade parts is more my speed than coming up with new and unique solutions, lol. AT said that they use the Fuji inserts as well without issue.

Those 4 builds in my pic are my 1st builds ever also. I think one of the big reasons to build some custom rods was because I also wanted to try the G2 Handles. I was originally going to put them on all 4.

 

[Michigander]

Just now, kayaking_kev said:

Those 4 builds in my pic are my 1st builds ever also. I think one of the big reasons to build some custom rods was because I also wanted to try the G2 Handles. I was originally going to put them on all 4.

 

You're going to have some nice rods! The carbon life is also drawing me in. I want Winn on my moving bait rods but something extra fancy on my bottom contact rods.

 

My push to do it was that my taste in nice rods is exceeding my budget, lol. Plus, I'm so picky about components that I'll never find perfect for me rods on the shelf. If reel building was a thing, I would probably be in for that too.

[Delaware Valley Tackle]

The G2 are not polished smooth as PVC.  They’re selling a ton of them and I haven’t heard anything negative as far as slipperiness. 

[Westcoast]

I like the ease of the carbon handles. My favourite is the nfc one. It has a slightly softer grip and grippier feel to it. But looks very similar to the American Tackle one. I’ve used the cfx on a couple rods but to me it just has an unfinished look to it. So now I’m in the process of trying an epoxy coating on one to see how that feels. My go to real seats now days are the AT ccf seats with the razor being my preferred. 

[Michigander]

1 hour ago, Delaware Valley Tackle said:

The G2 are not polished smooth as PVC.  They’re selling a ton of them and I haven’t heard anything negative as far as slipperiness. 

Ok, great. I was hoping for a bit more textured than glass, lol. Yes, after the black friday sales, I'm having a hard time finding them in stock. Thankfully I have a while to gather components.

 

Not sure how many you've built for customers, but have you been hearing that they are preferred over more traditional grips?

57 minutes ago, Westcoast said:

I like the ease of the carbon handles. My favourite is the nfc one. It has a slightly softer grip and grippier feel to it. But looks very similar to the American Tackle one. I’ve used the cfx on a couple rods but to me it just has an unfinished look to it. So now I’m in the process of trying an epoxy coating on one to see how that feels. My go to real seats now days are the AT ccf seats with the razor being my preferred. 

I had a similar feeling about the CFX ones based on the pictures. I almost pulled the trigger on the NFC ones but wanted to see if I could find plain ones which the Bushido ended up being. I also like the convenience of having a system of compatible parts to just assemble the handle area with.

[kayaking_kev]

6 hours ago, Michigander said:

You're going to have some nice rods! The carbon life is also drawing me in. I want Winn on my moving bait rods but something extra fancy on my bottom contact rods.

 

My push to do it was that my taste in nice rods is exceeding my budget, lol. Plus, I'm so picky about components that I'll never find perfect for me rods on the shelf. If reel building was a thing, I would probably be in for that too.

I still have a Conquest 843c and Xtasy 723c and they are close to perfect, but I wanted to try to take the best attributes of both and then add a carbon handle. I also wanted that added feeling of accomplishment of having caught a fish with a rod that I put together myself.

[spoonplugger1]

We've been using graphite tube grips for 20 years or better. Best thing there is in a rod holder for getting it in and out, all my kayak rods also have them, not the slightest bit interested in any interferences, or snag ups in a kayak. Salmon and steelhead anglers like them a lot, #1 by a large margin, no one is blowing them up.

[Michigander]

9 hours ago, kayaking_kev said:

I still have a Conquest 843c and Xtasy 723c and they are close to perfect, but I wanted to try to take the best attributes of both and then add a carbon handle. I also wanted that added feeling of accomplishment of having caught a fish with a rod that I put together myself.

Those rods are too rich for my blood, lol. But I think I can build similar for much less which I am totally in to!

 

I get a lot of satisfaction catching fish on jigs that I tied myself, so I am also looking forward to catching with rods I built. It's a great feeling. I love the DIY lifestyle.

 

 

 

 

7 minutes ago, spoonplugger1 said:

We've been using graphite tube grips for 20 years or better. Best thing there is in a rod holder for getting it in and out, all my kayak rods also have them, not the slightest bit interested in any interferences, or snag ups in a kayak. Salmon and steelhead anglers like them a lot, #1 by a large margin, no one is blowing them up.

That's great information! Agree, no snaggy bits on the kayak! You have enough to deal with without getting your gear hung up on your rig/self.

[Michigander]

Called Mudhole again and it looks like I am in luck. The PAC Bay Minima skeleton seats mate up to the G2 grips perfectly!

 

I like the feel of the Minima seats and it is nice that they have all the ID sizes to get within half a millimeter of your blank size.